Carpet Glue Not Adhearing to Spar Varnish

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Matt715

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Earlier this summer I bought a Sylvan Sport Troller that needed new carpet. Once I dug into it and had all the carpet out, I found that the old treated plywood's glue was breaking down causing a lot of the wood to become brittle. I bought all new marine plywood and using all the old pieces as templates, cut everything out. Since I'm planning on keeping this boat for the long haul, I thought it would be a good idea to seal the wood before I installed and carpeted it.

Reading all the various threads I came across the "old timers" wood sealant formula and thought I would give it a try. I sealed everything with multiple coats and allowed it to cure a minimum of one week before top coating it with a few coats of Minwax spar varnish. After a little better than a week of curing time, I riveted the floor down and started to glue the carpet in. I'm using Roberts 6030 which is a solvent based adhesive, which I've had really good luck with in the past. This time, as soon as the glue had a chance to sit on the wood, it pulled the spar varnish right up and off of the wood.

Obviously the spar didn't adhere to the plywood. What did I do wrong? Did I misunderstand the process of sealing the wood? I hate to just throw all of my weeks of work and hundreds of dollars worth of plywood on the burn pile, but it's not looking good.
 
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Woodonglass

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the OTR is primarily a wood preservative and sealant and generally is left Natural or coated with Paint. In your case the solvent based glue is "eating" and dissolving the varnish. If you're going to carpet over the Oldtimers and Spar varnsh, I'd recommend a water based carpet glue, i.e. Roberts 6700

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION
The ROBERTS 512 fl. oz. 6700 Indoor/Outdoor Carpet Adhesive and Glue is an environmentally safe, solvent-free adhesive that can be used indoors or outdoors in place of solvent-based adhesives. It is excellent for basements or the surfaces surrounding swimming pools, jacuzzis and spas.
  • Suitable for basements or the surfaces surrounding swimming pools, jacuzzis and spas
  • Solvent-free, environmentally safe, non-flammable formula
  • Cures in 3 - 5 days
  • Excellent water resistance when cured
  • Drying time requires restriction of foot traffic and moving of heavy objects for 24 hours. Do not expose to water until adhesive has completely cured (e.g. 3-5 days). Longer curing time may be required if temperature is below 65F
  • Wet adhesive can be cleaned from tools and flooring with warm, soapy water
  • Solvent free, zero VOC calculated, environmentally safe, non-flammable formula
  • Excellent grab with a strong, lomg lasting bond
  • Additional information is available under the specifications tab
  • MFG Model # : 6700-4
  • MFG Part # : 6700-4
 

Matt715

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I do have some 6700 here, but am afraid to use it because some of the reviews talk about it softening up when exposed to moisture for a long period of time, and this is going to be an outside boat.

What would have been a more appropriate sealant for use with the 6030? Should I have just left the wood bare?

Thanks
 

Woodonglass

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Don't believe everything you hear about the 6700. In almost every case of Failure, it was caused by improper installation procedures. If the temps are above 65 degrees and you follow the directions explicitly, It'll work. I use it around pool decks for 15 years and had NO ISSUES. If you don't want to use it then sand the deck with 60 grit to remove the Varnish, wipe it down with acetone, and then use WeldWood SOLVENT based Contact Cement. I guarantee it will work, and you'll never get the carpet out without ripping out the wood.
 

Matt715

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I think I'll go for the less labor intensive route and give the 6700 a try. What's the worst that will happen?

I don't want to use contact adhesive because I'm not confident enough to install the carpet by myself without being able to move it a bit.

I appreciate your help.
 

Woodonglass

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The absolute worst that MIGHT happen, would be the glue would let loose. Again, Some say they've had issues...others say they love it and would use it again. Just make sure to clean the back of the carpet and the wood really well and then apply as directed. Let cure for 5 days minimum with NO MOISTURE exposure. I'd also recommend using a roller to roll the carpet down after you get it in place.
 

Matt715

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I carpeted the top of my livewell hatch today to see how well the glue responds to the varnish... So far so good! I have a bunch of random pieces I can glue this weekend while waiting for my replacement floor piece to come in early next week.

One question though; my carpet curls up the side of my boat a few inches and is glued directly to the aluminum. The old glue is still stuck to the aluminum and is nearly impossible to remove. Do you think the 6700 will work there? Should I use the 6030 or a spray adhesive or contact glue? I'm afraid that if I put something too strong on that part and find I'm having issues with the 6700 and have to tear everything out again that I'm going to have a real problem with that part.
 

Woodonglass

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Use a R/O sander and 60 grit paper and sand the old glue as best you can to smooth it out. Then apply a LIBERAL amount of Carpet glue to fill the gaps . Then masking tape the carpet to the sides when you install until the glue dries
 

Matt715

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Woodonglass, I appreciate all of the help and information you've been giving me. You've been VERY helpful!

How "dry" does 6700 get? It looks like it's curing, but slowly. It's been taking about 48 hours to grab and then it changes to a light brown color (daytime temps in the 70s and little to moderate humidity). Once it turns light brown it still stays very pliable and tacky. Some of the pieces have been curing for about a week now. I don't want to start installing the pieces if the glue hasn't cured enough, causing problems down the road.
 

Woodonglass

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With temps in the 70's and High Humidity it should cure in 72 hours.

Installation
Materials and area temperature must be between 65–95°F with a maximum RH of 65% for 48 hours before and during installation as well as for 72 hours afterward. Large temperature or humidity increases or decreases can affect the flooring and performance of the installation. Lift a corner periodically to ensure 100% coverage of adhesive to the flooring backing and the substrate to ensure a void free bond. Spread adhesive uniformly. Adhesive ridges should be of sufficient height to achieve full coverage of the substrate and the deepest recesses in the back of the flooring material. Place flooring into the adhesive while the adhesive is still fresh. The amount of time in which you have to place the flooring will vary with temperature and humidity.

Curing

High temperature and low humidity will cause the adhesive to cure faster. After installation, restrict foot traffic and moving of heavy objects for 24–48 hours to allow adhesive to cure properly. Premature traffic can cause installation failure.
 

Matt715

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Thanks.. How about the pliability and tackiness of it; does it stay that way?
 

Woodonglass

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It won't get totally "HARD" for several weeks but it should be well adhered and not able to move the carpet around.
 

Lowlysubaruguy

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68575C43-FC82-4F73-B23C-6376AFAAA337.jpeg5BDC0FC8-7891-4134-BA88-0A58D9FAA8CB.jpeg1733BEE6-6511-4326-920D-3126B80935CF.jpeg59C5BC55-E1ED-44C0-939D-9341FCEA8E96.jpeg I had to scrape the carpet and adhesive from mine nothing would touch it. I think i aged a little in that part of the revival.
 

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Matt715

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Wow! That does look like to took a bit of work, but it looks great. I don't feel so bad about how my project is going. What did you use to glue the floor down?
 
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