Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

[sqbtr]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Thought about the white illumination after my last post. Just power the illumination circuit on the nav switch only to the ign sw. Any time you have the key on the sw will illuminate white. Power all other illumination lights off the nav sw, since that is the one you will need to see.

I'll draw up a diagram of the dual feed circuit for seperate nav anchor circuits, no diode needed.

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Thanks Todd4! No confusion here... well kinda but i just skipped the "that wont work part" and it flowed nicely.

That's what I am trying to do is get a handle on it before I undertake the task. Please take ur time with posts as i know how managing work and iBoats can be I am revising the original schematic and stopped when i got to the switches due to ur explanation which was different from the wrong way i was thinking. Ill post it here in case it will help ya out. Just know that the switches are not complete.

NOT A COMPLETE DIAGRAM JUST MY REVISION TO DATE WITH A MORE REALISTIC LAY OUT AS IT WILL BE ONCE INSTALLED

 

[Todd4]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Hey, sqbtr, hooking up the DPDT lights to the ignition switch is a good idea, but only if he has an accessory position (like most cars do)or he'll only have lights to any of his switches when the ignition switch is left on (and engine electronics are charged up, constantly using power). I'd be interested in seeing the two battery source to the DPDT poles without a diode to prevent backfeeding through the wires. I'm not saying it can't be done, I just don't have my head around it.

Piece, the following comments are refering to the 2nd drawing in your Post # 356. I'll look at Post # 362 later.

Judging by the way you have it wired, I assume you’ll use your battery selector to select your house battery when floating with the lights on and also use the battery selector to turn off the entire FUSE BLOCK = all lights (switch lights, NAV, STERN, etc) and disable both SPSTs, when parked on the trailer.

As drawn, when you turn on your DPDT to NAV (BOW & STERN), assuming you have a battery selected to the FUSE BLOCK, you ‘ll make both SPST switches glow red or white, depending on their position = OK. But your DPDT will never glow white, nor will your DPDT glow red when switched to the ANCHOR position. Also when the DPDT is in the ANCHOR position (only the STERN is lit) you’ll have no lights to the SPST switches, but they will still operate the BILGE and INTERIOR lights.

Let's assume a battery is selected to the FUSE BLOCK: To make the DPDT glow white in the center lever position, and make the DPST glow red when NAV is selcted (like it does now), and make the DPDT glow red when ANCHOR is selected, and make the SPST1 & SPST2 lights glow ONLY when the DPDT light glows red (either NAV or ANCHOR is selected), but the SPSTs not glow when the DPDT is white, change the following (I'm using clock positions again):

Remove the jumper wire between the 10:30 DPDT to 12:00 DPDT terminals. Replace with a 9:00 DPDT to 12:00 DPDT jumper wire. (Now DPDT will glow red/white/red, depending on lever position, whenever the FUSE BLOCK is powered by the BATTERY SELECTOR.)
Remove both 12:00 DPDT wires going to SPST1 & SPDT2, from the 12:00 DPDT side only, and reconnect them to the 1:30 DPDT location, with the other wire ends still attached to same SPST1 & SPST2 locations. (Now SPST1 & SPST2 will glow when DPDT is red, lever either up or down, and the SPSTs will not glow when DPDT is white, center position, when NAV and ANCHOR are off during the day, but SPSTs will still power their accessories during the day).

Is this the operation you are looking for?

You’ll still have to rotate the NAV/ANCHOR nameplate 180 degress, OR (my preference) rotate the DPDT switch 180 degrees (during dash install) because when you flip the DPDT lever UP the switch connects the center power to the LOWER terminals, and when you flip the DPDT lever DOWN it connects the center power to the UPPER terminals. (It’s easier to rotate something than redraw all the wires like I incorrectly tried in my long post above.) (Most double throw switches work this way).

This is not easy to put into words, so ask a question if something isn’t clear.

Todd

 

[Todd4]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Just looked at your Post #362. It will be easier to make my recommended changes to your Post #356 drawing and then transfer it to your Post #362 drawing (which I like the layout of better). Or wait and see what sqbtr comes up with. Allways good to have choices. Just don't wire anything untill you have it all down correctly on paper, first.

BTW - yes you can 'daisy chain' all your ground wires as long as the single ground going back to your battery is large enough to handle the capacity. A ground terminal block is usually used for that type of application though. Each ground wire is screwed to the terminal under your dash and one ground wire goes back to your battery, but you are kinda using your fuse block that way already, so if your fuse block is under your dash (close), no need for another grounding block, just connect all your grounds through it. Do NOT ground through your boat hull (like a car grounds through it's frame) - it could promote corrosion of your hull.

Todd

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

First off i just want to thank you again for looking through this I know its prob a pain in the arse but i do appreciate you and sqbtr! Thank you!

Judging by the way you have it wired, I assume you’ll use your battery selector to select your house battery when floating with the lights on and also use the battery selector to turn off the entire FUSE BLOCK = all lights (switch lights, NAV, STERN, etc) and disable both SPSTs, when parked on the trailer.

I had planned on adding a master power switch to the feeds going to the fuse block to kill fuse block power just in case the battery switch becomes neglected one late evening. There are a total of 4 of those switches as well... just put two in the drawing for time sake. They will operated the following: Bilge, Nav/Anchor, Interior lights, Master power. Then I also have a MOM ON-OFF-MOM ON that came with my CMC PT-130 TnT which I haven't even started to look into yet. Wanted to master the switches first.

As drawn, when you turn on your DPDT to NAV (BOW & STERN), assuming you have a battery selected to the FUSE BLOCK, you ‘ll make both SPST switches glow red or white, depending on their position = OK. But your DPDT will never glow white, nor will your DPDT glow red when switched to the ANCHOR position. Also when the DPDT is in the ANCHOR position (only the STERN is lit) you’ll have no lights to the SPST switches, but they will still operate the BILGE and INTERIOR lights.

My goal is to have all switches glow when NAV (both bow and stern lit) is on but when in ANCHOR ( just stern lit) i just want the DPDT switch to glow red with all other switches not glowing white or red. This will be the same operation as with the tach. Glowing when NAV lights on but in ANCHOR no glow. That way there is no draw on the battery (from the switch illumination that is) when anchored but have lights when underway at night.

Let's assume a battery is selected to the FUSE BLOCK: To make the DPDT glow white in the center lever position, and make the DPST glow red when NAV is selcted (like it does now), and make the DPDT glow red when ANCHOR is selected, and make the SPST1 & SPST2 lights glow ONLY when the DPDT light glows red (either NAV or ANCHOR is selected), but the SPSTs not glow when the DPDT is white, change the following (I'm using clock positions again):

Remove the jumper wire between the 10:30 DPDT to 12:00 DPDT terminals. Replace with a 9:00 DPDT to 12:00 DPDT jumper wire. (Now DPDT will glow red/white/red, depending on lever position, whenever the FUSE BLOCK is powered by the BATTERY SELECTOR.)
Remove both 12:00 DPDT wires going to SPST1 & SPDT2, from the 12:00 DPDT side only, and reconnect them to the 1:30 DPDT location, with the other wire ends still attached to same SPST1 & SPST2 locations. (Now SPST1 & SPST2 will glow when DPDT is red, lever either up or down, and the SPSTs will not glow when DPDT is white, center position, when NAV and ANCHOR are off during the day, but SPSTs will still power their accessories during the day).

Is this the operation you are looking for?

This is almost perfect for what im looking for! Thanks! The only little detail i would change is to have no switches glow in ANCHOR position except the red tip of the DPDT. Is this possible? and i guess it may not be a little detail.

You’ll still have to rotate the NAV/ANCHOR nameplate 180 degress, OR (my preference) rotate the DPDT switch 180 degrees (during dash install) because when you flip the DPDT lever UP the switch connects the center power to the LOWER terminals, and when you flip the DPDT lever DOWN it connects the center power to the UPPER terminals. (It’s easier to rotate something than redraw all the wires like I incorrectly tried in my long post above.) (Most double throw switches work this way).

This is not easy to put into words, so ask a question if something isn’t clear.

I actually don't have a name plate yet soo Im good with whatever. Ill just label it after i wire it and see what works when i throw the switch. You are doing an amazing job explaining this. I honestly can't thank you enough. Let me know if ya need more details. I tried to break it all down in this post. Hope its a great thursday for ya!

Mark

 

[Todd4]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

"This is almost perfect for what im looking for! Thanks! The only little detail i would change is to have no switches glow in ANCHOR position except the red tip of the DPDT. Is this possible? and i guess it may not be a little detail."

Ahhhh, I see what you're going for. I like it.
OK then, do everything I said in Post #363 (referring to 2nd drawing in Post #356), EXCEPT:

CHANGE THIS - Remove both 12:00 DPDT wires going to SPST1 & SPST2, from the 12:00 DPDT side only, and reconnect them to the 1:30 DPDT location, with the other wire ends still attached to same SPST1 & SPST2 locations.

TO THIS - Remove both 12:00 DPDT wires going to SPST1 & SPST2, from the 12:00 DPDT side only, and reconnect them to the 10:30 DPDT location, with the other wire ends still attached to same SPST1 & SPST2 locations.

Now your SPSTs will only glow while the DPDT is in NAV, but the SPSTs will be dark when the DPDT is in ANCHOR.

Maybe I shouldn't go here, but...... as long as we're at it, you have both of these SPST wires run in parallel. You can simplify this by running just one wire in series and accomplish the same thing (since the SPST switch lights draw minimal power while glowing). i.e. run just one wire from 10:30 SPST2 to 10:30 SPST1 to 10:30 DPDT. Note I incorporated the latest change in this also.

"I actually don't have a name plate yet soo Im good with whatever."
OK - I based my comment on your "6 pole" diagram you posted earlier. I think NAV up and ANCHOR down is most intuitive.

Todd

P.S. As long as I'm giving my opinion, I'll give you another one (I know this is going to be controversial, but here goes anyway...):
Don't twist-n-tape your wires! - learn how to solder and use heat shrink tubing (it's really not that hard to do). This will save you countless hours trying to track down pesky wiring gremlins in the years to come.
OR, at least use crimp style connectors (looks like spade connectors are required to attach wires to the back of your switches).

Also, run one wire at a time and double check everything before you move on to the next wire.

Good luck - let's see her float!

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Todd you are a life saver thank you so much for your help! Much appreciated!

I planned on using spade crimp style for the wiring and one wire at a time is how it was gonna happen. Thats why im trying to make the diagram as accurate as possible so i can follow it like a map highlighting completed parts a i go. I will try to finish the overall schematic with ur changes today or tonight. Ill post this for one final confirmation.

SHE NEEDS TOO FLOAT!!!! and im determined to make it happen hopefully with in weeks but at the latest memorial day! Thank you again... hope ya dont mind if i pick your brain later if i run into any snaggs i hope

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Ok here we go! The Final Revision!! I think its complete. Will some one please look through this to make sure it correct! It has a more realistic layout as it will be in the boat but its not to scale. The wiring from the fuse block to the loads will be 14 AWG. Are the ga for the wiring i have correct. I have had two comments for the long run of wire for the motor, both 4 AWG or 2 AWG? will 4 AWG cover it? Fuse in block im guessing are dependant on load? Again please take a look and let me know what ya think



EDIT: If you click the image and then click again once iboats opens your browser should allow u to click and zoom to see more detail

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Hey Todd: On the DPDT switch is the jumper from 1:30 to 4:30 ok or does that need to be switched to the 10:30 to 7:30 position? I switched the nav and stern light around but was unsure of the that jumper

 

[GT1000000]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Sorry to butt in Piece, but I just had to let you know that I finished reading through your restore and I am thoroughly impressed with the excellent quality of your attention to detail, craftsmanship and "stick-to-it-ivness"!!! Great Job!

Even though the custom paint work ended up in a falling out, it did turn out really cool and unique...

From what I see you are in great hands when it comes to the electrical department with 'Todd4' and 'sqbtr'...with their inputs and assist you'll be "Splashing" real soon...

Again, Grrrr-8 Job!, Ill be looking forward to the Sea Nymph getting wet...

Regards,
GT1M

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Sorry to butt in Piece, but I just had to let you know that I finished reading through your restore and I am thoroughly impressed with the excellent quality of your attention to detail, craftsmanship and "stick-to-it-ivness"!!! Great Job!

Even though the custom paint work ended up in a falling out, it did turn out really cool and unique...

From what I see you are in great hands when it comes to the electrical department with 'Todd4' and 'sqbtr'...with their inputs and assist you'll be "Splashing" real soon...

Again, Grrrr-8 Job!, Ill be looking forward to the Sea Nymph getting wet...

Regards,
GT1M

You're not butting in at all GT no apology needed. Thank you for taking the time to read through the thread. It has been three actually years of work and one year of collecting money soooo 4 years and this baby hasn't seen a drop of water besides rain.

You can thank the mother for the the detail part... she is a little bit of a perfectionist and well..., guess it rubbed off. What's sad is that I could probably take you to the boat and point out hundreds of mistakes; I understand that its was bound to happen with this being my first project ever and that anybody new to my boat will never see them but i know they're there and it drives me insane :facepalm:

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Ok i just thought of something i forgot in my diagram. Fuses near the batteries. like so


Question is do i just need one coming off each of the positive posts going to the battery switch?

Haven't received any wrath for my diagram as of yet (even from Silvertip All in good fun sir as i respect your knowledge) which I'm taking as a good sign but with it being Easter weekend I'm gonna let it simmer for a bit. Happy Easter fellow iboaters.... Please make suggestions, comment, or criticize my set up... I consider y'all my teachers plus countless hours of online reading :facepalm:

 

[GT1000000]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

but i know they're there and it drives me insane :facepalm:

Ya know, that is one of those psychologoical deformities we all suffer from...we are our own worst critic, but in the end, that is what makes us all so anal [remember, the first part of being ANALytical is to be just that...] and such perfectionists...and finally, thanks to that brain phart we all suffer from, is what makes our boats so much above and beyond what the factory ever thought they could be...Sooooo, that being said...continue to be driven insane by all the little things that didn't come out perfect and learn from them...it is the best we can do...

As someone said "Practice makes perfect" and since for most of us this is the first time going through this insane activity of restoring a boat...We haven't exactly had a lot of practice... I would have to say that all those imperfections only you can see, are totally and completely forgiven...

Carry On!


BTW, the electrics are looking much improved to my novice eye, and if you want to add an overload protection fuse at the battery, the positive terminal is enough...you don't need one on the negative...

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

I assure you, once you start using it, the mistakes will not be as bothersome.

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Ya know, that is one of those psychologoical deformities we all suffer from...we are our own worst critic, but in the end, that is what makes us all so anal [remember, the first part of being ANALytical is to be just that...] and such perfectionists...and finally, thanks to that brain phart we all suffer from, is what makes our boats so much above and beyond what the factory ever thought they could be...Sooooo, that being said...continue to be driven insane by all the little things that didn't come out perfect and learn from them...it is the best we can do...

As someone said "Practice makes perfect" and since for most of us this is the first time going through this insane activity of restoring a boat...We haven't exactly had a lot of practice... I would have to say that all those imperfections only you can see, are totally and completely forgiven...

Carry On!


BTW, the electrics are looking much improved to my novice eye, and if you want to add an overload protection fuse at the battery, the positive terminal is enough...you don't need one on the negative...

Couldn't have said it better myself! Touche!

@EZ: I can't wait for that day!! Its gonna feel great!

Hope everyone had a Happy Easter! The diagram is still open to scrutiny sooo comment away!!!

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Here is the schematic again... just moving it down the page for easier access

 

[sqbtr]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Way too small for my feeble eyes to make out any detail, but, I gotta ask, what program are you using to draw your diagrams?

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

In my browser if you click the picture after u let iboats open it.. it then can be clicked again to zoom. or just save the picture and open with MS Paint. Thats all i used to create it was paint. straight lines and imported pictures

 

[Todd4]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Hey Todd: On the DPDT switch is the jumper from 1:30 to 4:30 ok or does that need to be switched to the 10:30 to 7:30 position? I switched the nav and stern light around but was unsure of the that jumper

YIKES!

Well, you're not finished drawing yet! First, I'll assume you switched the DPDT BOW and DPDT ANCHOR light wires around on purpose: to make the switch light the NAV with the lever up, and to make the switch light the ANCHOR with the lever down. If that's what you were attempting to do, well...............ummm............ you missed the boat, so to speak. Sorry - had to. :redface:

As drawn:
With the DPDT lever up - only the BOW lights (SPSTs dark, ANCHOR dark).
With the DPDT lever down - NAV operational (BOW light and ANCHOR light on), SPSTs glow.
Not what you wanted.

OK - Let's keep using the same clock positions as we used before to reference each DPDT terminal - even though you rotated the DPDT switch in your last drawing, 90 degrees counterclockwise. I see you continued to use the same clock positions in your question above - and this will be the way the DPDT switch is actually installed in the boat - i.e. the DPDT positive terminal to the light (in the lever) is at the 12:00 o'clock position; and the DPDT negative terminal to the light (in the lever) is at the 6:00 o'clock position. (Those are the only two constant terminal wires shown in your diagram that I can reference back to - the rest you added and thus can change.)

MOVE the BOW light wire from the 4:30 DPDT terminal to the 7:30 DPDT terminal.
MOVE the STERN light wire from the 10:30 DPDT terminal to the 1:30 DPDT terminal.
MOVE the SPDT1 and SPDT2 wire from the 10:30 DPDT terminal to the 7:30 DPDT terminal.

LEAVE the two DPDT jumper wires where they are now (i.e 9:00 DPDT to 12:00 DPDT, and 1:30 DPDT to 4:30 DPDT).

I guess I should add that all the DPDT power wires are OK too:
LEAVE the FUSE BLOCK to 9:00 DPDT; and the jumper wire from 9:00 DPDT to 3:00 DPDT

That should do it - I'm officially blind! LOL
Good luck - I'll try to keep an eye on this thread.

Todd

 

[Piece715]

Re: Restoring 1986 Sea Nymph SS155 (pics)

Todd you are correct. The proverbial pooch got it on that one! :facepalm:

No need to apologize I just appreciate the help

Revised yet again... Hopefully for the last time... doubt it though :redface:

How's this



Once again Todd thank you!