SOLVED Bad battery or am I missing something?

thedukeryan

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I have a nearly new battery in my boat. I believe its only a few months old. Anyways I started having problems. i would charge it up 100% only for it to be dead the next day. I had to jump my boat several times with a booster pack while on the water. After jumping it I would cruise for say 20 minutes and it would start back up fine. I took it ot NAPA and they said the battery was "good". At first i thought maybe something was pulling juice so I charged up up 100% today. Started the boat just fine. After running say 10 minutes I shut it off. Started it back up again but it was pretty reluctant. I again let it run for a bit... With the boat still running I unscrewed the quick connect to the + and the engine still ran fine. Killed the engine with the battery still disconnected went back a hour later and hooked the battery back up. When I tried to start it again all I would get is a very slow turn over but no start. Hooked the booster pack back up and it started up just fine. As mentioned its a new battery from NAPA and tehy said it tested good. With that said they hooked it up to the charger for a hour then straight to the battery tester. Can you think of any other possible issues that could be causing this or is NAPA just trying to get out of replacing a battery?
 

Tyme2fish

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

I'm no expert so please don't take what I say as the Gospel. It sounds like you MAY have a bad battery. I'd request a replacement and see what happens. If another battery goes "bad" then you have other issues.
What is connected to this battery? What could be pulling current? etc.?

I haven't stayed at Hoilday Inn for years so again, I'm not an expert.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

With the boat still running I unscrewed the quick connect to the + and the engine still ran fine.
By doing this, you probably killed your alternator. You need to check the battery voltage while the engine is running to see if your are charging your battery. Should be close to 14V. Also check the voltage of your battery to see if is indeed fully charged. A fully charged battery is 12.7V with no load.

You are not the first person to do the alternator trick and won't be the last probably. :)

You may also have a starter that is failing or bad connections at your battery, starter or block. Check all of your connections including the ground
 

wingless

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

A long time ago charging systems tolerated removing the battery while running.

New systems don't, unless the battery disconnect switch is also wired to interrupt the field coil. If the field coil connection is broken, then the energy that fries the regulator and diodes is stopped. This is not common.

Check your diode pack, your regulator and your alternator output.

The battery test sounds good, so if it's going dead, then it is the alternator, the regulator / diodes or the wiring.
 

thedukeryan

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Ok I still had my deep cycle hooked up to the engine when I disconnected the battery. Would the deep cycle be enough to save me from frying the alternator when I removed the "starting" battery? Also the starter is brand new I just put it in last week. I have the battery charging again and will test the voltage here shortly.
 

flargin

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

If you had your AB switch to both, it would save it, or if you had it wired.

take the alternator out and bring it to napa and have them check it.

have you taken a volt meter to the system and seen what the voltage is? I would start there.
If 14v+ when running, good to hear
if 12v when running, not good.

You likely have a serious short, it could be in the alternator, or not, but you have something pulling a serious drain. Yes it could be a bad battery (they can be sold DOA) but if they tested it, likely it would be ok.

Maybe an interesting question is why did you change your starter, there may be a connection?
 

thedukeryan

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Ok I pulled the alternator yesterday but could not find a single place that could/would test it :-( I also tried to find a new one with in driving distance but again no luck. I will be ordering one Monday and install it as soon as it arrives. We replaced the starter due to it not engaging. We would just get a click when trying to start the engine. Replaced the starter and it started fine after that. With that said the battery problems came up right around the same time as the starter problems.
 

flargin

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Ok I pulled the alternator yesterday but could not find a single place that could/would test it :-( I also tried to find a new one with in driving distance but again no luck. I will be ordering one Monday and install it as soon as it arrives. We replaced the starter due to it not engaging. We would just get a click when trying to start the engine. Replaced the starter and it started fine after that. With that said the battery problems came up right around the same time as the starter problems.

Sometimes just clicking is a loose connection problem. This may be the same.. you may want to try to pull and clean and replace the wires from the starter to the battery as well. may be a loose / dirty connection problem

have you tested your voltage during these events? one key to a loose connection is the battery voltage will usually not drop (10v) during the start cycle, also the charging systems can be monitored with a voltmeter.
 

Silvertip

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Whoa back son! You are spending money on parts that you have not proven are defective. Chances are the starter clicking you observed was due to a bad solenoid or your original battery issue. Do not replace the alternator until you've proven it's bad. Start the engine and measure the system voltage (don't charge the battery first). If the voltage at 1000 - 1500 RPM is 13.6 - 14.2 the alternator is working and you have something else drawing down the battery.
 

waterinthefuel

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Silver tip is right. Stop spending money throwing parts at that thing until you can find a problem. I think you're spending money you dont need to. If you have a volt meter/ammeter you can check your old starter (if you still have it.) It should show some ohm resistance across it but not infinite. If it does show some ohm resistance (but not zero either) then it's actually good and you can put it aside as a spare part for later on.

You actually can check it easier if you're careful. Just take jumper cables and hook them up to a battery, hook the positive to one side of the starter and bump the other side, it will spark, but the starter should jump. If it does your starter is fine. Caution: Do this away from any flammable materials!!
 

slia67

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Maybe I missed this, but what kind of boat and drive set-up are we talking about? Where are you located?

What you're discribing sounds more like a bad battery, or bad connections as others have mentioned. If it were me, I would check the draw on the battery too.

Do you have an Autozone near you? (not that I'm a fan of AZ) They will test alternators.
 

thedukeryan

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

The starter was under warranty so no money out of pocket. The battery is new and tested good. I did hook a multi meter to the battery while running and was getting about 10 volts :-( The reason I am going with a alternator is because the battery was fresh off the charger 100%. Hooked it up started the engine ran it for say 10 minutes. Tried starting it again and just got a very weak turn over. The battery was dead. Then I started it again with a freshly charged booster pack. Started ok but was reluctant. Let it run say 5 minutes and removed the booster pack. As soon as i removed the booster pack the engine died. I checked the booster pack and it had gone from 100% to very low. This leads me to believe that the engine was strictly running off the battery and booster pack. I tried to take the alternator to NAPA, Orileys & Auto Zone. None of them would test it.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

What is the voltage with the engine running?
 

thedukeryan

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Voltage was just over 10 with the engine running and my deep cycle, starting battery and booster pack all hooked up. The engine died as soon as I removed the booster pack. All of the freshly charged batteries and booster pack where dead after say a 10 minute run of the engine. Leads me to believe that the engine was running purely off the batteries. I tried every auto store near by to test the alternator none of them could :-( I went ahead and bought a new one off of Ebay for $100 shipped.
 

Silvertip

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

You have another issue. An engine should run far longer than 10 minutes before it kills a battery. The reason the auto stores won't test the alternator is because it "looks" different than a standard automotive alternator. Let's try an on-boat load test. Hook your voltmeter to a fully charged battery. While watching the voltmeter, start the engine and see how low the voltage drops. Just as a reminder, how big a battery are we talking about here. Are you sure it has enough capacity to actually spin the engine. And once again, what engine are we talking about.
 

flargin

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Voltage was just over 10 with the engine running and my deep cycle, starting battery and booster pack all hooked up. The engine died as soon as I removed the booster pack. All of the freshly charged batteries and booster pack where dead after say a 10 minute run of the engine. Leads me to believe that the engine was running purely off the batteries. I tried every auto store near by to test the alternator none of them could :-( I went ahead and bought a new one off of Ebay for $100 shipped.

I think you have a dead battery. as silvertip indicated a fully charged battery can run a motor for a long time without an alternator.

I would also recommend you take and isolate the batteries and charge them. I have a feeling one will not stay at 12v for very long, even after a full 8 hour charge with a good charger.
 

thedukeryan

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Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Re: Bad battery or am I missing something?

Ok I have the issue worked out. Today I received the new alternator. Put it in and then went to connect the batteries. It was then that I smet a horrible rotten egg smell. Removed the termanals and called a mechanic friend. After a 5 minute conversation it was agreed on that my deep cycle was shot. Went to Walmart and bought a new Neverstart battery. Ran home put it in and everything is good to go. Now I guess this doesnt really answer what exactly the problem was but atleast my boat is running and Im happy. Could of been the battery, alternator or both. My mechanic friend said that a bad alternator can cause your battery to go bad so maybe it was both. Either way I'm happy and only dropped $170 between the battery and alternator. Well worth it considering that a shop a hour away would of charged me that just for looking at it. Plus they are booked for three weeks.
 

Silvertip

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Re: SOLVED Bad battery or am I missing something?

Let me get this straight. You install a new alternator, connect the battery and get smoke. Does that sound right to you? A bad battery does not make that happen because it is weak or dead and can't make smoke. Yes, a bad alternator can drain a battery. But a new one should not. So I will wait for the next issue to pop up as I don't think you solved anything.
 

thedukeryan

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Re: SOLVED Bad battery or am I missing something?

Sorry I should of been more clear. I have two batteries. I did not get the rotten egg smell until I hooked the starting battery up to the deep cycle. Not much smoke but a horrible rotten egg smell and a slight fizzing/bubbling sound. Either way I had no intentions of keeping the deep cycle with what it was doing. I was told that these symptoms can be very hazardous.
 

slia67

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Re: SOLVED Bad battery or am I missing something?

So what you're saying is,... You had a bad battery?!

When you disconnected the batteries while running you probably blewout your diode bridge.

In the future whenever you have an electrical issue disconnect all of your batteries from each other, charge them seperately, and test them individually. One bad battery will pull down the other batteries whether wired in series or parallel.

Good Luck.
 
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