66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

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North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

I ran into the same problem. On the peice with the circles cut into it there was a place on either side up front that the original peice didn't fit so they just shoved it in totally destroying the edges of the plywood???? I guess they figured it's gonna be covered so what the heck!

Any chance the stuff you're talking about is called Bituthene? It's a modified asphalt sheet that's peel and stick.
 
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sschefer

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

I ran into the same problem. On the peice with the circles cut into it there was a place on either side up front that the original peice didn't fit so they just shoved it in totally destrowing the edges of the plywood???? I guess they figured it's gonna be covered so what the heck!

Any chance the stuff you're talking about is called Bituthene? It's a modified asphalt sheet that's peel and stick.
Yep, same thing different coast and I never could remember how to spell it. They don't even call it that out here anymore. It goes by a half dozen or so different names. Still looks the same on the shelf though.

I always keep a roll of it on the truck. I've used it for dozens of different applications and it never fails me.
 

cnr2003

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Absolutely, I talked to a couple of boat builders and they advised screwing it down. I used 1-1/2 #10, 18-8 stainless truss head screws spaced 6" inches apart. I also layed Vichathane down over the aluminum stringers to give me a barrier between the wood and aluminum. Vichathane is vulcanized moisture barrier. You can get it at Home Depot. It's comes in a 6" wide roll and is normally used around house windows.
I also counter sunk the screws and sealed them over with 3M marine filler. They won't be fun to remove the next time but I don't plan on doing this again.
QUOTE]

So you screwed the aluminum cross beams to the wood and then screwed the wood down to the stringers? Did you do anything to secure the sides of the wood to the boat? I'll be doing this on my '76 Starcraft very soon, so every detail helps.
 

sschefer

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Absolutely, I talked to a couple of boat builders and they advised screwing it down. I used 1-1/2 #10, 18-8 stainless truss head screws spaced 6" inches apart. I also layed Vichathane down over the aluminum stringers to give me a barrier between the wood and aluminum. Vichathane is vulcanized moisture barrier. You can get it at Home Depot. It's comes in a 6" wide roll and is normally used around house windows.
I also counter sunk the screws and sealed them over with 3M marine filler. They won't be fun to remove the next time but I don't plan on doing this again.
QUOTE]

So you screwed the aluminum cross beams to the wood and then screwed the wood down to the stringers? Did you do anything to secure the sides of the wood to the boat? I'll be doing this on my '76 Starcraft very soon, so every detail helps.

Yes, the wood deck meets the sides and rests on the ribs. The ribs are tied into the sides with the original aluminum tabs. I used 1-1/4 x #8, 18-8 stainless to screw the wood to the ribs. If you're side trays are still on then you'll need a right angle drill to get under them.
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

SS, bituthene is a brand name and there are several other manufacturers. It's a below grade waterproofing material that's usually installed on concrete and then covered with fill. It's also marketed as ice and water shield and used on roofs to wrap behind gutters as a barrier in areas where ice build up can be a problem. We use it all the time in our business.

CNR, on the starcrafts, there's a z channel that the side panels rests on that gets fastened to the wood deck and the tray for the cubbyhole storage(I still don't know what to call that). It's about 3 or 4 inches tall and goes up behind the side panels. Like SS says, if you're not gonna remove them, then you'll have to first get the decking out, and then slide it up under the z channel.
 

sschefer

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Yep, I do too.. Here's another great use for it. Next time you build a deck, wrap the top of the joists and beams with it. When the customer puts 10,000,000 potted plants on the deck and waters with a timer the joists and beams won't rot out. The deck boards will go (even IPE) but the joists and beams will still be good.
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

SS, that's one I hadn't thought of haha

OK it?s Friday night and me being the homebody that I am, I decided to party hard and go out to the garage and apply the Gluvit to all the seams and rivets.

The plywood decking has been sanded and another coat of resin applied to the bottom so we?re gonna be re-installing the deck soon.

Here?s a shot of the resin and catalyst. This is a 5 to one mix so the boat is 22 feet, with one seam down each side and about 1.5 million rivets in the hull. I decided to basically attack the stern and everything below the waterline. Remember, this was a bone dry boat to begin with and the decision was made to go with the Gluvit as a precautionary measure. So I mixed up 8 oz of catalyst and 40 oz of resin and had about ? coffee cup left over at the end so a gallon of this stuff is enough to accomplish just about whatever anyone would want to do.
Gluvit1.jpg


The material looks sort of grey in the bucket but goes on like a milky clear. Looks just like the resin we applied to the plywood. The can says it dries clear and you can paint over it.

Basically I just slathered it on with a small brush and it self levels. The brownish stuff you see there is called Goodyear Pliobond, a liquid rubber installed when the boat was seamed originally (at least that?s what the brochure says).
Gluvit2.jpg


After it sets for a few moments you can go back and brush the pools of material over the area again and you?re basically done.
Gluvit3.jpg

Gluvit4.jpg

The can says optimum temperature is 72 degrees. It?s about 65 in the shop so we?ll give it a few days to totally cure and it?s time for new flotation and back in with the decking!!!!

Now I feel like I?m accomplishing something!
 

ezmobee

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Hey North Beach, looking good. Just something to consider if you haven't already. In that cubby storage area you mention previously on the sides, consider painting that or coating it with spray bedliner from wal-mart before you put everything back together. I didn't to it on mine and now I have a visible ratty area when everything else looks nice. I think joeyplumly did it on his.
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

EZ, that's the plan. The bedliner that is! Danged glue don't even wanna come off with the blaster:(:(
 

58hydraglide

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

North Beach,
Nice job on your project. I was very intrigued when I saw the condition of you boat (below deck) considering it's age. I have a 92 starcraft aluminum and have been into it a little bit (for rigging purposes). I liked what I saw with the lack of corrosion/rot the type of foam etc., It is just about identical to yours. Looks like when starcraft found a good thing they decided to stick with it. Keep up the good work. (kinda makes me wanna pick up one of those old Islanders!)
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

58, thanks! I'm tryin to have some fun with this thing. I've seen a couple of old islanders on Craigslist goin for fairly cheap, and kinda toyed around with the idea. But now I'm leaning towards open bow/center console. You just lose so much boat with a cabin on a 22-25 footer. They are nice boats though.
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

OK just to the East of us got a nasty snow storm yesterday and things at work got pretty much shut down. With a high around 25 and some nasty winds, I decided it was time for a trip to Home Depot to pick up the flotation and get started. I finally got my sleeves rolled up around 12:30.

The Gluvit is all set up so I can?t really put this off any longer. Here?s a shot of how I started.
Beginfloatation.jpg


This is alternating between ??, 1", and 2" Dow Foamular 250. Basically what HD stocks on the shelf. With the concave V hull, the angle was fairly steep so I needed a lot more of the 1? and ?? than the 2. So around 3:30 it was back to HD for more of the smaller stuff. When I arrived I realized I?d forgotton my wallet and the folks at the store weren?t having any of me coming back later to pay, So My wife, who thinks I?m off my knot for not buying a new boat had to drive to town with my credit cards. (more on what that will cost me later).

Here?s a shot of the finished product.
Finishedfloatation.jpg


Pretty much just building the stuff up to level at the top. Note should be made that the 1 and ? cuts really well with a razor knife. The 2 takes a keyhole saw resulting in a lot of pink beads everywhere. I did all the cutting outside and blew everything off with the hose reversed in my little shop vac. I also vacced out the boat about 50 times in an effort to keep the beads out of the bilge. The only down side to the operation was all the climbing in and out of the boat and cutting outside!

Once the flotation was finished, I got creative and lured my nephew and one of his friends over with a six pack of Bud Light. My wonderful wife went and picked that up also. (this will end up being a very expensive day) We had the bottom side double coated with resin from last week so we basically just went at it. We fastened the plywood with 3/16 aluminum rivets with a 1/2'? to 5/8? grip range. Went very smoothly.

Here?s a shot of my nephew installing the rivets and his friend supervising:D
Nefew.jpg

The rivets fasten along the edges directly into the aluminum ribs, down the center into the two aluminum stiffeners you can see in the earlier pics and at the joints into the flat 3? aluminum strips that are oriented side to side over the insulation. The 3? strips also fasten into the two center stiffiners. Once all this is fastened down the deck basically stiffens right up resulting in one heckova more sturdy deck than the 43 year old worn out deck we removed a couple of months ago.

Here?s a couple pics of the finished product.
FinishedDeck1.jpg


FinishedDeck2.jpg


We finished up right at 10 PM. If I?m not too worn out tomorrow, it?s glassin time!!!!!!
 

ezmobee

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Excellent work. I'm definitely going with the pink sheet foam for the next one I do. Mine essentially doesn't have any. When I tore up my old floor there were some sheets of regular white styrofoam under there and I just left them be. I doubt there's anywhere near enough there to do any good. Can you friggin' believe how expensive that pink foam is though? I had to buy a sheet of it for some scenery work on my train layout and was shocked at the price.
 

jcsercsa

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Man she really does look great !!!!! Keep the good work !! John
 

sschefer

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

EZ, that's the plan. The bedliner that is! Danged glue don't even wanna come off with the blaster:(:(
MEK and terry cloth rags.. Get them both at HD (don't forget your wallet). Get a respirator too if you don't have one. MEK smells nasty (high VOC) but is less volitale than Acetone. I wiped my 18' clean in a couple of hours. Soak the rag in MEK (I used a shallow metal pan) then saturate the glued area. Go over it a couple of times and the glue will soften up and come right off. This is what 3M recommends for glue removal of these types of glues.
When the rag is covered in glue, lay it out flat in a well ventelated area and it will dry solid as a rock in about 20 minutes. After that you can discard it in the trash or play frisbee. Don't let the dog eat them.

It took me a gallon of MEK and a dozen rags to do my entire hull.
I also wore a pair of canvas gloves over a pair of rubber gloves and they held up for the entire job.
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

SS, thanks for the tip. I saw you post this approach somewhere else and had planned on giving that a shot. I've used MEK before and know full well the health hazards. The glue looks just like some stuff we used in rubber roofing called bonding adhesive. In the old days, I've seen folks washing their hands with MEK-those days are long past!

On a side note. I tried going with SS screws and kept breaking them off. Once #3 broke and the drill bit got to the same size as the screw, I opted to use the rivets.

Thanks for all your help! Stick around for next weeks re-wiring fiasco:eek:
 

bear_69cuda

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

What a great thread!

Dude, I dig how you're going about it! The boat is gonna be so sweet! Love the water-jet/powder coat emblem!

Great lines, so classic! I would love to restore an old boat someday... Starcrafts are cool...
 

sschefer

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

SS, thanks for the tip. I saw you post this approach somewhere else and had planned on giving that a shot. I've used MEK before and know full well the health hazards. The glue looks just like some stuff we used in rubber roofing called bonding adhesive. In the old days, I've seen folks washing their hands with MEK-those days are long past!

On a side note. I tried going with SS screws and kept breaking them off. Once #3 broke and the drill bit got to the same size as the screw, I opted to use the rivets.

Thanks for all your help! Stick around for next weeks re-wiring fiasco:eek:

Curious about the stainless, were you using 18-8 from Fasco or Fastenal or Home depot's 18-5 there's a big difference in the amount of carbon. I break driver tips before I break screws.

Wiring, have fun... I just finsihed pulling all the wire for the bow section of mine. Stick to ABYC wiring color codes if you can but I know that sometimes it's hard to find the right color wire when you need it. One thing I found helpful is to keep a notebook and write down the colors you used, where you used it and what it will eventually do. I also put tags on both ends of the wire. I just use the a,b,c method. For instance, A is all my lighting circuits, A1 are my nav lights with A1-1 being the bow and A1-2 being the stern. A2 are my anchor lights, A3 are my curtosey lights, etc.

Later when you're all done, make clean copies of your list and stash it in several places around the boat, (up under the dash, in the rod locker, under the stern, etc.)
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

Bear, thanks! It became evident very quickly there were not going to be any of those vinyl emblems that made the 40 some year journey in salvageable condition so I went mcguyver on the problem :D

SS, of course I was tryin to get by with the Home Cheapo version! Shoulda known better and I already had the rivets so I just went with em.

OK this was kind of a tough day on the ole man?s back! I started around 12:30again. After an hour or so of tightening up some rivets from yesterday?s operation, I began sanding the plywood and the excess resin from the seams. When I brushed on the first coat of resin for the bottom side I laid the plywood on a sheet of poly. The excess resin pooled under the edges and this needed to be removed before we glassed the deck. First I tried using the little corner sander with 120 grit and it didn?t go too well.
sanding1.jpg


After a few minutes, I broke out the random orbital sander and some 100 grit and things sped up considerably. Here?s what we?re trying to get the seams to look like.
Sanding2.jpg

More on my next post (too many pictures :D)
 

North Beach

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Re: 66 Starcraft Sunchief Re-Build

My nephew didn?t have anything else to do so he came over to run the camera and hetch & fetch. We mixed up some resin and hardener after we pre cut a couple pieces of cloth and started at the bow to work towards the stern. We?re using the same medium hardener and resin we treated the bottom of the deck with. The reinforcement is 10 ounce cloth in a 38? width. I bought 40 lineal feet.

Here?s a shot of the first piece going in.
Glassin1.jpg


I?m not experienced with glassing but what I?ve read here is ?thin is better?. With this in mind, I applied the resin with a squeegee as thin as I could and set about imbedding the cloth in the resin. After the first piece it became apparent I was applying the resin too sparingly since there was a large area of the cloth that wasn?t turning translucent. This was corrected by top loading the cloth with more resin. Here?s what the sheet looked before we added more resin to the top.
Glassin2.jpg


The next piece went much better after adjusting the amount of resin applied directly to the plywood. I can?t really say how much-you just have to experiment a little and figure it out as you go. Here?s a couple more shots of the stuff going in.
Glassin5.jpg

Glassin6.jpg


And finally here?s a pic of the finished product. After it cures I?ll trim the excess cloth.
Glassin7.jpg


We finally finished around 7 PM. I used one gallon of resin and ? gallon of hardener total between two coats on the underside and today?s operation.

Now I have a couple of questions and general statements for all the glass experts here.
? I basically squeegeed the resin as thin as I could while thoroughly wetting the cloth. Do I need to apply another thin coat over this once it cures?
? If yes, do I sand first?
? Will my jeans be waterproof for the next hundred years?
? Will my wife kill me if I put them in the laundry?
? My transome/gunwale height is 29? from the top of the deck. When were you gonna tell me about hanging upside down over the gunwale while I installed the last piece of cloth and squeegeed on the resin????
 
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