1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Hello everybody

I have been trolling around these forums for over a year as I do research on the restoration project I am undertaking. I have found lots and lots of good info on here and finally decided it was time I start to document my progress.

There are a few things I would like to say here in the begining so everyone understands me and where I am coming from.

For starters I am in no hurry to complete this project so if you don't hear from me for weeks or even months at a time don't be surprised because its pretty well normal for me.

I am a thick headed kind of guy and am likely to do things my way even if does seem extreme or unconventional.

My goals with this project is to rebuild a boat that I have years of fond memories of to a condition that is better than it was new. (not nessesarily original) And to do it in a way that will likely last long enough to pass it down to my kids.

I don't want to use any wood products or urethane products in this boat.

I would like to lighten it while making it stronger than it was originaly. Since the boat was stated as capable of handling a 135 horsepower engine I would like to be confidant that a 150 would not tear it up if I ever chose to put one on it.

Since this boat has been in my family in one form or another since it was new (my step father bought it in 1971 when he married my mom) it is more a task of love and passion than just a desire to fix a boat. My kid brother and my brother in law have also owned this boat for a while before it came to me so though I know the entire history it is often hard to tell what was done by who (whether it be the factory or a family member).

Anyways I obtained the boat from my brother in law a little over a year ago with a blown motor that was in pieces and the seats missing (which angers me more than anything else since they are truly one of a kind in these boats) and not to mention basically in rough neglected and abused condition.

I have spent the last year studying, exploring, tearing down, and purchasing some basic required supplies like parts for the motor and tools to work on both.

Ok I will leave off here for the moment so eveyone can breath a sec.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

More Pictures

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

That is one neet looking boat. Really dig the lines.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Great Boat. I had one last year we used on the lakes. Had a 120hp chrysler on it and it would fly! Great boat! here are a few links to the pictures of the one i had.

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn170/Isaacmcdowell/DSC_0034.jpg

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn170/Isaacmcdowell/DSC_0035.jpg

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn170/Isaacmcdowell/DSC_0048.jpg

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Ok now that everyone has a chance to at least see what I am into here I have a few questions that from a lot of the reading I have been doing are sure to spark a debate but I feel like I need a chance to participate in the same debate and make a decision for myself.

Before I ask my questions I want to make somethings clear.
This boat has never ben stored in the water, has never seen salt water, and never will. It is strickly a weekend warrior for lakes and rivers and will probably allways will be.

Now I have been able to make a lot of design decisions based on information on these and other forums like what material I want to use for rebuilding the transom, stringers and floor. But of course some questions, concerns or possibly fears still exist.

I am strongly swaying towards using the non blushing epoxy from AeroMarine partly due to price and partly because of the stated non blushing qualities.
My second choice is what seems to be the main stream standard of West Systems epoxy. Since none of the fiberglass work I do will ever be exposed to UV I don't consider color or UV stability to be a concern. I do however consider strength, quality of adhesion, ease of use, and honesty in advertising to be important qualities.
Is there any reason why I should stick to West Systems over the newer non blushing epoxies?

I am also seriously considering rebuilding the stringers with a foam core design with more of an engineered shape for strength and a heavier fiberglass wrap to compensate for the loss of the rigidity of the wood. But I am undecided on which foam to use for instance a simple light weight polystyrene based foam or maybe a lamination of coosa or rinell type products. I am also considering capping the stringers with a material like the plastic based lumber for decks simply provide a solid non rotting material for the mounting of things like the decking, seats and other hardware too that is capable of taking screws well is solid for a thickness of over a 1 inch and can be sealed well with some form of sealant like E6000 or similar.
I know there nearly as many diffeent opionions on this topic as there are people arguing about it so I don't really want to start another long debate on it but I do want to make sure I am not overlooking something or making a major mistake.

So I think that makes for a solid entrance to the forums

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

To Insanity and Issac, Thank you both! I have allways loved the look of this boat and the near break neck performance and manuvering it was/is capable of. Issac, I also have the 120 on it and it seems almost crazy that its rated for a 135!

Thanks again

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Ok as I mentioned earlier I was considering a foam core style engineered stringer. I have attached a image of the type of design I am considering.

The reason I am looking at this type of design is for strength to weight ratio as well durability. The addition of the Trex material has really nothing to do with structural consideration and everything to do with a fastening material that is inexpensive and has reasonable tolerance to moisture penetration and rot.

Though The dimensions are not exact the drawing should get across the general idea of what I have in mind.

So I would appreciate any ideas comments or even critical views of my idea.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Hello again everyone. I know its been a few days since I started this thread but I have been busy, both ordering parts for the boat and motor as well as dealing with work and the holiday.

Since then I have gotten back to work and have made some progress with the tear down.

I managed to get the boat stripped and the top off (finally!).
Though some things don't seem to be as bad as I expected them to be others are worse.

In the attached photos you will notice that the floor is delaminating in a few areas as well as the transom though the wood under it seems to be fairly solid but that won't stop me from replacing it since I am sure the foam under the floor is shot and I think the bottom of the transom is rotten as well.

What concerns me the most is delamination apparent where the inside corners of the sponsons meets the transom.
I am not really sure yet if its from the factory and normal or if it something I need to repair.
Either way I think at the least I will strengthen it with an additional layer of fiberglass.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Shallow Vee Project

More photos...

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

HI, nice boat, I rebuilt my chrysler 20' center console last year.
You already realize its a gut job and you're well on the way to getting it all out. Transom and stringers will be shot to heck, they always are.
If you beef up the transom a bit you can always opt for extra power later.

Foam stringers are fine, your idea is a bit over engineered but that doesn't harm anything, its just more fun. You can actually just use blue foam, the strength comes from what goes over the stringer, the stringer itself is just for shape formation.

Rather than go nuts with the stringer design I would strongly consider a composite core transom, it will never need replacing again.
There are some great products out there for this.

Your boat is such a timeless classic of design, still looks like a modern boat.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Well hello again.

Jonesg, Thank you very much for your input on the stringers and transom. I did decide to simplify the stringer design. I will be going with a simple foam stringer. I wanted the top board to have something to fasten seats and things too but I found something out as I removing the deck tonight. There are 2x6 boards laid flat running side to side embedded in the stringers. I think I will do the same thing when I rebuild the floor but instead of wood I will use the composite decking material for rot resistance.

When I started this project I knew the transom likely was a bit weakened and the floor had some soft spots in it based mostly on what my family had told me about its last years on the water. After doing a lot of research (mostly on iboats forums) I had decided to just plan for the worse right off the bat. That way I couldn't be too disapointed along the way.

For the transom I will be using Renicell E240 1/2 inch thick panels laminated with 6 oz fabric and epoxy resin. The original transom was 1 1/2 inch sheet of plywood across the entire transom and then a 1 inch thick piece about 2 foot square in the middle to mount the engine on. To replace it I plan on using 2 layers of the Renicell across the entire transom and then a single layer in the middle to build up the thickness like they did finishing it gussets on either side of the bilge area for extra rigidity and energy transfer to the stringers/bottom.

For the floor I am torn between the Renicell, the Divinycell H-Grade; Type: H 45, 5/8" thickness, and the NIDA-CORE H8PP Honeycomb in 3/4" - 20mm they all three seem like they would work and the price difference is minimal with Divinycell starting at $95 for a 4x8 sheet and Renicell ending at $125 for a 4x8 sheet. But I am swaying towards the Renicell since it seems to be a stronger and more rigid product. Particularly for the minimal price difference but the Nidacore seems like it might be more durable where the wear and tear of people walking on it comes into play.

For the fiberglass I have decided to go with basic 6 oz fabric to simplify my inventory requirements and for the relative ease of application. by adding layers in multiple directions I can acomplish the same kind of strength as biaxial 1708 without significantly increasing my bulk. Though I may have to lay more layers it should be easier to wet out and lay then a thicker fabric.

For my epoxy I have decided to go with the non blushing version from Aero Marine Products for a few reasons. First off price does matter and it is pretty affordable. I heard several people speak well of the store and the product on different forums. And finally because I am hoping with the lack of blushing the prep work between applications should be minimized.

Now for the recoat of the outside I have beat my head against the wall for a good while and the choice has been a dificult one to say the least. I was almost sold on painting it with one of a few products either one of the epoxy paints of an automotive paint. But I have finally decided on going with a gelcoat finish. Though I have never sprayed it, I know it takes massive amounts of labor to finish it out and it will likely require some work every few years to keep it looking good I think it is the best choice. Every other finish will require a recoat or refinish sooner or later and most likely quite a bit sooner than a good gelcoat finish. For my family the royal blue metal flake that was the original color was a pain to maintain with the repolish and eventual clearcoating required to keep it looking good though I believe part of this was due to the darkness of the color and the truth is it looked awesome on the water. To pay homage to that original color I plan on using a white with either blue flake or blue pearl and doing the graphics in a metalic blue vinyl which would be a reversal of the original color scheme. My final decision to make is whether to try and shoot it myself of farm it out though the farm out scares me due to price and the doing it myself scares me for making the pearl of metal flake look good since they are usually the most difficult to shoot.

More to follow....

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Hello again,

Tonight I started to tear into the floor and discovered a few things. The wood was in much better shape than I expected. for the most part it is still solid, the surfaces are blackened and its very dry and brittle but still in decent structural shape. I did notice some delamination of the plywood but mostly only on the edges. All of the wood though black on the outside was still light colored on the inside and was a real pain to cut (I will definetely need more blades to get it done) since it is quite hard in some areas.

The foam was even more suprising. Not only was it in good shape with minimal degradation, it was entirely dry!. Now this doesn't mean I would have left it since it was starting to rot and it was only a matter of a little time before it got real bad I was surpised to see it in that good of shape which I guess is a testament to how well my step dad cared for it.

What concerns me the most is how the stringers were done. I knew they were likely marine grade spruce and I expected them to be wrapped in fiberglass. what I found was what looks like very sloppy tabing of the stringers to the bottom in a very sloppy manner with loose fiberglass hanging out/off everywhere and none going over the stringers. Knowing that polyester resin doesn't adhere to wood very well at all the only strength I think there was in the stringers was from the tabs them self being simply a fiberglass rib. Since I know that survived about 34 summers of skiing and boating here in Washington I think anything I do will likely be overkill.

I will get more pics posted once I get most or all of the floor out and have some more choice ones to post.

As allways I appreciate any thoughts, comments or criticism!

Have a great weekend and I hope your weather is as nice as mine!

XateEsix

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Hello again,

I haven't got anymore pics posted yet.
The removal of the floor has been considerably more challenging than I expected it to be. Since the wood is still pretty solid and quite hard and dry its wreaking havoc on my tools and blades. The areas that have or had some rot cut out really easy but the rest of it is so hard and dry that its dulling or burning up the blades. I will post some pics as soon as I get to a decent point in the process.

Thank you

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Keep at I cant wait to see this done.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

A good blade on a circular saw would cut the boat into match sticks.!

What are you using?, a sawzall worked for me, good blades are necessary whatever saw you use.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Agreed on the blades. Cheap blades wont last. Go buy yourself a nice blade and you will know the difference right away!

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Hello again,

Thank you all for your input.

I started off with a mini circular saw with carbide blade but it just destroyed the blade. The problem isn't the fiberglass. Its actually in the wood from 2 causes. For starters the wood is rediculously hard, I have worked on old recycled lumber that was hard but this makes that look easy and then on top of that when I make a cut in the sole the plywood seems to be under pressure and is pinching the blades. I am changing over to large circular saw with a carbide demolition blade which should make short work of it. I have avoided the sawzall so far because I am concerned about punching holes in the bottom. Even though I know they are fixable the idea still makes my @$#@ pucker.

On another note I had a bunch of supplies show up yesterday and I have to get it in gear. My resin, cloth, tools and penske board all showed up!!!! I even got bonused! I ordered penske board without backing with the intention of adding cloth when I laminiated it. But I recieved it with backing applied for the same price!! WooHoo!!!!

No excuses now its tiome to get busy!!

Thanks guys, I will post pics when I get a chance, I have to smoke a brisket for my uncles bday tomorow so it may be sunday or monday before I get to it.

lates

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

Good evening everyone,

Well I got the sole removed. The full sized circular saw did make short work of it. Though some of the plywood was delaminated none of it was obviously rotten. You may notice the dampness though in the last photo.
Take notice of the condition of the foam, it is in pretty good shape. Also what I noticed the most was the condition of the fiberglass wrapping the stringers, most of it was curled away from the stringers and not attached to the tabs at the bottom. It was so loose you will notice the piece I pulled up in the second photo which was quite easy to do.

More to come once I get the foam removed.

Re: 1971 Chrysler Conqueror Model 260 Shallow Vee Project

I found the rot.. I found the rot!!! Got most of the foam out, and found water and rot all through the bilge and transom area. I knew it was there some where! I must say having seen situation where the foam had to be scooped and scraped out like mud or dirt its nice to have it come out in big or complete chunks.

I have to say that even with the rot it looks like the transom and stringers may come out in one piece which I know will be nice for using as templates to create new ones.

More to come.. I will grab pics after I get the foam out with just the stingers and then with the stringers out when I get there.

lates

Protective coverall choices?!?!?!

Protective coverall choices?!?!?!

Hello everyone,

So far on this project I have been using the tyvek disposable coveralls from home depot at about $10 a suit which can get a bit exponsive after a few suits.

I have been shopping around online for a more cost effective option and I came across multiple listings for a "Poly Pro" suit that costs about $1 to $1.50each. Now that sounds like a good price. They claim to be suitable for use as protection from non hazardous liquids and particulates.
They seem to be considerably lighter and more translucent than the Dupont ones they sell at home depot.

Has anyone used these as protection from fiberglass sanding particulates and epoxy resins? Do they work as well as the more expensive suits? I realize they probably snag and tear easier but if thats the only real issue than I think I can live with it.

Thank you all for any advise you may have!