96 Evinrude 200 Pinched Stator Orange Wire...

[structural1]

Those readings on the charge coils were with no DVA. I thought they were too low as well based on the trouble shooting guide you pointed me to and your comments. But I pull it on both pairs 4 times and came up with roughly the same reading. I left the pair connected to the pack and used piercing probes. was I suppossed to disconnect the pack before testing output? Does that make a difference? I tried the DVA adapter on the Orange/Orange Black pair on the Power Coil after getting 46 volts with no DVA. With the DVA and meter still set on 200 I only registered 3.5 volts. So I figured something had to up with the DVA adapter I bought and didn't use the adapter for the Brown Pairs. 46 V without DVA and 3.5 V with DVA sounds crazy on the Power Coil test right?

But even if the 120 V on charge coils is legit.... that only charges the battery right. It shouldn't affect the cranking correct? Thanks so much for the offer on the loaner Pack. But, I wanted to pick up a spare pack anyway. So I'll go ahead and pick one up. Even if it turns out its not the pack I'd like to have a back up.
The pack on it is a CDI 113-6212. I believe the OMC pack part # for a 96 looper 200 is 586-212. Can someone confirm that please?

I of course will keep this post updated on if that solves the problem.

 

[daselbee]

I tried the DVA adapter on the Orange/Orange Black pair on the Power Coil after getting 46 volts with no DVA. With the DVA and meter still set on 200 I only registered 3.5 volts. So I figured something had to up with the DVA adapter I bought and didn't use the adapter for the Brown Pairs. 46 V without DVA and 3.5 V with DVA sounds crazy on the Power Coil test right?

Yep crazy....but you have to change the meter to read DCV when using the DVA adapter. I suspect that may be your issue there.

But even if the 120 V on charge coils is legit.... that only charges the battery right. It shouldn't affect the cranking correct? Thanks so much for the offer on the loaner Pack. But, I wanted to pick up a spare pack anyway. So I'll go ahead and pick one up. Even if it turns out its not the pack I'd like to have a back up.
The pack on it is a CDI 113-6212. I believe the OMC pack part # for a 96 looper 200 is 586-212. Can someone confirm that please?

No...got a misconception going on.....the name "charge coils" is confusing. In this case, the "charge coils" charge up the capacitors which are internal to the powerpack, therefore the term CDI, or Capacitive Discharge Ignition...which is the type of ignition system used here.

They DO NOT charge the battery. The battery charging is done by a series of coils arranged around the stator, with very large diameter wire, the output of these coils is on the yellow pair which feed the reg/rect directly. Batt charging is simple...two yellows feed reg/rect, output of reg/rect charges the battery on the large red wire.

The ignition system is independent of the batt charging system, except the various coils for both systems all reside on the stator.

The correct part number for the powerpack is 113-6212 for the CDI brand unit. New OMC number is 0586661.

 

[structural1]

Goodness I had what the "charge coil" does all wrong in my head. I also didn't realize you had to switch to DC on the meter when using the DVA. I know now. I have a new Power Pack coming (wanted to pick one up anyway)... But with only 120 Volts out of the Charge Coil Brown Pairs... I am wondering if the stator is the real cause. If 120 is way too low... it may not be enough to fire the pack right. But as you said whats the chance that both charge coils went bad and are both reading 120? Pretty low... I will throw the pack on there and if still no luck... Stator it is.....

 

[daselbee]

Might want to read those brown pairs again with the DVA set up properly with the voltmeter. I would like to know the reading difference....
120VAC vs. ?????v DVA.

 

[structural1]

Got the new Pack today and have my Saturday morning marked off to recheck the Brown pairs with DVA (set 200 on DCV). Will let you know I see.

 

[structural1]

Ok Saturday is here and I finally got time to work on the boat. Got the new Power Pack installed and it made no difference. Tested the stator output on Orange Pair and the Brown pairs using the DVA correctly (with meter switched to DC). Here is what I got. Orange pair was 42 VAC with no DVA and 62 VDC with DVA. Brown pairs were 115 and 120 VAC with no DVA and 141 and 151 VDC with DVA. From what Dasel said and the troubleshooting guide on CDI website that seems too low to charge the pack and fire. Inspecting the underside of the Flywheel with it still on doesn't show and loose magnets. Stator doesn't appear to be burnt out. With what I see so far, and Dasel please correct me I am going down the wrong path..... seems like the stator charge coils are not putting out what they should and next step needs to be replace stator and test out on brown pairs to see if output is above needed 170 with DVA. Sound like the correct path?

 

[structural1]

Also wanted to add. Spark is weak and intermittent on all cylinders but appears stronger on right back. Will occassionally jump 1/8" gap on the tester on all 3 right bank cylinders. On left back... will jump 1/16" gap on tester on 2 cylinders and usually won't fire on one cylinder. Oddly the Brown Pair that feeds the right back is the pair that tested about 10 Volts higher (at 151). The pair that tested at 141 volts feeds the left back that has "weaker" fire. That seems to make sense if 150 is the minimum range. Also seems to point to the stator being bad. I found a few CDI stators shipped for $250. What do you think Dasel? Time for a new stator?

 

[daselbee]

well i am not hitting on all six on this particular thread. not too helpful, i think.
i just cannot forsee an problem where both charge cois woud fail in a very very similar fashion.

but for sure the dva voltages are too low on the charge coils.

 

[structural1]

I've got a New Old Stock OEM Stator coming. Gonna throw it on this weekend and see what I get. Here is what I am guessing happened with the former owner. The stator probably started to go bad...and one day the engine would not crank. One of his friends probably told him to replace the Pack. So he trys to change the pack himself. While changing the pack he pinches the orange wire and it grounds to the stud. Engine still would not crank so former owner got frustrated and the boat sat. When I look at the pack it looks brand new... I bet my real problem is the stator. I bet the piched wire I found going to the pack was the former owner's attempt to fix the unknown no start situation. I hope i am right. I will post this weekend and let you know if the problem is solved.

 

[structural1]

Problem solved. Thanks for all your help guys. I installed the new stator.. and was worried at first when she would not kick over.... But after 2 or 3 cycles of 6 to 8 second cranking she kicked off and cranked right up...... She smoked like a beast for 45 seconds... then the smoke cleared up..... I've had it on the hose 4 or 5 times since then and she hardly smokes at all. Its fresh gas (running off of 3 gallon portable tank) and I rebuilt the carbs... So I would assume the smoke was the oil and built up crap in the cylinders and exhaust from sitting. The boat had sat for 4 years so I guess that is to be expected. It is still cold natured but will kick right off after warmed. Idles fine..... haven't had it on the water yet as it has been on the cold side for my liking in North Carolina but in the next month or so I plan on dumping it in the lake, tieing off to the dock, and decarbing...

Here is what was happening... If you read through the post I had very weak and random spark. I bought the boat from a guy that had gotten sick and let it sit for 4 years. He had said it ran fine before he got sick.... I now doubt that. She would spin over but not kick off. Power Pack looked brand new. Pulled power pack and saw pinched Orange wire that was grounded to the mounting stud. Wires looked brand new like someone installed the pick and got sloppy and pinched the wire. I figured the pack shorted. Order new pack and installed. Still would not kick off... Readings from Stator were borderline... Ordered new stator and installed and it kicked off. So I assummed former owner had problems running or starting and the stator was going bad... But someone told him "change the pack" so he ordered a new pack and tried to install himself...and in doing that pinched the orange wire. Still would not start so he let it sit. So chances are I did not need the new pack and now I have a spare. Lesson learned.

 

[daselbee]

Well I am glad you are fixed up.
The way I see it, you had two problems. One induced short on the orange pair, and a weak stator on the brown pairs.
But, the two coils, power coil (orange) and charge coils (brown) are separate circuits.

The shorted orange wire led you to look there, when the real problem was low voltage on the browns.

Also, note that your shorted orange wire caused no damage to the pack, OR to the stator. You had DVA voltage, if I remember, on the orange pair.