Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

silversuby

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After a 30 minute pleasure ride; I stopped at a dock to switch passengers. I was idling for about 10 minutes while tied to the dock. I idled away from the dock, and put the sterndrive down. When I gave it some throttle; the sterndrive came back up on it's own.

I stopped; tried it again; same deal. After fighting with it a bit, I headed back to shore. By the time I made it, the stern drive would NOT go back up (yes, I tried the trailer switch too). My passengers and I did smell electrical burning on the water. I had to pull it out and raise the drive manually to get home.

After getting home, I did some diagnosing and here's where I sit.

I can put the sterndrive down.
The trailer trim switch, nor the throttle switch work for up. I did NOT hear clicking when I hit the up switch (either one). Easy fix, right?
I CAN get the sterndrive to raise if I bypass the solenoid (jump 12 volts directly to the green/white wire.

I replaced the solenoid, but still no go. The new solenoid clicks, but no motor noise. I then swapped the new solenoid with the down one, and the drive did lower. So, the new solenoid obviously works.

I measured with a volt meter; and I DO see 12volts at the green/white wire. This Green/White wire goes directly into the power trim motor.

I've removed the motor and the solenoids from the boat now, because I was about to start ripping it apart when I figured a quick post couldn't hurt. If you look at Mercruiser Service Manual #6, I have the Oildyne Power Trim Pump (with aluminum reservoir) [section 5b]. If anyone knows the actual model number of this; that would be helpful. The number I pulled off the side is somewhat unreadable and doesn't seem to be close to any existing part numbers [08183711].

It almost sounds to me at this point as though the motor is require too many amps to run in "up" mode. But, that confuses me b/c this is just a single motor with forward and reverse, isn't it? So, I'm hoping someone else out there has had a similar issue.

Assumptions I made: I'm getting 12v when I flip either switch; so I'm assuming the wiring is good in the front half of the boat. The trailer switch, nor the throttle switch are working; so I'm ignoring the trim limit switch from this equation.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts!
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

Just a quick skim read (I'm being pressured to go out), sounds like you have shorted wires in the control handle....
 

silversuby

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Aug 28, 2011
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Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

Just a quick skim read (I'm being pressured to go out), sounds like you have shorted wires in the control handle....

I'll investigate that, but if that's the case; would I really hear the solenoid click when I hit the up (or the trailer switch). I suspect a short in the handle would blow the 20 amp fuse; or the solenoid would click randomly.
 

cpt ron jc

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Aug 25, 2010
Messages
116
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

I have the same problem,Down no up,yet when i jump it from the solenoid it goes up,i put a meter on the switch at the throttle handle,shows nothing confused,i think its the switch ,it goes down at the switch but will not go to trailer,i was told it couldnt be the solenoid if it was you would have no down or up,we know the pump works ,it goes down.good luck thanks
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

Ok, a further, more detailed read... Assumption #1 is incorrect. (Motor just reverses for UP and DOWN) This motor has 3 wires, not 2. One is ground (Black), one is UP (green/white) and one is DOWN(blue/white)... It uses different brushes for the UP and DOWN. So it is quite feasible for it to work in one direction but not the other...

Chris.......
BTW, it's a standard Parker-Oildyne 108 series pump. Get parts from them, or a decent auto-sparkie... In fact, if you hit a wall with it, have a car electrics guy have a look at it. All a 'marine mechanic' will do is send it to one of them... :D
 

thumpar

Admiral
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Jun 21, 2007
Messages
6,138
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

On a side note. Don't have the engine running while the drive is up.
 

silversuby

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Aug 28, 2011
Messages
13
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

I have the same problem,Down no up,yet when i jump it from the solenoid it goes up,i put a meter on the switch at the throttle handle,shows nothing confused,i think its the switch ,it goes down at the switch but will not go to trailer,i was told it couldnt be the solenoid if it was you would have no down or up,we know the pump works ,it goes down.good luck thanks

AND I have two different solenoids. One for up and one for down. I know the up solenoid was toast, I tested it and didn't hear any clicking when attempting to use it. It clicks know; just doesn't go up. After cleaning up all my connections at the solenoid side and testing the one's on the boat side; then i'm going to rip apart the motor and investigate the connections on the inside and then check the brushes. Problem is; I don't see any rebuild kits for these Oildyne motors, so even if it is just the brushes; I think I still have to buy a new motor :(
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

No, you can buy the brush plate... Also check the field coil continuity.

Brush plate part #-89487

Ah, that's not good. I just checked that number and it supersedes to a complete new motor... at $175. :eek:... I think I'd be looking elsewhere for a new motor. I'm dead sure you'll do better than that for a proper marine unit. Ted (TPENFIELD) got a complete trim pump (motor, pump, solenoids) for about the same price... Have a search through his posts and you should find it. From memory he did say where he got it... *** Be wary of the cheap Chinese rubbish ***

Chris.........
Found it....

http://forums.iboats.com/mercruiser...outdrive-wont-stay-up-602526.html#post4217651
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

I'd buy it at that! Also make sure the field coils are ok..... If one of those is dead it could also lead to the same problem...
 

cpt ron jc

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Aug 25, 2010
Messages
116
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

how come the leg still goes up when jumping at the solenoids,if it were the pump i would think it would not go up at all,i replaced my whole trim unit 2 summers ago motor ,wires,solen.because it was so rusted ,thanks i will check it out this week thanks
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

how come the leg still goes up when jumping at the solenoids,if it were the pump i would think it would not go up at all,i replaced my whole trim unit 2 summers ago motor ,wires,solen.because it was so rusted ,thanks i will check it out this week thanks

The pump is bi-directional. But it needs to be spun the other way. That's done within the motor. Different field coils and brushes for UP and DOWN...

Chris.......
 

silversuby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
13
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

I know you have all been waiting for this. Finally took apart my motor; and here's the pics.

I'm not an electrical engineer by any stretch. As soon as I took the first bolt out I got a bad whiff of electrical burning. I can see some of the wiring is toast; so I'm going to order that brush card. I MAY replace the wires that run from the card out to the solenoids if I can find some appropriate wire.

Does anyone see anything else for me to be concerned with?

Thanks again for all the help so far!
 

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silversuby

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Joined
Aug 28, 2011
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Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

I'll take the silence to mean that you don't see anything obvious either.

The board should be here tomorrow. Anyone have any tips/guidance on how to remove the board?
 

silversuby

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Aug 28, 2011
Messages
13
Re: Power Trim issues -- 1985 Merc 120

Cleaned up all the connections; replaced the brushes and re-assembled it. Replaced the 20 amp fuse, but still didn't work. Swapped the solenoids (up and down), both directions worked. Reconnected it to the original solenoids and it worked.

Installed it into the boat and it still works. I'm gonna roll with it and hope it continues to work! I'm keeping the ratchet straps nearby, just in case I need to manually raise the outdrive again though
 
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