Economy - mixed signals

Put ad on Craigslist yesterday to sell my '99 Buick Regal LSE with 77,738 miles and within 10 minutes, the time it took for the ad to actually get posted, the phone rang.

When I placed the ad I wasn't sure if no one would call because of the economy, or if everyone would call because of the economy. After an hour and a half and a dozen calls I pulled the ad. All of them wanted the car for their wife or son or daughter, and all of them had cash. One was 80 miles away. I sold it to the first guy who called. He paid my asking price.

It kind of proved a theory I have been wondering about for quite some time. Yes, the economy is tough for a lot of people right now, but it makes you think how many others are out there who are doing just fine, who moved out of the stock market before it tanked, and who have a boatload of cash just sitting on the sidelines just waiting to get good deals and reinvest in the market. I've read the amount of cash on the sidelines is in the $trillions.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Agree. Although wall st stole half my son's college investment portfolio, and all you hear from the media is the impending Apocalypse, I have never seen heaver traffic around shopping areas, or all types of retail, restaurant, ect parking lots stuffed with cars, like I've noticed for the past 6 weekends or so.
It has been putting past "Christmas rushes" to shame. All these people gotta be spending something.
I'll say it again - ignore ALL media, and live your life as normal.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Wait a minute. How much was your Buick? Also, that year with those miles was probably reassuring to those that called. A sales of a ten year old Buick can in no way define the state of affairs relating to our economy.
In the county I live the unemployment rate is over 8%. Our local strip centers are dying for tenants. The largest just had Circuit City and Linens and Things bail out on them. If those people with all the cash are spending any of it, it doesn't show.
Thank God I no longer HAVE to work, I just make do with some retirement money, a working wife ( god bless her) and a small tackle business. Good jobs are hard to come by around my neck of the woods. More and more property is being listed, but not many sales. And, hell, this is Florida!
JMHO I think we have a ways to go before much "change" is going to take place. Methinks things will get a bit worse before anything gets better.....

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Watch it, guys.

Make this political and it is history.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

triumphrick said:

Wait a minute. How much was your Buick? Also, that year with those miles was probably reassuring to those that called. A sales of a ten year old Buick can in no way define the state of affairs relating to our economy.
In the county I live the unemployment rate is over 8%. Our local strip centers are dying for tenants. The largest just had Circuit City and Linens and Things bail out on them. If those people with all the cash are spending any of it, it doesn't show.
Thank God I no longer HAVE to work, I just make do with some retirement money, a working wife ( god bless her) and a small tackle business. Good jobs are hard to come by around my neck of the woods. More and more property is being listed, but not many sales. And, hell, this is Florida!
JMHO I think we have a ways to go before much "change" is going to take place. Methinks things will get a bit worse before anything gets better.....

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I priced it at the high end of the "Private Party" excellent range according to Kelly Blue Book for this region. It was a fair price for both seller and buyer.

That same day there appeared a new ad on Craigslist for a 2007 Toyota Sienna XLE with 23k miles for $19.9k. It was sold that day as well.

My point is I think there are a lot of smart (and perhaps lucky) people out there who didn't get mixed up in the subprime mess, who actually own their own homes outright, who have conservative portfolios, and who have little or no debt.

I'm guessing they won't be willing to budge much until the housing situation improves, and by that I mean for housing prices to not only stop declining, but to actually start increasing once again. Until that happens I worry that our "sideliners" won't be willing to buy or invest again.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

sure there are those out there that are better off, and made good decisions. where it is really hurting is the guys, who lived paycheck to paycheck. and did not have a pot to pi$$ in.

i feel i'm in decent shape, i like Rick, have a secure retirement income. feel very fortunate, at this time.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

I am depending on Ford for a retirement. Just guess how much discreshenary money I'm spending. Not including fishing of course.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

On a semi-related note: I really miss my 2000 Regal LSE. That was damn nice car. We traded it in along with my wife's gas guzzling Pacifica on a 2007 Impala that we both hate

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Reason shopping centers are busy is because tax refunds are coming in. Happens every year in the retail world. In April it will tail off. Next three months are usually pretty good as far as spending goes.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

I would definitely not agree with the notion that a 10 year old Buick selling for asking price on Craigslist is any indication of the economy as a whole. I was watching a 160 dollar gunscope on Ebay, and it sold for the buy it now price. Thank goodness, because that means the economy is coming back!

Seriously, there are a lot of people hurting out there right now. A buddy of mine, who's been employed without a break since 1990 and has gobs of experience lost his job and a couple of weeks later his wife had to have emergency surgery in the hospital. He sold his home and had to move in with his wife's parents and they're in their late 30's to early 40's. He's now working night shift part time to try to make ends meet.

I saved up from the time I was a baby until I graduated high school. I invested that money into several different mutual funds. Since 2000, I lost everything I saved for the first 18 years of my life, and my only investments now are is the money that I made since then and have invested in other places, and that lost about half of it's value.

Sorry to say, but your Buick doesn't show the big picture. There are a lot of people hurting right now.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Who in the 'ell would buy a 10 year old Buick in a good economy? The fact that it sold speaks volumes.

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My family has gotten through this well BUT if we lost are JOBS we would be SOL right now


The sunday paper help wanted is down about 100 pages

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Here is a loooooong winded thought on that,

Sure there are people who are spending, and for all intents and purposes it looks like there isn't a thing to worry about.....to some.

That's the very thing that'll get people into financial hardship, spending at a time when all things point to a crumbling economy and when a devastated national financial system lurks in the fog up ahead which has not quite become a reality for them....yet.
They still have their jobs and they still are not really paying attention to the growls and grumbles of that approaching monster.

I have continually been employed for myself and others for 40 plus years in various sectors of the workforce.
Everything looked good and there were no real indications of any problems other than the seasonal slowdowns as usual.
I was laid off just at Newyears, after being told that I would be one of the last to go if any problems came up.

I was one of the last 8 to go. There are 7 left working out of 70.

While not having worked since the 19th of December other then a few days, I was not told 'til January that I had no job.
My loss.

There litterally are thousands like me who had similar treatment.
Secure one day, and jobless the next.

The indications that something like this could happen, were there for anyone to see to at least take some notice and provide for protection against that eventual result.
I feared with a gnawing urgency that a economic disaster could well be approaching a few years back and that I should start saving and putting away funds for the time that could come when jobs and a weak economy would crumble like dry cookies under a boot.

The last five years have put me in a reasonably safe financial situation, through saving and carefully building for an unsure future.

Lucky me!

I had no clue that a recession would come this soon, and with the severity that it hit with when it did!

I am sure there is millions who do not think ahead and will experience the same disasters when they hit, except,.....that they WILL be devastated and that there'll be NO jobs available.

I am aware that there is groups of people in other areas who are totally not affected by it (yet?) and live like there is no tomorrow, nor are they aware of (or are sticking their heads in the sand) that there is indeed a crisis building, and can't really fathom the concept of eventually being broke and busted.

I don't worry so much now, I mostly live for the moment and coast on lucky guesses and savings, sofar so good.
I am not going to lose my home, and staple foods are always stocked and money was saved long before the problem grew into the proportions that we are experiencing up here today, but I don't know how long I can keep that up if the economy gets worse or lasts for an exeptionally long time.

The economic situation is itchy and scratchy everywhere, and I can't see much improvement on the way (purely my thought only) even though the governments of both our countries have scrambled to the occasion and are trying to salvage what can be salvaged. (That's right, I think irreversible damage has already been done and has surprised and confused even the fearless leaders in the wheelhouse.)

The folks who are still spending and living it up must either be well off, have lots of credit or are just not worried about it.....yet.

If I could offer a suggestion, I would definitely say; From now on?...seriously!...Don't spend needlessly,....save every penny you can, reduce your debt, don't buy anything on credit, and harder yet, reduce your debtload as fast as you can and still stock up on anything you can think of for your sustenance and well being (except peanut butter), because this recession will turn depression (again my guess) and is not going to go away anytime soon, Obama or not.

It WILL get worse, that's what I believe.
I think it hasn't even come around to a real culmination of the initial downturn yet, in other words we are still beginning, not at the end of it.

And because I live up here,..
Don't let the geographical difference between Canada and the US stand in the way of sound judgement, as we all are in the same boat with rotten stringers and transom economically,...it'll float and drive, but it isn't safe against bigger waves.

I feel that it will be a "worldwide" problem pretty soon.
Take care,
PH

Re: Economy - mixed signals

it already is a world wide problem, foreign investors have money tied up here, and are not being repaid, the financial market is lousy, money tied up, no one willing to lend anymore. OVER INDULGENCE.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

It's amazing the can of worms a 10 year-old Buick can open.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

There is and always be a minor percentile of people wealthy enough to be basically unaffected by the economy. I know it's not me but I do thank the Lord for the job and company I work for. 21 years same company..

A bright note is that I just learned that Wells Fargo has worked with us on our home loan. We signed into one of those too good to be true low money down new construction homes, our payment as of last month was close to 2,400 (ARM of course)
We told them that unless they help us, we can not continue this way...
After a long wait, they put us on a fixed AND our new payments are almost a thousand dollars a MONTH less...

I never would have walked away from my home (never bluffed so well in my life) but keeping up that payment would keep me from the $$ resources to travel and do my job correctly, so the end result would be losing the home when I got canned.

Re: Economy - mixed signals

projecthog said:

The folks who are still spending and living it up must either be well off, have lots of credit or are just not worried about it.....yet.

If I could offer a suggestion, I would definitely say; From now on?...seriously!...Don't spend needlessly,....save every penny you can, reduce your debt, don't buy anything on credit, and harder yet, reduce your debtload as fast as you can and still stock up on anything you can think of for your sustenance and well being (except peanut butter), because this recession will turn depression (again my guess) and is not going to go away anytime soon, Obama or not.

It WILL get worse, that's what I believe.
I think it hasn't even come around to a real culmination of the initial downturn yet, in other words we are still beginning, not at the end of it.

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Not sure how many have ever heard of Liz Ann Sonders. She's a senior vice president at Charles Schwab who sometimes appears on TV and often appears on Schwab's website. Anyway, Liz Ann has what she calls the "Emotional Roller Coaster" graph that charts over time the various emotions we go through in each economic cycle. The part of the curve above the line is "Optimism" while that part of the curve below the line is "Pessimism."

In the "Optimism" part we go through "Enthusiasm" and "Exhilaration" before reaching the peak at "Euphoria." As the curve starts back down we go through "Unease" and then "Denial" before going past the baseline into the "Pessimism" part.

Then we pass through "Panic" and then "Capitulation" before hitting the bottom of the cycle. That's called "Despair." From there the curve starts to rise again through "Hope" and then "Relief" before finally getting back to the baseline and "Optimism."

For what it's worth, Liz Ann thinks we have passed through "Capitulation" and have entered "Despair."

I'm hoping those on the sidelines who are sitting on their cash and have no debt will start spending again to help us into "Hope."

Re: Economy - mixed signals

i386 said:

Who in the 'ell would buy a 10 year old Buick in a good economy? The fact that it sold speaks volumes.

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Quite frankly that is a dead on comment, The 5-7000 dollar car is one of the hottest commodities in the car market...now if that car was sold for 2-2500 with 77k which i suspect was the case now you know how desperate people are.

One thing that has changed people are driving there cars into the dust now..shopping harder than ever before...it's like the old movie used cars...you know where the salesman ties a 20 dollar bill to fishing line and watched the customers chase it all over the lot..until they blindly run head first into something...

Re: Economy - mixed signals

Just another reminder for people to live within their means, no matter what shape the economy is in!

Re: Economy - mixed signals

I was talking with a few colleagues of mine from Europe the other night over dinner. We where dining in a nice restaurant in Jacksonville and they noted that you couldn?t tell by the number of people in the restaurant that times where as tough as the local media was making out .

The funny thing about a recession is that it?s self manifesting. Times are hard because consumers either can?t or are unwilling to purchase the goods and services needed to help put the people back to work. The National media?s exploitation of the problem to sell newspapers and advertising is a disgrace. A little more education on the subject and a little less sensationalism would be much appreciated.