Has anyone or does anyone know what material I can use to build two separate speaker boxes for 10"inch speakers. I can't use particle wood beacuse it would soak up the water and eventually fall apart. The boxes are only going to be about 14"inches wide by 8"inches high and about 8" inches deep.
Thanks,
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Angel
2007 Larson Senza 206 5.0GL I/O Volvo Penta 220hp
EZ Loader Trailer
2008 Nissan Pathfinder
Where would I be able to get marine plywood and carpet? Also would that would effect the sound of the speakers, I know that particle wood is mainly what is used because it helps the speakers get their full sound and not so empty of hollow. Have you used the marine plywood for any speakers?
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Angel
2007 Larson Senza 206 5.0GL I/O Volvo Penta 220hp
EZ Loader Trailer
2008 Nissan Pathfinder
I made a set of enclosures from a round carboard tube, the tubes they use for concrete forming (lamp post bases) you have to paint them with resin to make waterproof.
MDF (not particle board) is preferred because it has good qualities for a speaker enclosure, solid through out, uniform density, good dampening, etc. I'm sure the same holds true for expensive plywood since it has no voids and a high number of plys. Both can be used, though MDF will swell up like a puffer fish if water gets on it. But yeah, particle board is junk for building a speaker enclosure.
If it were mine I'd use Arauco plywood (lowes) and then seal the carp out of the exterior and edges to make sure everything is sealed 100%, including all screw holes. Cheap, but still a good quality plywood.
I like A70's idea also, though I have never tried those cardboard form tubes. Could cause some funky resonance or ringing since the cardboard is so hard.
I would think you could use the fiberboard and once you are finished with construction paint with good oil paint or seal them with some thinned resin, then carpet or whatever you were going to finish with. I agree that they could swell if un treated but if they were sealed up well would work fine. How much water are you going to be getting on them? Use the quick connectors and remove for winter or layup and you should be fine. Some of that plywood is way expensive just for a carpeted speaker box. Put some of those little rubber feet on the bottom corners so air can move around it.
I agree that MDF is going to give best sound quality.
I also agree that MDF and water don't mix.
My first thought of a comprimise was a thick plastic - Corian perhaps, or even fiberglass. For that matter fiberglass over the MDF.
You could also use a solid wood which is dense and more water resistant than MDF - Mahogany, Teak (how deep is you pocket?), perhaps even red oak.
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From my speaker building obsession days, MDF is the prefered material for most full freq range speakers. For subs, where the wavelengths are longer than any of the box dimensions, shear stiffness of the panel is more important. ie void free plywood is better. A well built home sub would have two layers of 3/4" plywood, or 3/4" plywood ext with mdf on the inside. Weighs a ton, and you don't move them very often.
Now, back to reality of the boat, where audiophile acceptable sound will never be achieved: a good compromize of weight vs stiffness, would be to use 5/8 ext plywood, with some internal bracing. Seal the boxes on the inside and outside to prevent moisture penitration. MDF would be extremely hard to seal, and keep sealed, on the ends. It is also heavier than the same thickness plywood. Lightly fill box with Acousta Stuff.
I have made sonotube subs and speaker enclosures, but different mfg of the tubes have different coatings. The unsealed ones would have the same problem as MDF to keep them sealed.
this is what they are made of.
Dense material such as void-free "marine-grade" plywood, Finnish or Baltic birch type, 19 mm (3/4 inch) or even
thicker plywood is recommended where enclosures will be transported frequently, while high-density fiber or
particle board (not chip board) can be used for permanently installed use.
Pro and guitar speakers are not designed for critical listening. They are designed to handle the harsh environment. Hense, why they are mainly made from plywood.
Pro guitar cabinets start with good ply and then go on to solid poplar. That's the difference between a $400 cabinet and a $1.000 not the speakers but the wood. Cheap semi pro stuff is particle board and cheap ply.
Why pay so much when a cheap-o with the same speakers costs only a couple hundred- sound quality.
Likewise with pro PA speakers and yes modern linear array's are designed for the quality of sound. Being able to handle the road is beyond being a given, it's all about quality.
Pro, concert, and instrument speakers are built to different design goals. I am not sure how else to say that. I suggest you search the net on "speaker building MDF" and you will find allot of info, including what I pasted in below. Sealed plywood is the way to go in the boat. Any grained wood will have expansion/contraction problems with the high humidity and temperature swings.
Q: Can I build speakers with {MDF | particle board | plywood | solid wood}?
A: You can build speakers with whatever you like ! However, MDF is often the material of choice. Its stiffness and density yield good accoustical damping properties. Particle board and plywood are cheaper and can still be used if cost is an issue. Plywood (especially if void free) can be used in the main baffle as a sandwich material to better hold fasteners. Plywood is also a good material for making braces inside speaker boxes. Solid wood (lumber) suffers from movement - the swelling and shrinking of wood due to environmental changes such as humidity - and is therefore not a good material for speaker enclosures. Lumber is also not as acoustically dead as MDF.
There are times however, when plywood, particle board and other common sheet goods are more than suitable for enclosures. Such possible uses include sound reinforcement, musical instrument cabinets, and PA systems.
Your absolutely right no type of pro equipment is designed like consumer stuff.
Pro studio monitors the stuff the music your listening to was recorded/mixed/mastered on are made of solid wood.
Semi-pro ones like the Alesis Monitor one MK2's I'm listening to are made of MDF the is specially built and ordered by the company just for that purpose(not what you get at Home Depot).
Either way you will never design a speaker cabinet that even remotely works or sounds even close to the quality of either one of the above.
You can make a speaker cabinet out of anything.
All your doing is taking a big guess on how they will work with the speakers you buy anyway.
I think we all are kind of in the same place on what to build them out of (although I think since your glassing it you'd be fine with 1/2" ply, it would be better then most of the speaker enclosures people have made for a car, but still try to go a better dense grade).
Don't really want to bog the thread down with it but- MDF doesn't sound best. Don't know how else to put it.
Pro guitar cabinets start with good ply and then go on to solid poplar. That's the difference between a $400 cabinet and a $1.000 not the speakers but the wood. Cheap semi pro stuff is particle board and cheap ply.
Why pay so much when a cheap-o with the same speakers costs only a couple hundred- sound quality.
Likewise with pro PA speakers and yes modern linear array's are designed for the quality of sound. Being able to handle the road is beyond being a given, it's all about quality.
Which JBL's?
i forget which ones he has. they were custom built. bought them from a family friend who has his own studio (also does home theater installs, band gigs, runs a tv station)
Semi-pro ones like the Alesis Monitor one MK2's I'm listening to are made of MDF the is specially built and ordered by the company just for that purpose(not what you get at Home Depot).
Either way you will never design a speaker cabinet that even remotely works or sounds even close to the quality of either one of the above.
I think you are grossly under-estimating the Speaker Building DIY community. Most serious home designers have more tied up in driver measuring eguip, CAD box design S/W, crossover design S/W, and nearfield measuring equipment, that would buy a number of pairs of these Alesis monitors.
I'm still sticking with my recommendation of the Arauco plywood. A 3/4 lay-up has something like 12 plies, is virtually void free and is soft enough that I think it would have good dampening characteristics.
After all, we are most likely talking about a pair of inexpensive subs that are being installed to give a bit of thump and rumble, not an audiophile quality installation.
Hey John anybody that even begins to think they can even remotely build a speaker cabinet that will function anywhere near what companies with the most experienced engineers using the most expensive research tools etc. is just plain out of it.
Every driver reacts differently as do crossovers and amps.
What about time alignment?
Your just guessing!
I had classes on speaker design in college, and I know what's out there for resources.
Unless you can honestly say your on John Meyers' level- your guessing.
The majority of people who build speaker cabinets are not even trying to get an accurate response.
Hey John anybody that even begins to think they can even remotely build a speaker cabinet that will function anywhere near what companies with the most experienced engineers using the most expensive research tools etc. is just plain out of it.
Every driver reacts differently as do crossovers and amps.
What about time alignment?
Your just guessing!
I had classes on speaker design in college, and I know what's out there for resources.
Unless you can honestly say your on John Meyers' level- your guessing.
The majority of people who build speaker cabinets are not even trying to get an accurate response.
It's about looking cool in your car etc.
you know JBL gives instructions on how to build theirs right? Its not hard. you just need to know cabinet to buld for that speaker. Its not like they are complicated.
I'm thinking the glass/resin seal will negate the softness for dampening.
That's why I said just use some 1/2" and glass.
No real need to add extra weight if the return isn't really there.
What do you think?
I was thinking of a 3/4"plywood enclosure, totally sealed on the exterior along with the cut edges for the sub and screw holes,,, but leave the interior unsealed for dampening. Yeah it's susceptible to moisture from the interior, but if the sub is leak-proof, the sub to enclosure seal is leak-proof and the box is leak-roof, moisture shouldn't be a problem,,, hopefully
I don't like fiberglassing the interior as the surface is too hard, reflects noise, ringing and it needs to have something applied to the glass to damped the glass's surface, just my experience from a couple of glass enclosures.
Need help building marine speaker boxes??
Re: Need help building marine speaker boxes??
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