my 1991 capri rebuild

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Oct 11, 2010
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272
i have a 91 bayliner capri that i am planning a full restore on. i have debated using poly or epxoy for weeks and am now leaning towards using poly resin to glass some 1.5oz csm to tab the stringers and bulkheads, then glass them in with w a full layer of 1708 w poly resin and then lay a complete but not massive layer of epoxy over the whole thing for strength and water proof. i was thinking to do the transom the same way but with 2 layers of 1708 w poly rather than one. i figured this would be a good way to get the benefits of epoxy but also keep the costs somewhat lower (by not having to use as much epoxy). anyone have any input on this?

also on a side note for those familiar with epoxy and its strength im curious would a stringer/bulkhead/transom configuration be stronger in 1708 with poly resin OR 10oz woven with epoxy? ive done deck replacements and such before but this is a first time doing stringers and transom, so im trying to get a good handle on this before i invest in supplies. thanks
 

proshadetree

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Messages
1,887
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

Just my opinion use poly all the way it is as strong as your boat.
 

oops!

Supreme Mariner
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Oct 18, 2007
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12,932
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

hi....welcome to iboats !

its your boat....you can build it any way you want.....

but if it were me........i would totally forget the epoxy....you will not gain ANY BENEFIT FROM IT in this case.

a 1708 poly is stronger than a 10 woving with epoxy......the stregnth is from the glass......where epoxy gets is reputation from is the bonding abilities. yes,,,,from stregnth as well.....but in the example sited above. the stregnth would be form the glass.

there are many capri threads up and running on here right now.....so you are in luck for a guide !
as well.... alot of us have done capris. i think by now i have done 10 of em....including a 91.

mya i suggest you get your wood first.....before the glass and start the wood to dry....for the transom you will want good straight wood. but it need to be dry to take the resin......the more it takes the resin the better bond you will have.

post pics of your project, and we can guide you step by step.......but in the mean time.....read read read...read as many threads as you can here......this will save you from simple mistakes that could cost you hours of extra labour.

cheers
oops
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Oct 11, 2010
Messages
272
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

thanks i have been luring on this forum for awhile and looked at many threads. im familiar with many of the bayliner builds. was just curious if using the epoxy on top of the poly would have a waterproofing/strength benefit at all. i always see the argument to use this one or that one, but never to use them both in the manner i described.
 

Woodonglass

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Dec 29, 2009
Messages
25,924
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

While it IS true that Epoxy has better waterproofing capabilities than Polyester resin, unless you are building a high end racing hull or yacht there is absolutely no reason to use it. The stresses and forces of nature that your boat will be placed under are not enough to warrant the use of epoxy. I know there are sites and builders who state that poly is not water proof but... I defy them to show me a properly laminated Polyester hull that will leak over a 30 year period. It will NOT. Therefore IMHO there is no reason to use it. You gain nothing from it and lose dollars that can be put to better use elsewhere in the restoration of your boat. But you have to understand I AM just a DUMB OLD OKIE!
 

bleedblue94

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Oct 11, 2010
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Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

i appreciate all the input and opinions. should i be good doing all the glassing in 1708 with about 15 ga of poly resin, or am i going to be looking at more like 30ga? again this is for a standard rebuild of a 20'.

on a separate note i figure it would cost about $500 to coat everything in a sealing coat of epoxy. ive heard good results from this but again i am still unsure if it is worth the $500
 

Woodonglass

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Dec 29, 2009
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Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

You must use Mat with Poly. You only need Cloth with Epoxy. You cannot rebuild your boat with ONLY epoxy. You will still have to use cloth. For a 20 ft boat doing the Stringers Transom and Deck, you prolly gunna use a minimum of 20 - 30 gallons of Poly and 25 yards of CSM and another 15-20 yds of 1708. Your total cost for glassning supplies should be around $1,500 bucks if you really shop around and are very careful about NOT wasting material. You will also need Cabosil and Chopped fibers to make thickened resin (Peanut Butter) for filleting.
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Oct 11, 2010
Messages
272
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

thank you sir. exactly what i was looking for. last question is basically will i be ok with 1.5 csm and poly to tab the stringers and one layer of 1708 over them and onto the hull, or should i tab w csm, and do two layers of 1708 over the entire stringer? im thinking 2 layers of 1708 would be overkill but id like opinions
 

Woodonglass

Supreme Mariner
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Dec 29, 2009
Messages
25,924
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

Lots of debate there. My signature has a link on how I recommend you fabricate your stringers, transom and deck. Take a look at the drawings and let me know if you have further questions.
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Oct 11, 2010
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272
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

outstanding. this is exactly what i was looking for.

one final question for now and possibly a very stupid one, but when applying the 1708, should the csm side of the 1708 be face down on the wood or should the csm side of it be up and the cloth portion down on the wood. again its possibly a very dumb question but id rather ask and be right rather than be ignorant
 

Decker83

Commander
Joined
Apr 5, 2011
Messages
2,592
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

Hey bleedblue94.
There is never a stupid question here but the one that wasn't ask.
The csm side always goes down and cloth side up.
 

evolution1985

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jan 29, 2012
Messages
213
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

i still have allot of left over parts from my 1997 capri that i rebuilt. That i either replaced or was going to replace. if there is anything that I can help with pm me. I do understand im a little bit far away but freight isn't too bad these days. also allot of the parts would just be returning home as i only shipped them over to Aus about 12 months ago.

cheers mate and good luck.
 

Yacht Dr.

Vice Admiral
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Feb 26, 2005
Messages
5,581
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

The csm side always goes down and cloth side up.

Not Always :) .. If your doing a wet on wet application ( 1708 over mat ) then you can lay cloth side down.

Poly Glassing 101 .. Mat Must be the first one down..and between every layer of glass 'material' ( woving or biax ).

Having mat as your last layer up will help with 'drainage' issues that can sometimes occur. But sometimes it is more desirable to have mat side Always down.

As far as your mat/1708 schedule .. I like the over kill way :) .

Are you planning on tabbing first..cure..then lam ? or are you going to do all of the tabbing/lams 'wet' on 'wet' ?

YD.
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Oct 11, 2010
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Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

thanks guys. ive always thought people on this site were very friendly in the thread ive read but its so nice to see so much prompt help.

im going to do all my cutting, glue the stringers down with pl, let it cure for 2-3 days, cut to height, then in one day wet the wood with resin, lay fillet (if needed), and do tab, 1708, cap, 1708 all in one day to the stringers and bulkheads. i figure this would be the most time efficient, strong, and least wasteful way to do it. it will make for a long day but so much of it will be done.

planning on how to support the fuel tank im debating how to keep it raised so as not to trap water around the tank. im wondering if using 1/2" fuel hose and gluing to the framing around tank to keep it elevated and spaced from stringers and bulkheads. would this work well? i figure it will be the easiest way to guarantee fuel and water resistant supports. or i could use 1/2" foam strips with glass over them to make ribs to support the tank and allow drainage.
 

Yacht Dr.

Vice Admiral
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Feb 26, 2005
Messages
5,581
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

im going to do all my cutting, glue the stringers down with pl, let it cure for 2-3 days, cut to height, then in one day wet the wood with resin, lay fillet (if needed), and do tab, 1708, cap, 1708 all in one day to the stringers and bulkheads. i figure this would be the most time efficient, strong, and least wasteful way to do it. it will make for a long day but so much of it will be done.

If your doing it in sections you could probably get away doing it this way while keeping your wet on wet going.

Good luck and remember that if it starts to cure..stop lamming. You can always reprep and continue to do your glassing.

YD.
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Oct 11, 2010
Messages
272
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

thanks guys. plan is to start taking it a part monday. need to remove the force 150 from this hull and start cutting the terrible floor replacement the previous owner did and then pop the cap. already have a nice 175 johnson sitting and waiting to go on.
 

Sea Stomper

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Nov 9, 2010
Messages
158
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

I'm with the poly folks here. If poly is not waterproof, then why are 99.9 percent of all surfboards glassed with poly?
 

bleedblue94

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Oct 11, 2010
Messages
272
Re: my 1991 capri rebuild

so i got to spend about 5 hours on this monday. got the motor off and ready for whoever takes it. compression was surprisingly good. i think it just needs a carb rebuild. regardless i have a 175 johnson waiting for this boat so this one goes
IMG-20120213-00023.jpg

once the rub rail came off i got to find this spot of joy. just a bunch of bondo with nothing for it to bind to, so under the plastic cover and rub rail was a hole.
IMG-20120213-00020.jpg

transom didnt look too bad till the cap came off....
IMG-20120214-00025.jpg

i couldnt move the cap off the boat, just not enough man power and no one around. so instead i moved the cap forward and got access to the rear the way i wanted.
IMG-20120214-00026.jpg
IMG-20120214-00027.jpg
 
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