AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

pcmpete · Dec 20, 2009

Hi all, I get a clunk sound when engaging the drive, I have read that it can either be the idle is too high and/or there is too much end-play in the 270's shaft.
My questions are:
1. What is the lowest the idle can be set at on the AQ130c? The smoothest/lowest I can get is 800rpm (with pertronix ignitor)

2. I have not yet checked the end play in the drive, but if there is too much end-play can the 'Nut' be replaced without removing the upper drive unit?

Thanks for your time.

Don S · Dec 20, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Idle speed on the 130C should be between 900 and 1000, so that is not your problem.

2. I have not yet checked the end play in the drive, but if there is too much end-play can the 'Nut' be replaced without removing the upper drive unit?

No, it's not a problem with the top nut, it's a problem with the brass washer that set on the circlips on the lower bearing of the upper gear box.
To fix it, you have to replace that washer, along with checking the rest of the shimming and gear contact of the upper gear.

pcmpete · Dec 20, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Thank you for your quick reply Don, I will update this thread when I check the end-play.

Don S · Dec 20, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

You can not check the end play under the top nut, with out taking the upper gear box off and pushing up on the vertical shaft. Then it needs to be between .004 and .020 inches.

pcmpete · Dec 20, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Thanks again, you put google to shame

Don S · Dec 20, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

pcmpete said:
Thanks again, you put google to shame

Thanks !!!
Google didn't go to all the Volvo tech schools and work on those drives year after year like I did.

captmello · Dec 21, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Can you guys explain this in more detail. I'd like to check mine as well. I've got my upper off right now.

Thanks

Don S · Dec 21, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Page 42 of the 280 service manual covers checking the gap on the top nut. Just set the upper gear box vertical shaft on the bench to push it up, and measure the gap.

captmello · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

I checked my clearance and it appears to be a bit loose.

Mine measured .028.

Book says .004 - .020.

[/IMG]

So what do I do to fix it?

Have you checked yours yet Pete?

captmello · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Don S said:
No, it's not a problem with the top nut, it's a problem with the brass washer that set on the circlips on the lower bearing of the upper gear box.
To fix it, you have to replace that washer, along with checking the rest of the shimming and gear contact of the upper gear.

Reread the thread. So I guess it's not a matter of simply tightening up the nut.

How important is it to get this issued fixed? Should it be made a priority? Is there a risk of further damage?

Don S · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

.028 is out of specs, I have seen them in the .060 to .080 range.

It's usually the brass washer on the bottom of that shaft being worn or damaged from high rpm shifts that cause the excess play. I've never tried replacing the washer without dissassembly of the unit. But it may have enough movement by removing that big nut, pushing the shaft down so the washer can be pushed down to expose the circlips. (That sometimes takes some hammering on the washer because it gets bent up around the circlips.)
I also replace those circlips when the washer is replaced.

I would get it fixed. It just makes that much more movement for the shaft when shifting.

captmello · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

I've never tried replacing the washer without dissassembly of the unit. But it may have enough movement by removing that big nut, pushing the shaft down so the washer can be pushed down to expose the circlips. (That sometimes takes some hammering on the washer because it gets bent up around the circlips.)
I also replace those circlips when the washer is replaced.

Well, I might give it a shot if you think its possible.

Here's a pic of the brass washer and circlips. The washer looks good.

[/IMG]

I'm having trouble picking out the brass washer and circlips on this parts breakdown. Can You tell which parts I need?

http://www.volvopentastore.com/Upper_Gear_Unit_Drive_275a/dm/*******.387906339--**********.563098333--store_id.366--view_id.315414

Don S · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

51 and 52 are the item numbers in the link.

If the gear box was shimmed right when it was put together, and had the right sized top nut, then the only thing that can be wrong is the washer (Spacer) and circlips (lockrings)

muc · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

51 and 52
Good Luck Muc

captmello · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Well I took a shot at removing the top nut. No luck with that. I was turning it to the right as the book says left hand threads on that nut. I clamped the lower end of the shaft in a vice between two pieces of oak (just like the pros would do it) but no, couldn't keep the shaft from turning.

Any Ideas? Impact wrench maybe?

Don S · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

I clamped the lower end of the shaft in a vice between two pieces of oak (just like the pros would do it) but no, couldn't keep the shaft from turning.

That's not how this pro does it. We use an old coupler (the one that goes between the upper and intermediate housing) and weld it to a piece of angle iron. Then clamp it in a vise and set put the lower shaft in the coupler. Now it won't turn.

Like this

PiratePast40 · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

I used a 3 pound sledge and a breaker bar to get the nut loose. The problem is being able to hold it when applying 88.5 lbs. tightening torque when you put it back together.

Just wanted you to be aware of the hazards when you don't have the proper tools to do it the right way. Am afraid I know first hand !:redface:

captmello · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

PiratePast40 said:
I used a 3 pound sledge and a breaker bar to get the nut loose.

Now those tools I do have.

But I can't imagine how they helped to keep the shaft from turning.

I got it pretty tight between the oak boards. I may try them again tomorrow. I think I could tighten the nut it in the vice. Loosening it however...

PiratePast40 · Dec 26, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

captmello said:
But I can't imagine how they helped to keep the shaft from turning.

Put the coupler on the shaft and used a pair of vice grips on the coupler. Still had to smack it pretty hard a few times to break it loose. I was really trying to get at the point that you can muscle it off but I wouldn't recommend that method.

At the end of my ham fisted attempts, had to take it to someone who actually knew how to do all the backlash measurements and adjustments as well as set the rolling torque, and do all the other shimming that goes with teardown and new seals.

Really didn't want to get too deep into the part that I messed up - just wanted to caution you to be careful

.

captmello · Dec 27, 2009

Re: AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

PiratePast40 said:
Put the coupler on the shaft and used a pair of vice grips on the coupler. Still had to smack it pretty hard a few times to break it loose. I was really trying to get at the point that you can muscle it off but I wouldn't recommend that method.

At the end of my ham fisted attempts, had to take it to someone who actually knew how to do all the backlash measurements and adjustments as well as set the rolling torque, and do all the other shimming that goes with teardown and new seals.

Really didn't want to get too deep into the part that I messed up - just wanted to caution you to be careful .

I think I can remember your fight with that. Taught me a lot.
I've no intention of tearing apart the upper. I just thought I'd see if I could get the brass washer off without tearing it down, like Don mentioned.

If I can remove the existing washer without the teardown, I'll order up the parts. That brass washer is over 50 bucks.

I can't afford to have the upper rebuilt this year. As of last fall, the drive was working great. Slight thump when shifting into reverse. Hopefully this is what is causing my thump. I love the way my drive goes into forward, can't feel or hear when it goes into gear.

Regarding the hammer, You used the hammer as the impact tool on the breaker bar to free up the nut? You clamped the vise grip on the coupler tight enough to hold the shaft and reused the coupler?

AQ130c idle and 270 drive clunk

Petty Officer 1st Class

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Petty Officer 1st Class

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Petty Officer 1st Class

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Captain

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Captain

Captain

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Attachments

Captain

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

"Retired" Association of Marine Technicians...

Captain

Honorary Moderator Emeritus

Attachments

Lieutenant Commander

Captain

Lieutenant Commander

Captain