Curiosity Finally Gets the Best of Me!

Texasmark

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Things are quiet so let's post something. I've noticed over the years that OMC engines get half again more postings as Mercury. Question I have been asking myself was, is that because of more problems, or more units in the field? Now I ask your opinion.
 

racerone

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I think there are more older Johnson / Evinrude motors out there.------In my opinion most were well built.----Easy to repair.-----Most parts are available.-------Few of the new motors are cheap and easy to repair.
 

Chris1956

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Gulp, another OMC vs Mercury debate.

Not sure your observations about post numbers is a definitive analysis of motor quality.

OMC is out of business. We do see a few BRP e-TECs here, but not many. Mercury and Yamaha currently dominate the market, in 4 cycle motors. Not many Optimax motors. Not sure I ever saw a Yamaha DI motor.
 

racerone

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There are more older Johnson / Evinrudes out there than older Mercury motors.-------Parts are easier to find / get for them.------In one city I know there was 1 Mercury dealer and 3 OMC dealers.-----The OMC motors were well built in the 50's / 60's and folks ask for help fixing them.
 

GA_Boater

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The Merc owners all have factory service manuals? Just a shot in the dark. LOL

Really, probably not easily explained why except maybe more old Mercs are parted out for NLA parts reducing the numbers. :noidea:
 

racerone

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Maybe those carbon steel drive and propshafts have something to do with it too.-----People work on 50's and 60's OMC product because they sold a lot of them.------Many parts for these early motors are cheaper and easier to find that some recent products.-----So folks work on them and ask questions too.
 

jimmbo

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The greater number of posts on the E/J forum is no indication that they need more repairs than Merc. OMC produced more outbounds than Mercury so there are more of them to repair/still running.

Older OMC engines were quite easy to work on when it came to setting the timing and adjusting the sync between carb and spark, no special Tools or Timing Light required.
Older Mercs in comparison, usually were more complicated when it came to tuning
 

Faztbullet

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Johnrudes had a 12 year headstart and more was produced. Also was stangled during war time....

"Observing the success of his two major clients, Kiekhaefer decided it was time to market his own line of outboards, and so, the “Mercury” brand was born.

Unfortunately, shortly after its introduction, World War II broke out. The United States was now embroiled in a battle with Germany, Italy and Japan, and as a result, stiff government restrictions were imposed on raw materials — the most important of which was aluminum, the primary material used in producing outboard motors.

Aluminum was also critical to aircraft production, which became an immediate priority. Although Kiekhaefer petitioned the State Department to lift the restrictions, his appeals were denied. The company’s future was in peril. Meanwhile, Evinrude (Kiekhaefer’s chief rival) had won its petition and was granted access to ample stocks of aluminum. That was salt in the wound for Kiekhaefer.

Eventually salvation came in the way of government contracts. Small businesses across the country were enlisted to build machinery and arms for various branches of the military. Mercury’s role was to produce small engines for chainsaws, generators and drone aircraft. Interestingly, the drone engines were constructed from the same power-heads used to build outboards."
 

matt167

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Johnson had a rock solid product, but they were bleeding from bad management and run into bankruptcy. Ficht didn't help
 

82rude

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Up into the mid 90,s OMC sold more motors than all other mfg,s combined! matt 167 dont forget about the epa declaring omc plant a superfund site too.
 

Grub54891

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Yup there are a lot of them out there. Similar to mercruisers, one guy asked me if they were reliable, as he sees so many in the shop. Yes you will, as there are so many, things wear out, bellows and such. They are reliable if they are maintained. Same as any motor.
 

JimS123

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Back in the '50's and '60's in my neighborhood, you saw a JohnnyRude on most every dock. The only guys running Mercs were the ones with "speed boats". My mechanic happily worked on OMC's but turned up his nose at Mercs because they (in his words) had to be tweaked too much. Also, at that time we had 1 single Merc dealer in town and 7 or 8 OMCs.

Now, that same mechanic is an authorized Mercury dealer. By my count, 12 Merc dealers in town, and only 1 Bombardier, 1 Honda and 1 Tohatsu.

The 4-stroke EFI era changed everything.
 

racerone

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Sales / marketing etc was different 50 / 60 years ago.-----You were a JOHNSON dealer and that was it.-------No other brands allowed.------Now the dealer where I worked sells ----Evinrude / Mercury / Honda / Yamaha and the Johnson brand is not marketed at this time.------Marketing is different today.
 

Texasmark

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Maybe those carbon steel drive and propshafts have something to do with it too.-----People work on 50's and 60's OMC product because they sold a lot of them.------Many parts for these early motors are cheaper and easier to find that some recent products.-----So folks work on them and ask questions too.

Gonna tell you, the minute I saw that LU sitting in a vise I absolutely couldn't believe my eyes. That was my first glimpse of Merc "innards" and I wasn't running one at the time, had never had one apart,nearest thing was my 1955ish Wizard 25 which I bought new and had zero problems so no reason to tear into it and see the rusted shaft. I can't imagine being a Mercury mechanic working salt water engines before they went to SS like OMC had been using for years...decades???
 

Texasmark

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The greater number of posts on the E/J forum is no indication that they need more repairs than Merc. OMC produced more outbounds than Mercury so there are more of them to repair/still running.

Older OMC engines were quite easy to work on when it came to setting the timing and adjusting the sync between carb and spark, no special Tools or Timing Light required.
Older Mercs in comparison, usually were more complicated when it came to tuning

Originally being an OMC fan, the thing I didn't like about them in the early days was the lower unit shape and in particular the PIA gasket on the bottom cover to main casting seal. And then there was the sneezing, and getting the carb low and high speed jet adjusted correctly.
 

Texasmark

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Johnrudes had a 12 year headstart and more was produced. Also was stangled during war time....

"Observing the success of his two major clients, Kiekhaefer decided it was time to market his own line of outboards, and so, the “Mercury” brand was born.

Unfortunately, shortly after its introduction, World War II broke out. The United States was now embroiled in a battle with Germany, Italy and Japan, and as a result, stiff government restrictions were imposed on raw materials — the most important of which was aluminum, the primary material used in producing outboard motors.

Aluminum was also critical to aircraft production, which became an immediate priority. Although Kiekhaefer petitioned the State Department to lift the restrictions, his appeals were denied. The company’s future was in peril. Meanwhile, Evinrude (Kiekhaefer’s chief rival) had won its petition and was granted access to ample stocks of aluminum. That was salt in the wound for Kiekhaefer.

Eventually salvation came in the way of government contracts. Small businesses across the country were enlisted to build machinery and arms for various branches of the military. Mercury’s role was to produce small engines for chainsaws, generators and drone aircraft. Interestingly, the drone engines were constructed from the same power-heads used to build outboards."

We have 2 senators from every state and 475ish representatives. That's about 600 folks to be "wooed". I understand WDC has 40,000 lobbyists. Don't suppose OMC had more/better/or had them at all as compared to Carl do you? Grin.

Going to bet some of the materials (QC rejected castings would be an honorable source) used in those drones made it's way (on a sideline venture) exploring the adaptation to marine use in satisfying Carl's curiosity and intent to build (and race) marine engines.
 
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racerone

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But the EARLY 2 piece JOHNSON / EVINRUDE gearcases were ultra precision made ! -------Say on a 1968 model 40 HP you could install new gears and bearings without needing special tools or time to shim the gears.-------Many folks do NOT see that concept .-----Just my opinion I guess.
 

jimmbo

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The 1st State of the Art Gearcase OMC made, would have been the 1968 55hp. I came from an OMC family, where Mercs were looked down on, and referred to as 'Screaming Mercs". So when I bought an Inline 6 in 84, I was a Heretic. But I found it to be a very good engine. In Hindsight, Mercury did have some much more advanced engineering(gearcases and props) than OMC during the 60s, by 1970 OMC caught up, but when the V6s were introduced, Mercury once again pulled ahead.

I do concur with Racer about the OMC Cases were able to be slapped together without shimming. But the Hydrodynamics weren't the best, especially the design they used on the V4s from 1960 thru 1968, the100 HP excluded
 

racerone

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But folks look at the pointy gearcase and think-----" that must be fast "-------Nature will fool you and as you said the pointy lower unit was NOT faster.-----The 100 HP model 66 / 67 / 68 electramatic was big / round nosed and FASTER.
 

jimmbo

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We had the 1965 90HP with the Pointy Nose on a 16 ft Evinrude Boat, the 1966-68 100HP on the same boat was faster by more than the expected 2 mph. That bigger Blunt Nosed case with the much larger Dia Prop did have Lower Drag, and provided a marked improvement in Acceleration as well
 
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