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just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing :(

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  • #16
    Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

    Originally posted by achris View Post
    Find a cheap replacement block and be done with it... I would be very suspicious of the seller. I would seriously doubt his story that he didn't know. That patch looks too fresh....

    Chris....
    If the seller owns his own performance marine shop he had to know it was there if he didn't put it there him self just to get rid of it. You're not looking at a 5 year old patch, thats fairly new. Of course he's going to say weld it. Thats a temporary fix to get you out of his hair. I would call him and very nicely but firmly ask him how he would like you to return it since he "didn't know it was there in the first place" he certainly can't expect you to keep it. Worst case if you get stuck with it... as Chris suggested just get another block and call it a day. That block looks like it is toast. If you want reliable you really don't have a choice. Sorry you have to go through this. The seller sounds like a real shm#$k!!

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    • #17
      Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

      Ayuh,.... I agree with those sayin' Return it....

      While weldin' the block is possible, that's a really, Really bad spot....
      That's where the head bolts provide their clampin' force to hold the head on...

      Even bein' a well versed, experienced Welder,...
      I wouldn't waste my time messin' with that 1,...

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      • #18
        Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

        Bah, horse puckey. He knew about that JB Weld.

        the guy owns his own performance marine/ classic car rebuilding shop,
        Ship it back for a full refund.

        If it were off craigslist from an average joe that might be a little different.
        1983 26' Starcraft Sportfisherman 261V Rebuild
        1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild - SOLD
        1984 16.5' Sea Nymph Ski Sport Rebuild
        1980 16' Sea Nymph SS 165 Rebuild (swapped)
        1968 15' Starcraft Jet Star Rebuild (sold)

        115' of Beach on Lake Huron

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        • #19
          Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

          The guy owns a performance marine shop and the only way he could test run the engine was dumping gas in the carb? It takes 2min to rig up a gas can to feed the fuel pump. He didn't want to run it up to temp because he knew about that crack. Get a refund, if he will, though I doubt it. Might help to find a laywer to write him a nastygram if he wont take it back. No way would I trust that engine on Lake Michigan.

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          • #20
            Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

            Originally posted by matt167 View Post
            A nickel weld done correctly will hold, but it's tricky with cast iron. Normally you preheat to 400* then weld, and then bring it back up to 400* and reduce the temp over a length of time. Good luck finding an oven that can fit a BBC. It can be done, normally not worth it, but if the seller insists on a nickle weld over a refund for $2k, then take it to someone who is confidant in welding a Flathead Ford V8 block and make seller pay, as they are welded all the time, but usually with some form of pre heat and then holding temps over a period of time and it takes skill.
            Matt knows what he's talking about. But to preheat the block you have to strip it right down including the cam bearings. If you were going to do that , you might as well get a used automotive block and build it into a rebuilt marine engine.
            "Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional."

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            • #21
              Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

              Just a thought..that Bravo drive..if it is in good conditon is worth more than 2350...more like 3500.Going offshore with anything other than a solid engine is crazy..Reman's are about 2500.
              Stickly a opinion your mileage may vary.

              Horsepower is how quickly you can get to the wall
              Torque is how far you move the wall"

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              • #22
                Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                The fact is you paid for something that you did not get. . . regardless of how to remedy the situation.

                In what manner was the engine advertised/offered? i.e. any disclosure or representation of its condition ?
                Best regards, Ted . . . . Cape Cod, MA

                Current Boats: Formula 330 Sun Sport, O'Day Mariner Sail #3224, Sunfish
                Past Boats: Catalina 22 Sail #10531, Formula 242 Sun Sport
                Twin Mercruiser 7.4 LX MPI (0F802036, 039), Bravo 3's (0F806198, 199), Mercury 7.5 HP (1969), Johnson 4.5 HP (1980)

                My Boating Web Pages: http://www.tpenfield.com

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                • #23
                  Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                  I'd go with the majority here, that's a lot of money for a junk block and parts. I'd return it for a full refund.
                  I could understand if it was a $350 junkyard motor, not a $2350 marine engine sold as a good solid engine, which it is definitely not.
                  My opinion is that by the time you get finished messing around with this, you'll have just as much in it, if not more, than a reman from a repudiable engine builder. I'd also question whether he knew about the crack or not.
                  Sorry you got screwed, I hope you get it worked out.

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                  • #24
                    Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                    If I ended up with that POS engine it would already be strapped to a pallet and on it's way back to the seller along with a nice "note" from my lawyer. Man, You really need to look over the next one you find with a fine tooth comb after this mess.

                    LK

                    1997 Sea Ray Sundancer 250 5.7EFI / BIII

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                    • #25
                      Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                      Welding is a crap shoot, you must pre-heat and then the crack will propagate you will need to chase the crack peen the areas near and in front of the weld and yet cracks will still develope and run. Then with the differential in heat expansion there will after time be cracks and separation between the nickel weld and the parent material. You will never know the extent of the cracks as to the internal regions water jackets and such. As mentioned earlier on the 454 has particular valve angles and if frozen could also have cracks between the valve seats. Some aircraft engine jugs are bad for that too. Big block 454 is a particular engine I think a great one but to have a cracked block and to fix is a lost cause welding could will take hours and end up with leaks. Send it back as the guy must have known and get another one then chalk one up for life.

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                      • #26
                        Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                        Sounds crappy...if a refund was forthcoming it would have been offered by now. A lawyer letter might make him change his mind but not likely; he knows that if you pursue him, your lawyer bill will be as much as the engine was worth.

                        One approach, since he did offer the nickle welding, is to get him to send you the cash for the weld including the disassembly and reassembly labour cost (this would be necessary as you couldn't weld on an assembled block). My guess you'll get a fair bit of the initial cost back on this "refund", then find a donor block and swap over the components; you'll get a fairly massive boat anchor in the process as well. You will be out of pocket but far less than trying to ship it back and get a refund...it ain't Walmart.

                        Good luck
                        Zeke

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                        • #27
                          Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                          How was it paid for? (Hopefully credit card)
                          2001 Crestliner SuperHawk 1800, Mercruiser 140HP
                          2007 Tracker 1436 jon boat, 7.5HP Force

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                          • #28
                            Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                            Originally posted by fishrdan View Post
                            How was it paid for? (Hopefully credit card)
                            I'm guessing cash?

                            LK

                            1997 Sea Ray Sundancer 250 5.7EFI / BIII

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                            • #29
                              Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                              Originally posted by big zeke View Post
                              One approach, since he did offer the nickle welding, is to get him to send you the cash for the weld including the disassembly and reassembly labour cost (this would be necessary as you couldn't weld on an assembled block). My guess you'll get a fair bit of the initial cost back on this "refund", then find a donor block and swap over the components; you'll get a fairly massive boat anchor in the process as well. You will be out of pocket but far less than trying to ship it back and get a refund...it ain't Walmart.
                              If you go with Zeke's sugestion, don't forget to use marine frost plugs if you'r running an opencooling system.
                              "Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional."

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                              • #30
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                                Re: just bought a used 454, got home to find a failing jb-weld patch failing

                                Now, this is just my opinon, to start, it doesn't look to be a marine block to start with. the freeze plugs are rusty, so i would think there not brass, a marine bock would have had brass plugs in it. I think hes blowing smoke up your a*ss, saying he didnt know it was there, when your guy seen it right away. I would ask for a full refund, and if he doesnt want to pay, then you will have to take other action.
                                1987 16Ft F/S Yar-Craft
                                1987, 90HP Johnson/ (3) 1971-1972, 7.5HP Merc/ 1991, 4HP Mariner/1985, 2.2HP Merc (new never started)

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