'80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

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mikezivy

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Trying to free up the very stiff tilt on this motor. Engine has been sitting outside for many years but is otherwise in good order & now running (I rebuilt it way back when). Can get grease thru one side of tilt tube lube point (via nipple) but other side sat with broken off nipple. Have now cleaned out the hole and tapped in a new nipple but grease just wont flow thru.

Unsure if tilt tube (and big nyloc nuts at either end) are meant to pivot with engine but thats what is happening. Looks like the intended design allows for pivot in the main engine bracket boss - not at the transom brackets, as is the case.

Had the idea to remove the transom bracket arm on the offending side and see if I can drill a fine hole along the edge of the transom tube in parallel with the tube through to the nipple cavity. Using a 3 jaw puller, just cannot seem to get the transom bracket arm off the tube and worried about cracking the arm with too much force. Modest corrosion but its certainly not a mess. Maybe try ice, per below tip. I can order a whole new pivot tube cheap enough but so far looking like a hell of a job to change it!

Any thoughts please?

Flywheel removal tip: These flywheels can be very hard to remove! What worked for me was using ice to cool around the threaded end of the crank for say 25 mins. Doesn't matter if you also cool the inner boss of the flywheel. Then use a paint stripper gun (the electric blower kind that spreads the heat) to heat the flywheel evenly around the center, avoiding the crank, for 2-3 mins. Work quickly to stop the heat spreading to the crank - put your puller on, tighten, then give a few blows to the puller shaft. Try to support the flywheel weight with a breaker bar as you hit the puller to protect the main bearings & be careful not to prise too hard or you will crack something - its only alum!

Thanks
Mike
 
fucawi

fucawi

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Length of threaded rod down the centre of the tube...washer one end and a suitable socket the other to bring the load onto the outer.....you can rock it back and forth or see if its easier to move one way .........if you need a manual let us know ..they are free on line
 
jerryjerry05

jerryjerry05

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

A bit of heat might help.
Spray WD or PB Blaster let it set over night.
Then a bit of heat from a torch.
Then spray again and a bit more heat.
All the time try to lift.
Continue as needed.J
 
Frank Acampora

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

If at all possible, I would really like to see a couple of photos.
 
Texasmark

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Also, if there is a grease zerk grease it with marine grease (trailer bearing grease from WW will work). Additionally, one guy on a similar thread suggested you put the skeg on the floor and using the tongue jack raise the bow of the boat forcing the weight of the engine to be on the skeg while you work a lube into the joint.

HTH,

Mark
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Thanks for the posts....keeping me inspired! Did try lots of WD, heat & threaded rod (even rattle gun) to no avail as suspect corrosion has formed a thread inside the transom bracket on one side (where the nipple had broken off so no grease!) - other side is free. Will try weight on skeg once I finish water pump overhaul & refit. Will also post pics tmmrw.

Keen to confirm please that in working order the pivot tube is meant to turn freely in swivel bracket, ie in the 'bushings' behind the nipples. Thanks again.

Mike
 
Texasmark

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

mikezivy said:
Keen to confirm please that in working order the pivot tube is meant to turn freely in swivel bracket, ie in the 'bushings' behind the nipples. Thanks again.

Mike
Click to expand...

Not sure what you are asking here but if the question is that the engine should move freely the answer is yes.

Back the old zerk out if you can and insert another one then with weight off the lower unit, fill her up. Once you get the lube in just keep rocking it back and forth and if lucky it will free up...then more grease. I have done it by drilling out some of the old one and inserting an easy out into he hole. Don't get the drill bit too large so that you don't cut into the threads in the engine.
 
Frank Acampora

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

102_6649.jpg102_6648.jpg102_6647.jpg

Yep, Mark. That's why I asked for photos. He seems to be describing the twin carb 55, 60, 65 engine. To my knowledge, those were the only Chryslers using a steering tube as a tilt tube also. It was and is easy to substitute a 35, 45, 55 cowling on it.

Mike: If you do have a twin carb engine. the steering tube should be free inside the yoke and tight inside the transom clamps. In fact, all engines should have the tilt bolt tight in the transom clamps and tilt around the bolt.

Two photos (first and last) show the engine using a steering tube as a tilt tube and the center one shows an engine using a bolt.
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

45Pivot2.jpg45Pivot1.jpg
Frank Acampora said:
If at all possible, I would really like to see a couple of photos.
Click to expand...

Thanks Frank - please find pics attached showing the problem, ie. Pivot tube is moving insight transom bracket but very stiff - as if corrosion has seen the alum grow. I used a decent puller on the transom bracket in image 1 to try and get it off (with transom bolts loosened!) to no avail. Worried about cracking it with more force. Lots of WD used & some heat.

Value your thoughts when you can please.

Many thanks, Mike
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Frank, Looking at your pics, yes its the same as the 55 you have there - although its a 45 single carb. (457HOL) Thanks for the confirm here as it makes sense the tube should be free insight the yoke - making it so again would mean powerhead off & not sure even a press would move the rusted pipe out...probably a hacksaw from insight the pipe then roll-in & collapse with pliers. Or drill then ream-out with likelihood that a SS sleeve will need to be pressed in to maintain correct size for replacement pivot pipe. Messy & slow!! Still all starts with the challenge of pulling the transom bracket off.

Value any further thoughts please.

Thanks also to Mark - I did manage to drill out & recut the threads for the nipples with M8 - now chasing down the heli-coil inserts.

Many thanks, Mike
PS: Am thinking to test run in water as is before all this effort as its been 10 yrs since it was under load. Just cleaning up water pump now to do so.
 
Frank Acampora

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Wow! That is the first time I have seen a single carb engine set up like that. I really would like to see more photos of the entire engine. See: Chrysler used a bolt on almost all their engines and a steering tube passed through the front of the transom clamps. The only domestic engines in your size I have seen used a pivot bolt AND---When Force started making the engines, they also used a bolt. The ONLY Chryslers I have seen that used the steering tube as a tilt tube were the twin carb two cylinder engines. Thus: I am extremely curious to see how the kingpin was attached to the engine leg. So, a couple of photos of the transom clamps and kingpin from various angles, and of the complete engine without the hood would be very much appreciated.

Anyway: I am thinking that if you really want to get that pivot tube out, the only way you will do it is to take the engine off the transom and heat the clamp. The clamp is a forged piece so if you heat it mildly with a propane torch it you won't damage it and it should expand enough to loosen around the steel tube. Try wiggling it off. Then do the same for the yoke and bang the hell out of the tube. Just don't mushroom the end.
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Thanks Frank, sorry for slow reply - something about Christmas! It may help to know this engine was delivered in Australia (I am in Sydney). I am attaching several pics FYI but happy to take more specific ones of the king-pin if you like.

Pivot tube is now free enough to test motor thanks but on a tank test I sheared the key (clackyty clack noise on start-up - ran only 1 min) but I cant figure out why. I did use the nut off a 35 hp, which is flared at its base and also anti-seize on the taper (see pics). Just spent the day making a new key (ordered a new one but takes a week to arrive from US) & have the right nut now so any tips on re-assembly very much appreciated please? I did lap it many years ago when new crank was fitted & know the torque is 80 ft lbs.

Thanks again, Mike.45_Complete.jpg45_CrankBoss.jpg45_Key.jpg45_Pivot.jpg45_Side.jpg
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Thanks Frank. Have assembled per your guidance without lubricant & torqued 10% more - test ran well in water yesterday, thank you! (see success pic)The trusty hand-made key also worked fine & is a bit tighter tolerance than the factory, after some careful hand fitting.

Yes the lower unit was changed as I got caught towing a skier on low tide and hit 3 big rocks in a row! See attached pic - it split the thread for the lwr bearing cage retaining bolt. Another crack had started propagated further across the water inlet, so time to change. I re-sprayed the whole leg on assembly, which explains the color question.

Some more pics also attached on the king pin retaining - top & bottom. This exploded diagram gives detail of mounting.KingPinTopMnt.jpgLwrCase.jpgSuccess.jpgKingPin.jpg

Thanks for the pic of your boat & friends! I noted the prop is only 2 blade, which made me curious as to the benefits/reason?

Really appreciate your advice and guidance in getting my engine back to running well.

Kind Regards
Mike
 
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chrome dome

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

mate, your diagram link didn't work..
must've been the day for local yokels to make 45 hp flywheel keys..
what size boat is yours on?
 
Frank Acampora

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

That prop is old school. It is a bronze 2 blade Michigan racing wheel, fully cupped. I was given it as a gift in 1968 and while it does vibrate a little more than three blades it does perform best on this engine.

Back then, two blades were the only way to go for racing. The reasoning was that two blades have less drag than three AND each blade operates in less disturbed water from the previous. Now, with surface running and much better design, three blades seem to be the norm.
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

chrome dome said:
mate, your diagram link didn't work..
must've been the day for local yokels to make 45 hp flywheel keys..
what size boat is yours on?
Click to expand...

HI CD,

Having trouble pasting the link - some great diagrams (& these guys seem good for parts) at boats dot net then see /parts/search/Merc/Force/H0457H80L

Its on a 14 ft Brooker and goes pretty well. Did you do your key too?

MIke
 
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mikezivy

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Re: '80 Chrysler 45hp Pivot Tube Seized

Thanks Frank - very interesting. I am curious to know how you got involved in the industry - were you on the design side?

Mike
 
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ollyolly1964

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mikezivy said:
Trying to free up the very stiff tilt on this motor. Engine has been sitting outside for many years but is otherwise in good order & now running (I rebuilt it way back when). Can get grease thru one side of tilt tube lube point (via nipple) but other side sat with broken off nipple. Have now cleaned out the hole and tapped in a new nipple but grease just wont flow thru.

Unsure if tilt tube (and big nyloc nuts at either end) are meant to pivot with engine but thats what is happening. Looks like the intended design allows for pivot in the main engine bracket boss - not at the transom brackets, as is the case.

Had the idea to remove the transom bracket arm on the offending side and see if I can drill a fine hole along the edge of the transom tube in parallel with the tube through to the nipple cavity. Using a 3 jaw puller, just cannot seem to get the transom bracket arm off the tube and worried about cracking the arm with too much force. Modest corrosion but its certainly not a mess. Maybe try ice, per below tip. I can order a whole new pivot tube cheap enough but so far looking like a hell of a job to change it!

Any thoughts please?

Flywheel removal tip: These flywheels can be very hard to remove! What worked for me was using ice to cool around the threaded end of the crank for say 25 mins. Doesn't matter if you also cool the inner boss of the flywheel. Then use a paint stripper gun (the electric blower kind that spreads the heat) to heat the flywheel evenly around the center, avoiding the crank, for 2-3 mins. Work quickly to stop the heat spreading to the crank - put your puller on, tighten, then give a few blows to the puller shaft. Try to support the flywheel weight with a breaker bar as you hit the puller to protect the main bearings & be careful not to prise too hard or you will crack something - its only alum!

Thanks
Mike
Click to expand...
I've the same problem king pin and bracket really seized.dont want to take crysler 12.9 outboard 2 stroke 2 cylinder outboard
 
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