Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

Look what i have built Turin.
I saw those photos you put up of your crop of Capsicums: how tall they were, how close together, and how much fruit were on them.

So I got to thinking, why can't I copy you.
I already grow on a 2 storey/level system, so this time I have tried something taller....more levels.

This shed is only 8mx6m, but it holds 8,000 plants.
Remember it is only a trial to see what happens.
I choose clear plastic this time thinking I would get more light.
It is running Nth-Sth so the sun moves over the beds from the sides.

I have put zip doors on it, plus an inner mesh door ( I have major problems with caterpillars in spring/summer on all my slad crops (mustards, cress's, rockets etc), and I can't keep ahead of them without going outside my Chemical Residue Limits. (not that anyone has ever tested me at the Distribution Centre anyway).

Then in the winter i have trouble with Basil...it drops to 7C (night) here and growth of basil stops.
So I am hoping this shed may help out in winter.
I have only had it operational for 6 weeks, but not one caterpillar.
The crop on the top shelves is great, but on lower shelves on inside rows the basil stems are a little soft....no matter, they still look good when packaged.

I want your opinion and criticism on anything you feel revelant Turin.

Now for a question:
I have another shed (same size but taller) beside this. It is covered in white film. It raises my seedlings and cuttings very well. It is very 'white' inside.
Do you think....would it grow crop as well as my new one??
What sort of covers do the Dutch use and why??

Cheers
Phillip
PS in summer, if it is 40C outside, it must be well over 50C inside, if not more. When we built it, we could only last in there for about 3 minutes....had to come out, cool down and back in.
Got it vented, but should be ok with salad crops....I hope



i have 4 rows of tables, each 620mm apart....so a ladder fits in .


another row


This is one end. I had to allow for the vent to open (got a screen sewn in to the hole)


On the left is the new experimental one in clear film. On right the old in white.

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

well your caterpillar problem can be solved with out chemicals.
You could use Turex (brand name) its a sort of antrax but only lethal to caterpillars, the bacteria is called Bacillus thuringiensis.
In Holland it is allowed in biological crops to.

In Holland plastic covers are used but almost only when growing strawberry's and some times salad crops but then its just a few months so you can start your growing sooner or you can continue longer.

Most common is glass where i work we brought reduheat on the windows some people use redusol or just chalk.

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

Thanks Turin.
I have taken your advice and checked out Turex, Reduheat and Redusol.

How effective is the Turex?
I havn't used Dimethoate (systemic pesticide) for 12 mths, as even after 14 days with-holding, my chem residue tests were too high, plus it was only sort of effective.
I think it was getting the existing and developing caterpillars, but the infestations were so consistant (say on Rocket) were so severe I couldn't stop the next wave without spraying too frequently.
I now use Carboral which sort of works, but not really well.....so I had to stop growing the salad greens.....just couldn't get any decent stock out.
Works OK on the basil, and maybe 50% ok on the mint.

This Turex......I understand how it works, but does the residue stay on the plant leaf for long, so that the newly laid eggs and devloping ones get infected as soon as they chew, or is by direct contact (spray on caterpillar).

I am not kidding you Turin, moths can be in plague proportions.
I have 4 domestic moth traps (blue light, fan above, and water tray below, with a little Agral spreader in to break the surface tension).
For 6 mths of the yr, every morning I have to clean them out.....they are packed full of dead moths....hardly space for another one.

I don't want to have to house the complete crop......I mean, winter day temps drop to 20C, summer is 40C, so I end up with a continual ventillation problem and cost, and in the summer you can't last in there for more than about 3 mins.

If I can solve the problem with a spray.....much better.

Cheers
Phillip

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

Turex is better than chem because they don't get resistant they are just sick.
and start puking so they die after a while package says a week, its a powder. you are allowed to harvest the same day because its not a chem.

We start to use when we spot the first caterpillar wait until you spot them again and use again mostly 3 or 4 times a season(that's a lot of bang for the buck ) .

Do you have fans in side.

we use them and it works but 40C in summer and 20C in winter we glad when we have a constant 25C in summer in winter its everything from -10c to 10C

ive seen in Egypt they roll the plastic from the bottom of the tent about 5 inch from the ground and leave the doors open (they don't have to care about chem residu)

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

OK, so Turex will stay on the leaf as a residue, so as the caterpillars hatch and start feeding, they are infected, as opposed to having to hit them directly with the Turex.
Is that correct??
My plants grow to picking size in 4-6 weeks.
When I plant the raised seedlings out in to the system (they are small) I would spray them then.
Would that leave enough residue to effect the caterpilars, or do you think I should spray the whole crop once a week?

I don't have fans. I have a mesh screened vent at one end, and a mesh screened door.
I do not have rolled up sides, but if this experiment works and I built a bigger shed, then I would have to have roll-up sides (at least to 1.8 high) with mesh behind.

Probably difficult for you to understand what a plague looks like.
Let me explain it like this.
One year we had a plague of baby toads.
They came out of the dam and down my driveway.....they formed a dence carpet.
I sprayed them with endosulphan.....knocked them clean over.....did the whole driveway, 15 litres, turned around and there was another carpet of them replacing the 1st, just bouncing over the top.
After 40L of spray I just gave up and let them go.
When they had all passed thru, we got out the big broom and swept up the dead.
They were maybe quarter size of your small fingernail.
We filled a 240L rubbish bin with them.

So when I say we can get a lot of moths, believe me Turin, there are a lot.
I reckon they are born with a gene that says " free food at the herb farm" and a GPS in their heads set for my place.
Cheers
Phillip

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

Turex stays on the leaves so they are infected you dont have to hit the caterpillars so you could even use it before you see the any.

once a week would be way over done it takes a week to have effect.

wohhhaaa the toad story it realy amazing where do they come from?
cant you place an electric fence or something.

Re: Turin...look what I built....plus advice needed

OK, I will go with Turex.
Surprisingly we have had one night go way down to 10C and my water/light traps have few moths in them.
I guess this will continue for another 10-12 weeks (till last 4 weeks of winter anyway).
So I will get myself set up to use it.
Thank you for your advice Turin.

The toads are a perfect example why Australia HAS to keep out animals from other countries.
Maybe 40yrs back our sugar cane growers had a problem with a beetle, so in their wisdom farmers introduced a cane toad from central america.
It has absolutely no effect on the beetle, but loved the enviroment, multiplied at incredible rates, and murders all our wildlife.
If you annoy them, they squirt a poison. Hence many a pet dog has died by injestion.
If a snake eats them, fine, but the snake dies because the toad releases its poison when being digested.
Of course, the snake thinks the toad is a frog, as do all our other native animals.
So our wildlife can not handle the toad, except for the crow.
When you see a toad on the road you run it over, and at dawn along comes the crow, flips the carcass over and eats all but the head.
It is a national sport going after toads with golf clubs, (or similar) and you see how far you can snack them.
When (and if) it rains, they multiply. In the rain I will go around the edge of my dam with an air rifle and shoot maybe 50-100 to break the cycle. They rot in the water and stink.
If I don't do this, then weeks later there is literally a black shadow, maybe 2m out from the dame wall, all the way around, and it is just millions of toad tadpoles.
If I toss in a dose of Endosulphane, I kill the lot, but over the past yrs we have 2 resident turtles, so I don't do that anymore, as I don't want to nail their too.
So that is called a plague.
Cheers
Phillip