Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

74bayliner

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Oh don thank you, I will give them a call, yeah they are about 15 minutes or so from my house, that would save quite a bit on freight. Thanks for the advice..
 

74bayliner

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

scratch that.. they are really close to my work... i work at boeing in everett. so they are just down the road a ways!!! awesome
 

74bayliner

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Yeah they quoted a pretty competitive price compared to the Prop Shop in Florida. Obviously because of shipping charges... So i would give this recommendation to anyone who was thinking about going out and buying a new prop (which is what i was gonna do...) than i came across this thread and i saved myself from paying way to much for a new one, when they can rebuild it perfectly and make it new :)

Thanks NetDoc and Don... Very helpful info in this thread.
 

NetDoc

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

The community to the rescue! :D
 

SteveMcD

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Thank your lucky stars that didn't happen in the water. That's what ended my boating season last year. Apparently at WOT it draws more air than water. My engine overheated in a minute, made the gawdawfullest sounds I ever heard an engine make, and it shut down. It restarted after about five minutes and sounded like hell. Below 1000 rpm it would stall, and over 1200 rpm it got worse. Six miles later, she made it back to the dock on five cylinders and 10 psi of oil pressure, but normal temperature and under her own power. That was my most flawless docking ever. If anyone's curious, remanning a gm 350 including .030" boring is running about $2500, and a dynamic test for $400 at a Portland OR shop. Your location may vary. If anyone else out there has one of these, I cannot urge you strongly enough to check it.
 

NetDoc

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

My mamma always said: "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure!". For that part of the repair, I think I spent about $40 in parts, so mamma was way off! :D That ounce of prevention was worth several pounds of cure. It's always best to catch things before they catch you!

I was noticing that after I had run the boat for about an hour, I had a problem getting her to idle. It appeared that I had a fuel problem. When I first got the boat, the engine compartment looked like this:

NetDocsBoat-31.jpg

You can see the electric fuel pump is simply buried under the distributor where the mechanical pump used to live and one of the wires' insulation has cracked. In case of any leakage, it would be spraying fuel right into the distributor! Oh my, that does not look safe! My first refinement was to mount the fuel pump on the back of the engine on one of the bell housing bolts and secure the fuel line to the side, away from that fan belt. The old fuel line was stiff and cracking and NOT Coastie approved. I replaced the portion between the fuel/water separator using 5/16" approved line and added a clear inline filter just before the carb.

As I said, I was still noticing a fuel problem. The fuel pump was a long way from the fuel tanks and it was clicking in a manner that made me feel it was not getting fuel. I added a bypass switch (momentary, normally off) that I could send fuel to the carburetor without the engine running. But really, I had no idea if the filter was clogged or not: it was trial and error with a lot of priming. Finally, the tank selector switch was under a small hatch and was not secured at all. It flopped all over the place. I didn't like it.

My solution was to mount the pump and the switch on a small plastic board and mount that securely in the hatch. There's no guessing if you are pulling from the fore or aft tank now and the connection between the pump and switch is absolutely SOLID. I replaced the remaining decrepit old lines (which were 1/4") and fittings so that everything in the fuel system was standard. I also added a fuel pressure gauge on the output side of the fuel/water separator so I could better monitor the flow through the filter with less guessing. I want to test the aft tank, it's a removable one with a clip on fitting (like for an outboard). Any one know how to pressure test this? I don't want to put in a leaky fuel tank, but I don't want to spend $150 replacing it either! Here is how it looks now:

P1160122.JPG


Tank switch and pump assembly.

P1160124.JPG


Fuel/water separator with gauge.

P1160126.JPG


Engine compartment overview

You can see from the last picture, that you can easily access most everything in the engine compartment. I really cleaned it up and got rid of a lot of extraneous crap. My last issue with the engine is the rough water pump and how to tighten the belt. It's not a very rigid system, and I get a howling out of the v-belt when I exceed 4,000 rpm on the water and 3,000 rpm when I have water supplied by the hose.
 

NetDoc

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Before I forget, a special thanks to Gary at the NAPA store next door, 99256 Overseas Hwy for helping me to plumb this out. If you ever need boat parts quick in the Keys, they do an awesome job of getting you back in the water!
 

sqbtr

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Net Doc, not to be a stick in the mud, but, it appears that filter is downstream of the pump and that glass in line filter and press gauge are a no no.

Just don't want anybody to go BOOM on the water.
 

NetDoc

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

If I am doing something stupid, I want to know.

You are correct in all that you said. It's a see through filter, the fuel filter is down stream and I have a pressure gauge. Can you (or someone else) explain why these are bad?

BTW, there is another fuel filter in the carb bowl.
 

Bondo

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

If I am doing something stupid, I want to know.

You are correct in all that you said. It's a see through filter, the fuel filter is down stream and I have a pressure gauge. Can you (or someone else) explain why these are bad?


BTW, there is another fuel filter in the carb bowl.

Ayuh,... It looks pretty good, but I agree with the faults found,...

The clear filter ain't C/G approved, 'n is nothin' but a Leak point....
The canister filter, belongs Before the fuel pump, not downstream, which makes yer pressure gauge a Non-issue...
The filter, Before the fuel pump, saves the fuel pump....
Fuel pumps don't like water either...
 

Don S

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

The water separating fuel filters were never designed to be on the pressure side of the system, only the suction side.
The problem with the clear filters, is they don't pass the fire tests the CG has on items in the engine compartment.
Your fuel pump is also not marine rated. While not against any safety rules, teflon tape on fuel system fittings is against good practice. Gasket sealer works great.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Make sure you fuel pump is wired through an oil pressure switch so it isn't powered when there is no oil pressure.
 

NetDoc

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Make sure you fuel pump is wired through an oil pressure switch so it isn't powered when there is no oil pressure.
It is and has been. I do have a momentary (normally off) bypass switch in the engine compartment for convenience.

OK, on researching this, I see where the filters that have the plastic drain bowl attached are CLEARLY labeled to be used on the suction side of the fuel pump. I don't see that warning in any literature for this solid metal canister style and they are rated to 60 psi. I have asked the manufacturer of one for some clarification and will hopefully get it soon.

Can someone explain the hazard presented by the pressure gauge?

As for the glass/metal filter: a number of boat supply companies sell the one I am using. Yes, I know that this does not make it right but I have to wonder why. Looky => http://www.iboats.com/Seasense-In-L...61285623--**********.658524223--view_id.56073 At this point, I don't have the fuel filter attached to either the engine or the firewall, but I am not sure that I even need it now that I have the problem resolved. If I decide to keep it, I'll be sure to attach it to the engine or the compartment wall.

I respect all of those who answered here, and I hope that my continued research into this is not seen as arrogance or indifference to your advice. In actuality, I am trying to fully comprehend it so that I don't make mistakes that will put me or my passengers in jeopardy.
 

Don S

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

OK, on researching this, I see where the filters that have the plastic drain bowl attached are CLEARLY labeled to be used on the suction side of the fuel pump. I don't see that warning in any literature for this solid metal canister style and they are rated to 60 psi. I have asked the manufacturer of one for some clarification and will hopefully get it soon.

Filters are put between the tank and the fuel pump. It's just how things are done. Here is a picture from the CG and ABYC handbook showing a typical fuel system. Note where the filter is at. It's just how things are done in the past 40 or 50 years. Kind of like the auto owners manual not telling you it's not a good idea to get out of the car at freeway speeds.

fuel system.jpg


As for the glass/metal filter: a number of boat supply companies sell the one I am using. Yes, I know that this does not make it right but I have to wonder why.
Outboards use filters like that under the cowl, hanging off the back of the boat, not inside the boat in an enclosed area.

I am trying to fully comprehend it so that I don't make mistakes that will put me or my passengers in jeopardy.

You haven't researched properly yet, or you would understand.
Check out this site, and you will find where I got the picture from.

http://www.uscgboating.org/regulations/boatbuilder_s_handbook/downloads.aspx
 

PiratePast40

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Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

A filter is typically on the suction side of a fan or pump. If it was on the discharge (high pressure) side, a filter or seal leak would result in the fluid, in this case gasoline, spraying out under pressure. At least that's the way we design it for radioactive material :).
 

billbayliner

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Jun 30, 2006
Messages
553
Re: Volvo 200 outdrive water intake issue...

Net Doc, a couple of things that I noticed in addition to what others have said.

Teflon Tape..... this should not be used on fuel system fitting threads.

The pressure gauge won't be of any value to you. If a vacuum gauge was in place, and if on the pump side of the fuel filter, it would tell you if the filter media was becoming compromised. You'd need a base-line reading with a fresh cartridge, and then monitor from that point. Unnecessary and over-kill, however!

Net Doc, the filter with the bowl that you mention is probably a Racor. Also available thru GLM and Sierra now days.
As said the plastic viewable bowl is for O/B 's only. The I/B or I/O version requires the all metal bowl.
Great filters by the way and they don't rely on paper element saturation. They are a more true water separating filter. There will be a cartridge and bowl retro-fit that will work with your filter base. You just need to know which threads yours has.

Regarding the fuel pump momentary switch... normally this is done with a circuit that is integral with the starter motor solenoid circuit. While in start mode, this overrides the N/O oil pressure switch until the engine fires up and pressure comes up. As long as this is momentary, I think you're OK.

As you may know by now, you have a 200 drive, 280 transom shield, and an adapted Chevy 4 banger using a V-8 flywheel cover. Any parts that you need for the actual drive will need to be for a 200, not the 270 as Don mentioned.
The main drive gear seal and the male yoke will be 200 specific as these are much smaller.

From the color of the PDS housing, you have the two pc flywheel cover/adapter housing.
This will be a Borg Warner flywheel cover w/ a V/P PDS adapter housing.
Same bearings/seals work in this adapter housing as if it was the red 1 pc flywheel cover.
Earlier Don mentioned the PDS bearings. I'd also be changing these. The bummer is, with the early V-8 f/c, it's double bearing pds so the engine needs to be removed to change the two bearings and seals.

The 90 weight gear oil is not good. There will be a die-cast aluminum slinger impeller attached to the lower unit driven gear. Heavy oil can cause the impeller drive pin to shear. Not always, but it can happen. If it has sheared off, the slinger pump will not push oil to the upper gear box. This lower unit oil cools the upper gear box and gravity drains back down.
If you pull the prop shaft carrier out, you can check this and install new prop shaft seals and carrier o-rings.
 
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