5.7 gs hard starting issue.

[raceboy002]

I have a 2002 Glasstron with a Volvo Penta 5.7gs that always cranks for about 10 seconds before starting. It doesn't matter whether the engine is warm or cold and it doesn't matter if I hold the throttle at idle, mid or full. Once it starts it idles and runs well. So far I'm thinking possibly timing but more likely a carburation issue because if I'm going across the lake at plaining speed (3000RPM) and drop the throttle to idle, it dies and again has to crank for about 10 seconds to restart. It has done this since I've owned the boat. Its may also worth noting the engine was replaced at the time I bought the boat. Can anyone suggest a good place to trouble shoot? I have a timing light and a Clymer repair manual on the way.​

 

[Scott Danforth]

welcome aboard

throw the clymer manual away. not worth the paper they are printed on.

get the proper factory manual, or look here at an on-line version http://162.144.28.33/lib/library.html

as for hard starting. specifically list everything you do with your carbureted motor to start it.

agreed, the issue is most likely fuel system, and most likely dirt in the carb

 

[alldodge]

[I have a 2002 Glasstron with a Volvo Penta 5.7gs that always cranks for about 10 seconds before starting. It doesn't matter whether the engine is warm or cold and it doesn't matter if I hold the throttle at idle, mid or full. Once it starts it idles and runs well. So far I'm thinking possibly timing but more likely a carburation issue because if I'm going across the lake at plaining speed (3000RPM) and drop the throttle to idle, it dies and again has to crank for about 10 seconds to restart. It has done this since I've owned the boat. Its may also worth noting the engine was replaced at the time I bought the boat. Can anyone suggest a good place to trouble shoot? I have a timing light and a Clymer repair manual on the way.[/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR][/LEFT]

Here is a repost for the default font to make it easier to read

 

[alldodge]

Can you give the motor more throttle and does it start faster.

I'm thinking the float level is not correct, or the needle seat and valve is not closing and allowing fuel to drip into the intake when stopped.

If you pull some plugs see if they are black and or carboned up

 

[Scott Danforth]

AD, agreed that float may be impropper, however being a carb most people under 40 never had to deal with carbs.

the following is for those that need a refresher on starting carbureted motors

first full pump primes the system and sets choke. second pump may be required with cold motor. throttle half way, turn key, when motor fires - back off to 1500 RPM for a few minutes with a cold motor, then drop to idle.

warm motor should not need anything.

if the motor needs throttle to start, read the plugs (white is lean, black is rich, tan is right) if the plugs are running right, the idle circuit in the carb may be plugged.

 

[raceboy002]

Scott-
I've tried starting it different ways but they all seem the same. My starting procedure on a cold engine is just like starting a carbureted car. Put the throttle down and back up two times and start cranking. It never starts right away. Also I will get a different manual coming now.

AllDodge-
Giving it more throttle does not seem to matter. And I had wondered about float level. I have pulled the plugson the 1,3,5 &7 side, all seem a little black but all sparked well.

I did forget ask should the fuel pump should be running with "key on engine off"? My test light does not light with key in run position with the engine off it doesn't but and Evinrude mechanic suggested it may only run while cranking and running.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Scott-
I've tried starting it different ways but they all seem the same. My starting procedure on a cold engine is just like starting a carbureted car. Put the throttle down and back up two times and start cranking. It never starts right away. Also I will get a different manual coming now.

.

give it one full pump, press the throttle only button, and advance throttle to betweeb 1/3 and 1/2. Then crank

 

[alldodge]

AllDodge-
Giving it more throttle does not seem to matter. And I had wondered about float level. I have pulled the plugson the 1,3,5 &7 side, all seem a little black but all sparked well.

Your running real rich, spark is good but black is rich

I did forget ask should the fuel pump should be running with "key on engine off"? My test light does not light with key in run position with the engine off it doesn't but and Evinrude mechanic suggested it may only run while cranking and running.

The pump runs while cranking and once the motor starts and oil pressure builds up

Don't see it being a fuel pump issue, I think you need a carb rebuild

 

[raceboy002]

AllDodge- Is it possible to be rich with a dirty carb? I would have thought dirty carb could only mean lean but I'm also in that age range where carbs are few and far between so I have limited experience with them. My motocross bike carbs were a "set it and forget it". Haha

Scott - I'll try to remember to go full throttle, back, and to mid throttle next time the engine is cold to set the choke but I thought it was thermostatic if that's what its called. The spring that sets the choke position when the engine is cold.

I'll be back on the water with it Friday to look at it. Will I need to order gaskets or other parts if I'm going to open the carb up and see if anything is clogged or if the floats need to be reset?

 

[Scott Danforth]

the act of going full throttle and back allows the choke spring to close and give a shot of fuel from the accelerator pump to prime the motor

since there are no fast-idle cams on boats like there are on cars (for safety reasons), the throttle must be manually opened to about 1/3 or more.

being a VP the carb is most likely a holley. the hardest part about rebuilding a holley is removing the old gasket material (use a plastic scraper) and cleaning the passages (use fine copper wire or fishing line)

if the power valve circuit is dirty or the power valve diaphragm is ruptured, it will make it run rich.

 

[alldodge]

Running rich can be done by the power valve or the carb leaking fuel because the float bowl is over filling

 

[raceboy002]

Well I got to the lake and tinkered with the carb for a while. There was absolutley no dirt or debris that I could see but I still blasted every port that I could find multiple times with carb cleaner. I did find that the float wasn't set properly. It was overfilling. I adjusted it according to the cylmer manual and it does start better but still not perfect. I never left the dock with it tonight so I will take it out on the water tomorrow and see how it does and let you guys know. Thanks for your help so far!

 

[simcole]

Please update us when you get back. I may have a similar issue.

 

[raceboy002]

I got to the boat today and I think adjusting the float seems to have made a huge difference. I warmed it up to full temp, turned it off and when I restarted it, it fired right up. I let it sit off for abut 5 minutes and without giving it any throttle it fired up again with no hesitation. Perfect! I also turned up the idle so it idles at abot 800 rpm to. It was idling around 600. Thanks guys.

 

[jimmbo]

Idle should be about 550 - 600 in gear

 

[raceboy002]

I have a new problem with it now that is probably related to the old one. Now if the boat sits for even a minute it has gone back to needing to crank for 10 seconds before starting but if I turn it off and imediately restart it, it starts with no hesitation. I believe the carb is loosing all of its fuel while it sits for that minute. Sounds goofy but here is my reason for thinking that... I punctured my accelerator pump diaphram and had to get a new one and when I took off the bottom bolts of the float bowl no gas drained out like it used to. I'll try to find a check valve to put in the line tomorrow and see what that does but till then does anyone have other ideas or suggestions?

 

[alldodge]

Post 15 said it was running good and could be fired up after sitting for 5 minutes. Now its back to what it was if not worst.

Did you get back in the carb or was the pump damaged during previous rebuild?

In any case, if the carb is draining fuel out while sitting, you need to get back into the carb

 

[jimmbo]

It’s difficult, if not impossible, for a Holley to drain its fuel bowl into the engine when not running. If it were leaking out the bowl gaskets, your boat would have blown up by now.
Have you inspected the fuel system all the way back to the pickup in the tank, the anti syphon valve, water separator/filter, fuel pump, filter in the fuel bowl inlet.
Is the choke opening fully? Perhaps it is set too rich and even the slightest bit of no heat from the heat element causes it to close too soon.

I have the same engine and it too on hot days does the I-don’t-want-to-restart routine, and as it gets on plane dies. I have always fugured it was due to the poor excuse of the ethanol loaded crap sold as gasoline either vapour locking or percolating. After a couple of restarts it planes fine.

 

[raceboy002]

AllDodge - I did have to reopen the float bowl to replace the accelerator pump diaphragm which I somehow managed to put a pinhole in but if I changed anything when I did that it was on accident and I have no idea what it was that I changed.

Jimmbo - I now think I was wrong in suggesting that the fuel was siphoning or draining out of the carb bowl. I went back to it after being away overnight and pulled out one of the bottom carb bowl bolts and plenty of fuel emptied out.

A lot of you are suggesting that I am running rich and I think your all right. I went to start it today and when the engine was cold it fired right up. I let it warm up and then sit for 5 minutes and it went back to cranking for 10 seconds before starting. That to me sounds like something that would happen in a rich carb. It starts better when its cold than when its warm. There are two screws on the side of the carb that I turned in and counted the number of turns it took and put them back to their original position. I don't remember how many turns it was anymore but I know they were not equal on each side. My Clymer manual does not say how many turns they should have so does anyone else know? I also wondered if it needs to be jetted for my elevation but I cant find any info on what size jet I should start with at my elevation (2200ft.) It currently has 69H jets in it

 

[criscolumbus]

AllDodge - I did have to reopen the float bowl to replace the accelerator pump diaphragm which I somehow managed to put a pinhole in but if I changed anything when I did that it was on accident and I have no idea what it was that I changed.

Jimmbo - I now think I was wrong in suggesting that the fuel was siphoning or draining out of the carb bowl. I went back to it after being away overnight and pulled out one of the bottom carb bowl bolts and plenty of fuel emptied out.

A lot of you are suggesting that I am running rich and I think your all right. I went to start it today and when the engine was cold it fired right up. I let it warm up and then sit for 5 minutes and it went back to cranking for 10 seconds before starting. That to me sounds like something that would happen in a rich carb. It starts better when its cold than when its warm. There are two screws on the side of the carb that I turned in and counted the number of turns it took and put them back to their original position. I don't remember how many turns it was anymore but I know they were not equal on each side. My Clymer manual does not say how many turns they should have so does anyone else know? I also wondered if it needs to be jetted for my elevation but I cant find any info on what size jet I should start with at my elevation (2200ft.) It currently has 69H jets in it

Re-jetting should only adjust the mixture at WOT.

Have you double checked to make sure the choke is opening when the engine has warmed up? it should have a coil on the side of the choke plate with some adjustments to set how much choke is needed at various engine temperatures.

http://162.144.28.33/lib/volvo/manuals/ef_fuel_elect.html#/130