1961 Owens Sea Raider Skiff hull questions.

[Keyboardman]

Hi guys, I'm looking at this old Owen for sale. https://wilmington.craigslist.org/boa/d/burgaw-1961-owens-25-foot-and-trailer/6804630744.html I've had wood boats many years ago but they were planked hulls. This one is 1/2" "Philippine Mahogany". It seems solid all around. My question is how strong is just 1/2" ply? What should I look for when inspecting it again? Is a little water constantly in the bilge something that will just rot out the wood from the inside? Overall the boat is in great shape for it's age. Thanks.

 

[Bayou Dave]

For a boat like that the person to answer most questions is Ned L

 

[sphelps]

She sure is pretty !
I think most boats like this do leak a bit . Hopefully Ned will chime in .. He’s our resident go to guy on wooden vessels ..

 

[mickyryan]

Beautiful boat, no A plywood boat is different then a planked wooden boat you most likely have a seal leak or a thru fitting leak someplace, saltwater don't usually rot a boat it pickles the wood its rainwater/freshwater that rots them, My parents owned a 30 ft broadwater plywood boat and it was dry as a desert in the Bilge., of course salt water you have other issues but that's another whole post

 

[sphelps]

I guess just the bottom is ply ? The sides look planked .

 

[Keyboardman]

Plywood hull strength?

Hi all. I'm looking into this old Owens. Any wood boat guru's out there? How tough is a wooden hull boat? Thanks https://wilmington.craigslist.org/boa/d/burgaw-1961-owens-25-foot-and-trailer/6804630744.html

 

[Grub54891]

Wood boats are durable, higher maintenance if not taken care of. Seen a few with the transom seam along the sides where it joins the sides coming apart. And one that was left with water in the bilge in storage, rotted the keel. I have an old runabout, needs refinishing and a few wood pcs replaced but all in all not bad. Mines from the 1960's. Of course the wood varnish needs constant attention.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Maybe Ned L will chime in

 

[mickyryan]

I guess just the bottom is ply ? The sides look planked .

yeah it looks that way

 

[Ned L]

Hello,.... I have to do something about work getting in the way of life and boats. Lol

She is all plywood, sheet plywood bottom and plywood lapstrake sides.
Micky is pretty correct in that olywood boats certainly have a good shot at dry bilges.
I’ll try to get back in the morning with some things to look for.

 

[zool]

Ned's correct, My father owned a 60's Owens skiff back in the day. He brought it down the Hudson river to the Jersey Shore and we fished it every weekend. It was a cool boat. I remember the day we broke down, drifted onto a sand bar and were brought in after dark by the Coast Guard, I was like 10 years old. (Dad shared the 1st beer with me that night). Mom must have not been happy cuz it went on the hard after that,and I watched him cut it up with a sawzall some time later....It wasnt rotted. He kept the spoked helm wheel only.

It was built with Philippine Mahogany Ply.

 

[Ned L]

Looking at a map Burgaw NC would seem to tell me she is a salt water boat. With that in mind problems (rot) should be more of a “from the top down” sort of concern (rot doesn’t really occurred in salt water, the fungus that causes rot doesn’t grow with salt). That said, the typical rot issues would be rain water dependent (fresh water). For this I would start looking at the trunk cabin sides, the sliding window tracks and the wood around the windows, also look carefully where the wheelhouse windshield meets the cabin top and where the foreward windshield meets the foredeck.
Also check the toe rail on the foredeck and where it meets the foredeck.
Check the framing around the hatch openings in the cockpit.
I would look up at the underside of the foredeck up in the forepeak, peeling paint may indicate problems.
Then of course take a flashlight, lift any floorboards in the cabin, stick your head in the bilge and look off to each side below the cabin sole (floor).
Open and look into all cupboards and lockers

Open the engine compartment and lazarette hatch, climb down anywhere you can and look around with a flashlight to see what things look like.
Honestly some water in the bilge of a wooden boat is not unusual. I would turn on the bilge pump and pump things as dry as possible then look around everywhere, you may well be able to follow the trickle of water to its source.
one downside of being a salt water boat is that the fastenings will suffer more than if she were a fresh water boat. At this age she may be due for some refastening below the waterline (would use bronze wood screws). This may be the reason for water in the bilge.

as to your question about 1/2” plywood being heavy enough,...... Honestly, Owen’s of that era were lightly built boats that were entry level boats. She is not a boat that you would want to take offshore fishing out at the canyons.
She is however still a survivor and a nice little cruiser that is basic enough and light enough on systems that she would be manageable for someone who wanted that type of boat.

 

[Keyboardman]

Thanks for the replies guys! I really want to save this old girl. The owner says it's been out of the water for about a year. He says it will leak in just a couple of small spots for a little while until it swells then stays fairly dry except he lets the stuffing box drip just so he knows it's not too tight? I'm nuts about not having any water in my bilge. Something to really worry about? The engine is a true reman Marine 305 with only 50 hrs on it. I've seen the receipts from the local marine mechanic who did the install. The oil is clear as can be and she purrs like a kitten. The owner says it lags a bit on acceleration because there is no angle compensation adapter for the carb. He has one but it's for a Holley Carb and this engine has a Rochester on it. Something to worry about? The flywheel forward 305 is a unique set up for sure! It comes with an extra waterpump and prop which is a great plus. The bad is the topside needs to have whatever crap membrane and paint someone had put on it removed and repaired as it's all cracked and peeling. There are two small rotting spots on the side of the superstructure wood that can be easily repaired and one in the stern at the drain in the transom. The really scary part is the trailer. It's a home made thing with rollers under the keel and built in jack stands to support the sides. Not very user friendly. I can't see me spending 30 mins getting this boat on the trailer undamaged when there's a dozen guys at the ramp waiting! LOL!! Can I get a float on trailer for this boat or is the hull not made to be trailered very often? I need to trailer any boat I have as slips are not available here easily. Thanks for helping me out with this one!

 

[sphelps]

Well with it out of the water you can do a good inspection of the hull . Maybe you could modify the trailer to make it more user friendly... Follow Ned’s advise and get a good look at her .. Saving these old boats is a very cool thing to do in my opinion.. If you do pull the trigger please post your work here so we can see the progress and follow along !

 

[mickyryan]

To Quote Ned:as to your question about 1/2” plywood being heavy enough,...... Honestly, Owen’s of that era were lightly built boats that were entry level boats. She is not a boat that you would want to take offshore fishing out at the canyons.
She is however still a survivor and a nice little cruiser that is basic enough and light enough on systems that she would be manageable for someone who wanted that type of boat.

Imho plywood boats are great bay boats small rivers and such they were never really meant to take a hard pounding, that said would take a Owens in a heartbeat as most I ever seen were of decent craftsmanship. another thing about plywood boats were they were very light,usually we could ski off of the 30 ft broadwater with a 318 chrysler engine lol

 

[Scott Danforth]

Thanks for the replies guys! I really want to save this old girl. The owner says it's been out of the water for about a year. He says it will leak in just a couple of small spots for a little while until it swells then stays fairly dry except he lets the stuffing box drip just so he knows it's not too tight? I'm nuts about not having any water in my bilge. Something to really worry about? The engine is a true reman Marine 305 with only 50 hrs on it. I've seen the receipts from the local marine mechanic who did the install. The oil is clear as can be and she purrs like a kitten. The owner says it lags a bit on acceleration because there is no angle compensation adapter for the carb. He has one but it's for a Holley Carb and this engine has a Rochester on it. Something to worry about? The flywheel forward 305 is a unique set up for sure! It comes with an extra waterpump and prop which is a great plus. The bad is the topside needs to have whatever crap membrane and paint someone had put on it removed and repaired as it's all cracked and peeling. There are two small rotting spots on the side of the superstructure wood that can be easily repaired and one in the stern at the drain in the transom. The really scary part is the trailer. It's a home made thing with rollers under the keel and built in jack stands to support the sides. Not very user friendly. I can't see me spending 30 mins getting this boat on the trailer undamaged when there's a dozen guys at the ramp waiting! LOL!! Can I get a float on trailer for this boat or is the hull not made to be trailered very often? I need to trailer any boat I have as slips are not available here easily. Thanks for helping me out with this one!

all wood boats get water in the hull

angled spacers are cheap

the trailer is intended to be used twice a year. first to put the boat in the water in spring, then to pull the boat out in fall. this is not a trailer boat.

 

[mr 88]

We had a 1960-61 Owens 19" with a 327 or 283 in it [ memory a little foggy ] and it flew for a boat during that time period, maybe mid 50s. The gunwale wood was beautiful . The stuffing box is supposed to drip a few drops every minute while under way, so it can self lubricate the stuffing material. Shouldn't drip when not in gear. No it wasn't a rough water boat but it would still take some chop without knocking your fillings out. Brother ran over a cement pier that had got knocked over during the first year they put a ice boom on Lake Erie , so it layed on its side a couple feet under the water , I was in another boat trying to wave him off the direction the collision course he was on. It sunk in about 15 seconds. Local marina inflated some tire tubes under it a dragged it back down the Niagara River where it was fixed and put back in service. They did manage to rip up that beautiful gunwale wood I mentioned by using the eyelets when lifting it instead of a harness or at the very least lifting it a bit and let the water run out ,then lift a bit again. Anyway it is at the top of my old time favorites,mostly because no one could keep up with it at the time.

 

[Ned L]

As Scott said, this boat really is not intended as a “trailer boat”. I suppose you could, but without beating the boat to pieces from poor support you would need a Good custom built trailer that supports her with good bunks under the keel, chimes and maybe even below the engine stringers. The trailer would also need a framework to provide protection for the prop and rudder (common on inboard boat trailers).
“Flywheel forward” was the standard marine setup from the very beginning of marine engines up until the early 1970’s.

 

[Keyboardman]

Thanks for all the help on this guys! The boat weighs only 5,400 lbs. The owner had it weighed. I saw the weight tickets along with the receipts from the new engine install. Yup, the owner showed me a picture of him on water skis off the back of it! I know the trailer would have to be custom to support that particular hull. I live less than a quarter of a mile from my boat ramp so It won't even be going anywhere far or fast. I left an offer on the table for it. Citing the need for a better trailer. He knows that, he also has to get rid of it because he's leaving at the end of next month. If I get her, I'll be sure to post all that's going to go on with her. Once again, Thanks for the responses and advice. : )

 

[Theflyingengineer]

Hey Keyboardman! I found this thread while researching this very same boat! I’m in Wilmington and she caught my eye when I saw her on CL, even though I wasn’t in the market to buy right now.

I need you to buy her so I won’t be struggling with the desire to do so myself- besides, the wife already gave me “the look” when I brought it up!

My biggest concern was where to keep her- I don’t have a proper place to store her out of the weather in the yard, and slips are so rare and expensive here. Good luck if you pull the trigger! And if not? I’ll be over here convincing myself that I really don’t need another wooden boat!