Four Winns 170 Horizon question

The 170 horizon seems to have all the stuff I am looking for in a bowrider. Except performance. Boattest.com reports a top speed of 34MPH, this seems too slow. The Maxum 180MX tests a top speed of 43 MPH. What is the difference? Is is the prop they chose? Also, the test shows the 170 Horizon uses nearly twice as much fuel at cruise than the Maxum. Maybe some owners of the Four Winns can comment.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Well boattest.com hasn't even tested the 1800 MX. So the info you have on that boat isn't a direct comparison. <br /><br />What motor is in both boats?<br /><br />What were the conditions during each test?<br /><br />How was speed measured?<br /><br />The boattest.com test of the Four Winns was done with the base 3.0 L four cylinder. That boat has the option of a 4.3 L which would help performance a lot.<br /><br />The Maxum is a smaller lighter boat. It only has the option of the 3.0L. I would say that it probably compares better to the Four Winns 180 Freedom.<br /><br />The Horizon is about 400 lbs heavier than the Freedom and the Maxum.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

That top speed from Boattest is messed up. It almost kept me from buying my 2004 Horizon 170. My boat has the 3.0 Volvo and top speed is between 42 and 44 MPH, depending on load and conditions. Boattest does note that their testing was done in rough conditions. Maybe the driver had a weak stomach. Published data from Four Winns (note that manufacturer data is usually conservative) indicates a top speed of 38 to 41 MPH.<br /><br />Gas mileage is very good in this boat. When the boat was new I was averaging about 16 litres per hour. After the break-in period I'm using only about 13 to 14 litres per hour. This is at a wide range of speeds and even with some water skiing and tubing.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

They also don't mention if that top speed was measured while going into that 8-9 knot wind or not. If so that answers the question as krnch said.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

I don't know if this helps you much but my 180 horizon with the 4.3 will do almost 50 mph. The 170 would really move out and the 34mph for a 3.0 is way to low. I own a Four Winns and been on a couple of Maxums. I think the four winns is a little better boat. Kevin

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Thanks for reples. I thought the test was messed up. KRNCH, what do you figure your planing speed is? I'd like to get my kids wakeboarding at about 15MPH. RotaryRacer, your right, Boattest.com never tested the Maxum, but the Bayliner 175 and the Maxum share the same hull and 3.0L Merc. The Maxum is "listed" at 2100 lbs, the Bayliner at 1900ibs and the Four baby at 2400lbs. Say KRNCH, did you buy the trailer brakes?,

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Rebel: One thing that really impresses me about the Horizon 170 is how flat it comes up on plane and how slowly it will plane. You can definitely plane at 15 MPH, provided there is not too much weight in the boat. It does make a pretty big wake at this speed, however. The desire for a slower planing speed was one of the reasons I went with the 3.0 over the 4.3. I personnally think a 4.3 is a little much for a 17 footer. My 3.0 had no problem pulling my 180-pound brother out of the water on one ski with 450 pounds worth of people in the boat.<br /><br />Check out the Four Winns website. Click on "Links", then "Literature Library", then "Fast Facts". I found this information quite useful when deciding on which boat to buy. It is here that they list top speed with different engine options and there is more detail with respect to weight. The standard Horizon 170 (not fish and ski) with the 3.0 engine is somewhere around 2260 pounds. I think this number sounds reasonable.<br /><br />I've rented several different 17 to 18 foot bowriders over the last several years before I decided on the Horizon 170. I am very impressed with the Four Winns product. Great handling, decent build quality, awesome trailer (I did get brakes - I'm towing with a minivan) and very stable for its size. The extra 6" of beam compared to many other offerings this size really creates a lot of interior space and I think it also helps with lateral stability. I would definitely recommend.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Thanks Krnch, you say your pulling with a mini van. I have a Ford Windstar with the 3.8L and a trailer towing package. What hardware did you have to buy to activate the trailer brakes. Its just something that I am starting to look at. Also, assuming you have front wheel drive ( only the GM Astro has rear) how do you find launching on steep ramps. Any problems? My experience is with a 2000 boat and trailer, far less than the 170horizon at 3100lbs.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Weird coincidence. I too have a Windstar. It's a 2003 with the 3.8L engine. I bought it used, so I had the transmission cooler added and a Class III hitch (basically the towing package minus the full-size spare). I've probably put on about 3000 km of towing the boat this summer. The Windstar does pretty well. I generally turn off the overdrive to eliminate excessive shifting between 3rd and 4th gear. The van struggles a bit on steep hills to maintain highway speed, but seems to have adequate power. Steep ramps are not a problem, but I have been selective about ensuring that the steeper ramps are in good condition offering good traction (most have been paved). One thing I may add are air shocks to the rear as the tongue weight does cause the Windstar's mushy suspension to compress a lot. I'm also using a 5.25 inch riser on my hitch.<br /><br />Even before getting the boat, I found the Windstar's braking power to be marginal. Hence the decision to get the trailer brakes. I figured it could only help. It seems to work quite well. As far as trailer brake actuation, you don't need to add anything to the van. The trailer has a telescoping tongue that compresses a piston inside the trailer when there is sufficient force (i.e., hard braking). The piston is connected to a hydraulic fluid reservoir and the hydraulic brake lines. I think this is pretty standard for trailer surge brakes. The problem with this type of brake system is that when you go to reverse (especially up hill or up the curb to your driveway), you apply pressure to the surge brakes and the trailer does not want to move. There are several different systems to overcome this difficulty. The system Four Winns uses is an electrical solenoid that is actuated by the tow vehicles reverse lights. The Four Winns trailer comes with a flat 5-pin wiring harness (i.e., one extra wire than the standard 4-pin connection commonly found). The fifth pin is wired to the tow vehicle reverse lights. When the reverse lights come on, a solenoid in the trailer is actuated to seal off the hydraulic lines to the brakes. There is a manual override also on the trailer where you simply insert a pin to "turn off" the brakes.<br /><br />Initially I used a standard 4-pin connection and the manual override pin. It proved to be sort of a pain, so for $30 I had a trailer shop install a 5-pin harness on the van. Money well spent.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

A good friend and boating buddy has a mid 80's Four Winns Horizon 170 with the 4.3 & he has been very well satisified with it. I was in it with 5 adults a couple of weeks ago and it had no trouble cruising in the mid thirty's...top end was high forty's.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

RebelRipper,<br /><br />If you like the Four Winns, with weight and planing speed being important factors, consider the 170 or 180 Freedom OB.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Krnch, thanks for the info. The Fourwinns 170 is too heavy for me to pull with gas in the tank, gear on the floor, or in the lockers, and 6 people in the van. I won't sleep at night. Racer, The Freedom o/b is lighter, but I want an i/o if I am going to spend my daughters wedding money on a boat. So, I went shopping yesterday to the Sea-Ray dealership. I guess I had some preconceptions about cost and Searay going hand in hand. But, I was suprised. The salesman reduced the price by 6K Canadian while we were talking. The Searay 180 is just 2100 lbs and the trailer is 515 lbs, so a good match for my tow vehicle. Fit and finish is very good, although not as good as the Four Winns. So, how do the boats stack-up to one anouther? The Bayliner 175 has seating for 6 in the cabin with 3.0l merc, the fourwinns has seating for 5 with 3.0l volvo as is $3,500 Canadian more than b/liner; the Maxum 180mx has seating for 5 with a 3.0l Merc and is $2,000 more than the Fourwinns, and finally the Searay has seating for 4 in the cabin (the only 2004 arrangement left) and is $500 more than the Maxum. I do like the Searay's floor storage;it's much wider than the others'. I would be happy with the Maxum,if he would take off $2000. I don't think Ive seen the best off from the Searay guy yet. Kepp you posted, and thanks for your help.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

Rebel - Just FYI, you can get a 6-seat configuration behind the windshield in the Horizon 170 (it's a no-cost option to switch the standard starboard bucket for a back-to-back lounger). This is the configuration that I got. One of the main reasons I did not consider the Sea Ray or the Maxum more seriously was because this seating option was not available. I wanted the ability to be able to fold both seats down for possible camping and I liked the extra seat. If this is not one of your criteria, both the Sea Ray and the Maxum seem like decent choices.<br /><br />I'm surprised that the marginal weight difference would cause you to lose sleep, especially given the available option for trailer brakes. You may have a point though if you plan on loading up the Windstar as indicated.<br /><br />I think you may find dealers more flexible on the price of the Sea Ray or Maxum at the present time. The Horizon 170 (all new for 2004) was a very hot seller this year (or so I've heard in this part of Canada anyway). When I bought my boat in early 2004 the Four Winns was priced very attractively.<br /><br />Good luck in whatever you decide.

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

krnch, because the dealer is not flexible, I am not going to consider the Maxum 1800MX. I felt it should be priced between the Bayliner 175 and the Searay 180. But the dealer had no inventory and priced it with the Searay. Do we know the current selling price of the Searay 180?

Re: Four Winns 170 Horizon question

RebelRipper,<br /><br />We got a 2004 SeaRay 180 in January for $15,500 out the door in Dallas (incl. tax, title, registration, bimini top, snap-in carpet, depth finder and bench seating). We've really enjoyed it. <br /><br />As for some of your other questions, the SR180 tops out at 44MPH with the 3.0 liter, and we can tow it easily with a Mazda MPV minivan (only 160hp). With a fold-away tongue and a 7ft beam, the boat slides easily into a single car garage we have.<br /><br />Happy hunting!