'76 model Johnson running problems

jspry

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I took the carbureator off and thoroughly cleand it. The initial problem was I had to hold the choke to make to motor run. After cleaning and rebuild kit the motor will run without holding the choke but will not stay running and will not run in idle. Could this be a fuel pump issue or do I not have the screw adjustment right? Thanks for any help.
 

jspry

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Sorry about that. It is a 1976 35hp Johnson.
Thanks
 

Xcusme

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Try squeezing the primer bulb when running, if the motor continues to run, the fuel pump is suspect.

(Carburetor Adjustments - Two Adjustable N/Vs)
(J. Reeves)

Initial settings are: Bottom high speed = seat gently, then open 1 turn out. Top slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns.

Setting the high and low needle valves properly:

NOTE: For engines that DO NOT have a shift selection, obviously there is no NEUTRAL position. Simply lower the rpms to the lowest setting to obtain the low speed needle valve adjustment.

(High Speed) Start engine (it will run pretty rough), shift into forward gear, take up to full throttle. In segments of 1/8 turn, waiting for the engine to respond between turns, start turning in the bottom high speed needle valve. You'll reach a point whereas the engine will either start to die out or spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the needle valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest setting.

(Low Speed) Slow the engine down to where it just stays running. Shift into neutral. Again in segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the top needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running. Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back. Again, at that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting.

When you have finished the above adjustments, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.
 

jspry

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

I put a new fuel pump on and the motor will run fine at 1/4 throttle and above but when I take it down to idle it immediatley bogs out. I could not get the bottom screw on the carburetor to turn so I asked the shop. They said it was a fixed jet and would not turn. Is this the case? I have tried just about every position on the top screw. Any thoughts on what to do now? Thanks
 

Xcusme

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Yes, it appears that your carb does have a fixed High speed jet, non-adjustable. It you don't see much of any difference in the idle while adjusting the upper slow speed mixture needle, you still have an obstruction in the slow speed idle circuit.

Go here and lookup your motor.

http://shop2.evinrude.com/ext/index.aspx?s1=ccf40cafa3285b4aa74ca960350cc7f5

Drill down to the carb and pay attention to part #40, make sure it's installed. Remove part #5 and clean chamber, replace plug from kit. Needle packing # 29 should be sealing too. Replace float, float needle and seat. Adjust float level with carb body when inverted.
 

jspry

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Thanks for all your help. Call me stupid, but how do you get that part #5 out. Is there a tool for this or do you drill it out? Thanks
 

Xcusme

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Two 'tools' come to mind. Either use a sharp ice pick to pierce the plug and pry it out, it's just soft aluminum. Drill a hole through it and use an ice pick or nail to do the prying.

Now a word of caution: Don't drill too deep if you go the drill route. Use a 1/8" bit. The chamber below the plug is approximately 1/4 deep.

Personally, I use the ice pick method.
To replace the plug, place new plug with domed side (convex side) UP. Use a flat drift or a 3/8 socket drive extension to flatten the dome, this will effect a seal around the outer edge, and you're done. While you have the old plug out, you'll see small holes at the bottom of the chamber. These holes supply fuel to the carb throat at idle and mid range RPM's. Be sure all holes are open and clean. You should also see the tip of the Slow speed needle valve too.

Soak and or spray all carb openings with carb cleaner, followed with compressed air. A clean carb will respond to the mixture needle adjustments. If you see no change, it's still blocked or you missed a gasket, like part 29 and 40. The float has to be properly adjusted and the float needle sealing too.
 

jspry

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Xcusme, that link is awsome. I removed the plug, cleaned the well and holes, and replaced the plug and still having the same issue. I did notice something on it. The needle valve in the picture has a sharp pointed end. When I take mine out there is no pointed end. When I took the top plug out (part#5) I did see a sharp point protruding into the well but I had already taken the needle out. Is the sharp end supposed to stay in or is this the reason nothing happens when I turn the needle while it is running?
 

Xcusme

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Yikes, that explains a lot. That slow speed mixture needle shaft (and pointed end) should be in one piece. From what you're describing, the tip, or point has broken off of the main shaft and is stuck in the hole (seat). Usually I'll unscrew the needle a bit watching the tip retract from the hole and then turn clockwise to lightly seat it again. I watch the tip for any rotational movement indicating a possible bent tip. The tip does not have to be needle sharp, just pointy enough to enter the hole and seal when tightened with light pressure. You can remove the needle and inspect the tip. With the needle completely removed, there shouldn't be anything protruding from the hole (needle seat). Actually, the needle seat can have the same taper as the needle tip. This insures a gradual metering of fuel past that tip to fill the chamber just beyond. Sadly, since you have already replaced the aluminum plug, you can't see the in and out movement of the needle tip. What you don't want to see is the tip that has a ridge around the tapered portion of the tip. This results from the needle having been screwed in too tightly. Fuel won't freely pass over this ridge and it makes the needle setting hard to adjust. Tips that do have this ridge can be dressed with a fine tooth file while turning the needle in a drill on slow speed. You would want to maintain the original taper angle while you dress it back to an original shape. Fine emory cloth would then be used to polish the taper to remove any file marks , if any.

So to cut to the chase (at last)....if the needle tip has broken off and is closing off the needle seat, no fuel will flow for the idle circuit (into those little holes in the chamber). As a side note, there are 2 piece needles...the main needle shaft with an interference fit tip. If the tip has separated from the main shaft it would not screw in and out as it should, like in your case, the tip would block the seat and the main needle be removable. The fix, remove the aluminum core plug and push the tip in, towards the needle shaft hole and let it drop out. The tip should have an O.D. smaller than the I.D. of the main threaded needle shaft hole. Others more familiar with that carb might jump in here to confirm the 2 part needle construction.
If it is the 2 part needle, try removing the needle and holding the needle shaft hole pointing down. Lightly tap the upper carb body at the core plug hoping to dislodge the tip from its seat and with luck it will drop out of the threaded hole. If that fails, try inserting a thin ice pick into the threaded hole and wiggle the tip from it's seat. That tip shouldn't be jammed in it's seat , unless someone tightened it down to hard. Under normal motor operation the needle isn't fully seated anyway, it would be approx. 1 turn or so open (off the seat).
Removing the core plug and pushing the tip from the seat is an option, but you'd have to have a replacement core plug handy.
As a permanent fix for the 2 part needle, I'd solder tin the main needle shaft end and while still hot, replace the tip and let it cool. I wouldn't trust any type of epoxy or glue for this application. The soldering fix is an extremely strong repair and basically permanent. Light burnishing of the surfaces to remove any oxide followed with a bit of paste flux will insure a good solder repair. A small propane torch will do fine and the solder will easily flow. After the tip is replaced, heat the tip a bit to evenly heat the junction and let it cool.

As a last thought, if the end of the needle shaft doesn't look like it broke off the tip and is basically a machined flat perpendicular to the shaft, its more than likely a 2 part needle....
 

jspry

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Re: '76 model Johnson running problems

Xcusme, Got the needle point out and put back together. Now she runs like a top! I really appreciate all your advice. Thank you!
 
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