Chrysler 65hp model: 659H8B with MAG II System

[FT III]

Hello Folks,
I know for a fact that there will always be issues with older models and some lack of parts.
I'm a sport-fisherman located at the border with El Paso, TX with no experience with motors but willing to learn.
(Please notice that English is not my first lenaguage).

I have bought a 1978 Chrsyler 65hp motor model 659H8B with MAG II System and I have reading about some issues with ignition and how some motors ended up with Prestolite System.

Before I go any further, I want to share what is going on and then I can start doing the proper diagnostics.
The motor comes with controls, the ignition harness with the key and the sterring cables.

I conected the batery and the motor does not crank at all.
I notice that the harness that goes from the motor to the key does not have the black wire conected.
When I conected the black wire, the "Circuit RESET Braker" was engaged.
Then I looked into the harness and noticed that there is no identification to conect the black wire which is "ground".

The other day I tried the starter by using a "dual-purpose" exide batery and it seems to me that:
a) batery is not strong enough to move the starter continuosly.
b) There is something preventing the motor to run.
c) There is something wrong with the starter.

So, I don't want to jump into conclusions and I decided to open this thread as per one of the moderators in this forum.

All information is very appreciated.

Thanks in advanced,
Francisco Torres.

 

[kbh121956]

First with the hood off, can you rotate the flywheel by hand clockwise? you should be able to turn it over by hand. Second, with a fully charged good battery hooked up, jump the (starter solenoid) from big red wire (positive) to the small yellow wire on the solenoid. It should turn over. Borrow the battery from your car if you have no way of telling if the battery that you're using isn't good. Let us know what happens and we'll go from there.

 

[kbh121956]

Are you sure that the "H" isn't a B in your model number? All that I can find is a model number 659B8B which would make it a 1978 year. You have it as 659H8B.

 

[FT III]

First with the hood off, can you rotate the flywheel by hand clockwise? you should be able to turn it over by hand. Second, with a fully charged good battery hooked up, jump the (starter solenoid) from big red wire (positive) to the small yellow wire on the solenoid. It should turn over. Borrow the battery from your car if you have no way of telling if the battery that you're using isn't good. Let us know what happens and we'll go from there.

1) I was able to rotate the flywheel. Did the same thing with a smaller motor that I have to have the same feeling when rotating the flywheel. Looks OK.

2) I did the jump with the red and yellow wires by using my car's batery. The starter engages and tries to move the flywheel, however it does not move the flywheel continuosly; It moves a little bit and stops, then when I use the wires again it moves a little more and stops. Sometimes the starter's bendix does not comeback completely to the bottom and sometimes I can hear a "tic-tic-tic" inside.

I'm uploading a video on YouTube so I can share the starter's behavior.
When is ready I wiill share the link.

Thanks!
Francisco Torres

 

[FT III]

Are you sure that the "H" isn't a B in your model number? All that I can find is a model number 659B8B which would make it a 1978 year. You have it as 659H8B.

I'm attching a picture of the plate from the motor.

Here is the link of the video about the starter :
https://youtu.be/8XtIGdyVUWI

 

[jerryjerry05]

The slow turning sounds like a weak starter or low compression.
Take the plugs out and jump the solenoid and see if it turns over?
Yes? do a compression test.

No? then clean the starter and try again.

No? try taking the lower unit off, Sometimes then bearings seize and make it hard to turn over??

I'd try to do a compression and spark test and see if the motors worth working on?

The Prestolite change over can be done.
The block needs some modification but it can be done.

 

[Nordin]

Agree with Jerry, check the starter it sounds like it is bad.
Also check the starter solenoid if you not jump start direct to the starter positive terminal.
Check the grounding too.

659B8B ..... the first B tells you it is made in Barrie. 659H8B.... the H tells you it is made in Hartford.
That is the only different.

I have had three of these typ of engines. Two 60Hp and one 65Hp.
I still have the 65Hp and one 60Hp. Just love them, 818cc displacement and a lot of torque.

BTW. CDI Electronics and Outboard ignition have the troubleshoot guide for this ignition system.

Source for parts, I would suggest Franz Marine.

 

[FT III]

Hello there!
Well, I decided to test the starter off the motor.
Here is the link: https://youtu.be/xy1FjtMQKMs

I see that is working...
Tomorrow I'm gonna try the lower unit option and see how it goes.

One thing that I notice:
Having the batery connected, motor in neutral, then the key swith on and doing the jumo between the red and yellow wire; I can hear a small click and the starter moves just a bit, if I do that again nothing happens.

I think the ignition switch is not working or there is something wrong with the selenoid

Regards,
Francisco Torres

 

[Nordin]

Running the starter off the engine does not give you the answer if it is good or not.
With it off the engine there is no load and it will run and look good.

Disassemble it and check the brushes, the commutator and clean it, Check the bushings for to much play.

The solenoid might be the issue.
Try to run the starter on the engine by jumping it with power direct to the starter terminal and not through the solenoid..

 

[jerryjerry05]

If you jump the solenoid and it clicks and the starter turns just a bit??
That sounds like the starters full of gunk/rust and needs to be cleaned.
Or the solenoids bad.
Or the compression is off.
Pull the starter apart FIRST.
Do as Nordin suggested and jump straight from the battery.
Then change the solenoid.

Pull the plugs and see if it turns over then.

 

[FT III]

Running the starter off the engine does not give you the answer if it is good or not.
With it off the engine there is no load and it will run and look good.

Disassemble it and check the brushes, the commutator and clean it, Check the bushings for to much play.

The solenoid might be the issue.
Try to run the starter on the engine by jumping it with power direct to the starter terminal and not through the solenoid..

All right, I'm gonna give it a try on that strategy and let you guys know the outcome.

Thanks!
Francisco Torres

 

[FT III]

Hello Folks,
Here is the motor running:
https://youtu.be/9aup9sjiPB4

What we've found is that the motor was not in neutral and thus there was not power going in to the system.

Thanks a bunch for all youur inputs!
Now I'm getting ready for my fishing and drinking weekend.

Regards,
FT III

 

[kbh121956]

FT III, I didn't see any water coming out of the engine. Very short video! Always either have muffs on the outboard or better yet a barrel. It only takes seconds to burn up a water impeller. Have fun and good luck.

 

[jerryjerry05]

The DWI on the water affects your driving record.
Be careful and get a sober skipper.

I used to drink with the guy who got the first DWI on the water in Maryland.1989 or so.

He decided to go out on the Chesapeake bay in a small boat with his wife and NEW baby.
There were almost small craft warnings that day.
He was drunk and INSISTED that "I know what I'm doing"
LMTFA. were his words(leavemethef%$#alone)

He almost sank the boat and was towed in by the police.

Cost him 10K

 

[FT III]

FT III, I didn't see any water coming out of the engine. Very short video! Always either have muffs on the outboard or better yet a barrel. It only takes seconds to burn up a water impeller. Have fun and good luck.

Hello there,
the short video was just to show the motor is running.
And... talking about the water and the impeller, I tried with a container of water and did not work, but when I used the hose conected with a muff, the water started to come out from the engine.
That is the reason why the video was for 4 senconds running the motor with no water.

Thanks a bunch!
FT III

 

[FT III]

The DWI on the water affects your driving record.
Be careful and get a sober skipper.

I used to drink with the guy who got the first DWI on the water in Maryland.1989 or so.

He decided to go out on the Chesapeake bay in a small boat with his wife and NEW baby.
There were almost small craft warnings that day.
He was drunk and INSISTED that "I know what I'm doing"
LMTFA. were his words(leavemethef%$#alone)

He almost sank the boat and was towed in by the police.

Cost him 10K

Jerry,
I think I need to change my words as I can see that it may send the wrong impression.
I live in Mexico and I use the phrase "fishing and drinking" when it comes to my weekends with my son and friends doing what I like the most: fishing.
That phrase comes from my Uncle Nelson that passed away some years ago. He liked to say that all the time when he was getting closer to retirement. He was my Only Gringo uncle and a very nice person. I miss him so much.

I do not drink and drive, never ever, not on the streets nor in water. And, going into the water is a big responsibility.
I always have my beers when is suitable, a nice barbecue and a nice cup of coffee at sunrise; and I know that if I want to keep of enjoying life I must be cautious.

As a matter fact on my last fishing trip, I notice a piece of Sh%^&t doing erratic moves on a boat full of people including small kids and we went to warn him. Next thing I see, people on the water.
There were like 4 available boats to make the rescue and get people out of the water.
Man! I was ready to beat the Sh%^&t of him!
Anyway, nobody was hurt and it was not far from the shore and I hope he learned his lesson.


I want to thank you for your advice and sharing your experiences with me. I appreciate that very much Sir.
Regards,
FT III