Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Hello,

Last summer I just purchased my first boat a 1991 Bayliner Capri 17' with a 70 HP Force Motor. I always wanted a boat and I finally got my wife to "let me" buy a used one since it's my first one.
We drove to Montreal and Ontario from Halifax and on my way back I picked up the boat from North Bay. Since we were on a schedule and we had our 2 small children with us, I never tried the boat on the water and just bought it on the previous owner's word. (stupid me :facepalm: )

Once back in Halifax, I finally put the boat on the water all excited and to my big UNPLEASANT surprise, my boat is listing to the right badly. At times it lists so bad that I can almost touch the water if I put my hand out. Of course the guy I bought it from never said anything about a listing problem. I didn't even know it was a problem for boats.

That was last June. Then I realized the floor was soft in some spots and thinking that this might be the problem I teared the floors out to find that the bottom 2" of the foam was wet ....but it was on both sides of the boat, front and back. What I figured happen is since there was almost no glass on the original plywood and the boat was probably stored outside, water from rain and snow got in under the floors. Now like I said only the 2" of the foam was wet and was on both sides therefore this could not explain the bad listing to the right. Also if I have to weigh all the wet foam I took out it wouldn't even be 50Lb in total (from both sides) therefore I don't believe that was the problem.

Since then, I took the wet foam out, replaced the floors, didn't glass it yet, just in case I need to get back inside.

The boat sits level in the water, when standing still. Once I start accelerating, it starts to list to the right, the more I push the throttle, the more it lists until it gets to plane. Once on plane, I have the feeling that it wants to pull to the right. When I slow down , it immediately lists to the right and I have to pull the steering wheel hard left to counter act the listing to the right. I do have electric tilt/trim but that doesn't seem to solve the problem no matter how much I trim the motor. If I'm by myself and I sit on the left seat and accelerate, it goes almost perfectly with no list, but that's because I weigh 190Lb. As far as weight in the boat (besides me) there is not much. I have a battery that sits in the bow centered under the seats, and I even place the portable gas tank and the 20 Lb anchor on the left side to counter act the list, but no result. A month ago I went fishing and had placed a 8HP 2 strike Johnson motor on the left side, (motor weights 60-70Lb ) and it was still listing to the right. It's like as soon as I accelerate or decelerate , something is pulling my boat to the right. Even with my wife, on the left side and me on the right, it still tilts to the right, not as much but still...
The motor turns clockwise when looking towards thew bow and the small anode fin is perfectly centered...I also looked at the boat hull and there's no deformity that I can see, I mean it's got scratches and small dings but nothing major.

Since I've been looking on these forums for a long time searching for people with the same problems, I also bought Smart Tabs...but that didn't help at all..it almost made things worse. Now because of the build in swimming platform, I couldn't place them as they say ..5" from the sides so I has to install them near the center of the transom (10" from the sides).

It's so bad that I am afraid to take my 4 year old son in it and take him fishing.

Now, after spending my whole summer trying to fix it instead of cruising and fishing, my wife is ready to kill me and I am ready to burn the f-ing thing.

Any ideas? (in how to fix it not to burn it )

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

trim tabs would help. Also you can add some weight to the port side (left) of the boat, but trim tabs would be better

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Welcome Aboard, the anode fin that you said is centered, needs to be ajusted to the side its pulling. I would ajust it about 30deg to start. It should get better, if worse, then you have gone the wrong way. I think your tabs that you installed will not help to much, because there too close together, the wider apart the bettter. Hope this helps you out.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

It sounds like too much listing under way, but check you trim tab on motor. It is a tab hanging down on bottom of cav plate, positioned behind the prop. You loosen a bolt and rotate it to adjust.

Have you checked the transom structure? Many times when there is floor rot the transom will be in poor condition as well. It can be twisting under load.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

adj. your trim tab like the attachment says.
ya adj. the trim tab to the side that turns easiest. imho, i'd start in smaller increments than 30*. more like 3-5*, then more or less. why i say that is i adjusted one on a boat my dad had when i was a teenager. i adj. it a lot. on a speed run the boat started chine walking. real bad. like i almost lost it.

also, look at where your anti cavitation plate is located. how high or low is is compared to the keel of the boat at the transom. the anti cavitation plate should be just a shade above the keel. if the anti cavitation plate is lower than the keel. this would lead to a bow down condition. which would affect how the boat handles and rides (listing).
as the the tabs. i've never had any. but from your description they're doing what their supposed to. stuffing the bow down. in your case to much so. if the bow is stuffed down to much it may act strange (list).

edit. imho, the fact that it sits level static is good.
also when ya adj. the trim tab. the tab is adjusted for one speed, one trim, one load. at that speed, trim and load, the steering will not pull either direction. you should be able to let go of the wheel (use caution obviously), when ya turn the wheel, it should feel the same in both directions. when speed, trim or load is different than for where you adjusted the trim tab for. steering pull will return. though less so than your what your describing, which is abnormal i think too....

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

You may also want to take a close look at the bottom as it nears the transom - it could have a significant "hook" that's causing the list under power. Fixing such a hook can be a major project - but look at the topic under the correct forum here on iBoats. Good luck and welcome to boating - it will get better and better.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

there are actually very few reasons for a boat pulling while under way.

1. trim anode incorrectly set.
2. bad weight distribution.
3. improper drive list, (the drive on the motor at an angle in relation to the transom)
4. hull hook or flex. (this is usually due to rotten stringers or transom)

if you do not know how to check for items 3 and 4 please post back for instructions

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

First, propeller torque will cause a boat to list, that is why many people install trim tabs.

Second, NEVER, ever, never, ever purchase a Bayliner and one from 1991, lol, those were the worst of the worst of the wort. Sorry, hope you did not pay him much for it and a Force motor, OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wow.

Trim tabs will run several thousand dollars, the boat is worth about 200 dollars or possibly nothing.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Not really sure how any of your post is helpful . . .

high'n'dry said:

First, propeller torque will cause a boat to list, that is why many people install trim tabs.

Click to expand...

Propeller torque causes a list to port with most OBs and I/Os. Unless this is some super custom Force with opposite rotation, I think we can rule that out . . .

You can even get helm adjustable tabs for around $500 so not sure where you get the "several thousand" He already bought SmartTabs and they actually can be adjusted to counteract list.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Thank you all for your replies...I should've asked these question in the summer when I could just test the theories on the water ASAP. Now with the winter approaching there is not much time...man I wish I lived in Florida .

As far as weight goes there is not much and everything I can move I already moved to the Port side. I hope for a nice day tomorrow and take the boat on the water one more time and trim the anode to the right and then left to see if it makes a difference.

How do I check for a an improper drive list caused by the motor? Also as far as a hook goes I can't see anything when I look closely at it. What other test could I do?

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

I've never checked for hook but I imagine a long, straight edge put up against the hull would show you if had a wave in the bottom. Good luck with your investigation!

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Welcome to iboats!
Start with the steering tab adjustment as noted above. Also make sure your Smart Tabs are set up properly.

high'n'dry said:

First, propeller torque will cause a boat to list, that is why many people install trim tabs.

Second, NEVER, ever, never, ever purchase a Bayliner and one from 1991, lol, those were the worst of the worst of the wort. Sorry, hope you did not pay him much for it and a Force motor, OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wow.

Trim tabs will run several thousand dollars, the boat is worth about 200 dollars or possibly nothing.

Click to expand...

You can safely ignore pretty much everything in the above "advice".

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Above, oops! listed the major reasons for listing. Since your problem is movement related, and since everything you have done to counteract the list, it should be obvoius that some very strong force is acting upon your boat. That leads me to either the powerful force of water or the strong force put out by an engine.

I'm down to two possibles: engine alignment or flexing hull.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Agreed. Very first thing you need to do is adjust the steering tab from center more to stb. A little torque steer is to be expected coming outa the hole and under hard acceleration/deceleration. But not when cruising.

Might want to make sure the motor is plumb & level too.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

since this is an outboard im leaning towards transom....

if the outboard motor is all the way down on its hooks....

and it is straight up and down on the keel....

that means the hull is shifting......stringers since they are basically glass......should not be too much of a factor.

but if the transom is moving on the op during operation....it will cause the angle of attack to be screwey.

the way to test the transom....is to stand on the anti cave plate.......jump on the puppy.

if the transom flexes......replace.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

NYBo said:

Welcome to iboats!
Start with the steering tab adjustment as noted above. Also make sure your Smart Tabs are set up properly.

You can safely ignore pretty much everything in the above "advice".

Click to expand...

You do a disservice on this board to not tell the truth on Bayliners and especially the older ones. The newest, at least until the recession began were getting decent but still a world of issues. People buy these things because you guys will not tell the truth for fear of hurt feelings. They are a poor product and the early 90s, they are horrible. For him to dump more money into a boat with a rotten floor and who knows what else, I dno't know, don't seem like a good plan to me.

Smart tabs, lol, whatever, I meant real, helm controllable tabs, not plastic flippers with springs on them. Yes, if he were to purchase helm tabs and have them installed, about 1,500 to 2,000 dollars, maybe a bit less. Installed himself, under a 1,000.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

high'n'dry said:

You do a disservice on this board to not tell the truth on Bayliners and especially the older ones. The newest, at least until the recession began were getting decent but still a world of issues. People buy these things because you guys will not tell the truth for fear of hurt feelings. They are a poor product and the early 90s, they are horrible. For him to dump more money into a boat with a rotten floor and who knows what else, I dno't know, don't seem like a good plan to me.

Smart tabs, lol, whatever, I meant real, helm controllable tabs, not plastic flippers with springs on them. Yes, if he were to purchase helm tabs and have them installed, about 1,500 to 2,000 dollars, maybe a bit less. Installed himself, under a 1,000.

Click to expand...

first off my friend..........there is no such thing as a bad boat.......but there are bad owners.

if a boat is not well kept for it will rot in 5 years......i dont care what name is on the side. i have seen 07 larsons that were carp...(vec hulls....no wood)
on the other hand.....i have seen 90 bayliners that are utterly fantastic.
so to rant on about bayliners is un fair.

as far as bennett tabs.....helm controlled... they are about 695 a pop.....i install them professionally for 300 a set......average boat takes me 2 hours.

so your quotes are unrealistic......QC was correct

You can even get helm adjustable tabs for around $500 so not sure where you get the "several thousand" He already bought SmartTabs and they actually can be adjusted to counteract list.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

Since all but Oops missed the obvious that this is an outboard, let's go back to basics. Where is the motor hanging? Is the cav plate above or below the bottom of the hull? Should be parrallel with or an inch above the lowest point of the hull. Look here first, I'm betting the motor hangs too low. The fin behind the prop can be adjusted (if it even has one) to help but it typically corrects steering pull, not listing like the OP suggests. Smart tabs can be loaded to correct an imbalance, that should be next if all else fails. Full blown tabs are overkill here, something else very basic is wrong.

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

well I had typed a response mentioning motor height last night but I guess I didn't manage to post it lol.... any how here goes again, yup if the motor is too long for the transom or adjusted too low, that could cause issues.... another thing that CAN cause this is a whale tale... Not saying they're always bad, but if you have one, try taking it off and see if it helps

Re: Boat listing to Starboard-please help

I'd be more inclined to think it was off to one side from centerline, vs motor height. Given it is a Force, it is probably the original engine with the original factory mounting bolts and position. Maybe off from factory?

Could the hull be flexing from not having the floor glassed in yet? Just wondering where to go if tab, transom, centerline, no hook, etc don't pan out.