Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

irv64

Cadet
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
24
Excuse my ignorance if this question has been covered before? I purchased a new Lowe 16.5 FS with an 2007 90HP Mercury 4 stroke this past summer, this is my first Merc and so far so good, great on gas, lots of power, 3 year warranty etc. Anyways the other day some buddies of mine got talking and one of the guy's said that Yamaha is making Merc's 4 strokes for them or with them? I am wondering if there was any truth to his story? Not that that is a bad thing in my opinion as I have heard Yamaha builds a great outboard too. Thanks...........Irv64
 

WillyBWright

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Dec 29, 2003
Messages
8,200
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

It might be Yamaha-based. I believe those models use a Merc block with Yamaha internals. The contract between Yamaha and Merc expires soon if it already hasn't. This is a big transition year and I'll know more after the seminar in a little over a week.
 

irv64

Cadet
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
24
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Thanks guys, I appreciate the info, did I purchase a good motor? Is there any know traits I should know about? So far so good but I have maybe 10hrs on it if I am lucky? It feels good and strong, is great on gas and it is "Super" quiet..........Irv
 

Outboard

Cadet
Joined
Dec 1, 2006
Messages
11
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

I have the 24 merc big foot, bought it used and it is not living up to anything the Seller said but back on subject, everybody plus the dealer have told me it is the same engine as the Yamaha 25 S 4 stroke.

When I fix it, it will be good, fighting a problem right now with it running out of gas and need to pump the bulb. I have check the fuel line with a shorter and 100% line to make sure no blockage, the orginal is good. I now need to swithch the bulb to make sure it is not sucking air. also need to check the engine connection and then moving in to the in-line filter since its the orginal. I will also drain the bowl on the carb and I have a new fuel pump on order which should arrive tomorrow. I am thinking the diaphram might have a pin hole. Have I missed anything or does anyone have suggestions to a better approach to solving the problem?

One buddy told me that either Merc bought the secret alloy mix for blocks or Yamaha bought it from Merc, but one of the Companies is said to be the orginator of a super duper alloy for the blocks.

I also have a Honda 50 on another small boat, this is my second Honda and she is a dream. Very much quieter than the Merc. I sold a small tender to a client with a new 60 hp Yamaha EFI. This was an amazing engine. Super Quiet and amazing power. I am told the EFI will make it quieter somehow when the carbs are eliminated.
 

irv64

Cadet
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
24
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Thanks for the info, it sounds like I picked a great motor!
A guy at the lake was having trouble with his 15hp motor, he couldn't get it started and all it was was the fact that he had his line/bulb backwards. Once it was on the right way it fired right up and ran like a charm.....Irv
 

WillyBWright

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Dec 29, 2003
Messages
8,200
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

I got a boat cheap that way. Well, not really that cheap. But I saw that the fuel line was on backwards and the owner obviously was unable to get it to run after he bought it. He got a different boat and sold this one to me. A few years ago I gave it to my oldest son and we're in process of restoring it. But I had ten years of fun with it in the meantime.
 

T_I_M

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Messages
80
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Merc used Yamaha powerheads on a few engines (and still do on thier 15hp for now) up til 2006 model year.If you have a 2007 it should be all Mercury and based on the L4 Verado block less a supercharger.Rather the type out the changes go here and see if your engine is the same.http://www.mercurymarine.com/90_efi
 

jhebert

Ensign
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Messages
902
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Mercury and Yamaha have a long relationship with four-stroke motors, going back at least 13 years to 1993. In the case of the 90-HP model, the engine Mercury was selling up until 2007-model year used a power head that was purchased by Mercury from Yamaha, who made it in Japan. The Yamaha power head was matched up with a Mercury midsection and gear case, received a Mercury cowling, and was fitted with Mercury electrical harnesses. This motor was sold for many years as a Mercury motor, but its Yamaha heritage was widely known.

If you have a 2007-model-year Mercury 90-HP "FourStroke" EFI engine then it should be the in-line four-cylinder engine which is based on the Verado engine block. I and others have taken to calling this family of Mercury engines the "Veraditos," or the diminutive Verado. Mercury calls them "FourStroke" motors (instead of four-stroke motors), but this is not really a distinctive name, and I think Veradito is much better. So do the editors of at least one major boating magazine.

This Veradito engine is an all-Mercury engine and is made in Fond du Lac, Wisconsin or thereabouts, in a Mercury plant by Mercury workers.

This engine block is a derivative of the Verado, where it can produce as much as 175-HP. Built as a 90-HP motor there should be plenty of strength and longevity in that motor.

One way to tell which motor you have is by the shape of the cowling. The cowling on the Veradito motor looks something like a lady's commercial hair dryer from the 1950's. If you are old enough to remember what they looked like, you will see the resemblance immediately.
 

BoatGuy22

Cadet
Joined
Dec 5, 2006
Messages
7
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Yeah if its a Mercury built 90 you should be able to tell by the ugly cowl they put on those things.
 

Dunaruna

Admiral
Joined
May 2, 2003
Messages
6,027
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

[colour=blue]Mercury & yamaha are currently having a rather nasty divorce in court, the seperation began about 2 years ago. I doubt that (now) anything yamaha is bolted to a merc, or visa versa.
 

Capt Ken

Commander
Joined
Jul 30, 2002
Messages
2,269
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

I nearly laughed myself silly when I found out last year that Mercury was suing Yamaha for importing too many engines into the US and effecting the sales of American engines. All the while Mercury was the biggest importer of yamaha powerheads and using them on their engines. This means that Mercury dealers had to buy Yamaha tools and diagnostics equipment to work on Mercury engines.
 

zzzzz

Lieutenant Junior Grade
Joined
Jan 13, 2003
Messages
1,094
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

did you know to top off the class action suit (that Mercury failed to win)that Mercury signed a contract with a CHINESE company to produce some of their motors !!8)
 

WillyBWright

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Dec 29, 2003
Messages
8,200
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

The Mercury Made model has a belt driven alternator.
 

jhebert

Ensign
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Messages
902
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Capt said:
I nearly laughed myself silly when I found out last year that Mercury was suing Yamaha for importing too many engines into the US and [affecting] the sales of American engines. All the while Mercury was the biggest importer of Yamaha powerheads and using them on their engines. This means that Mercury dealers had to buy Yamaha tools and diagnostics equipment to work on Mercury engines.

Just a clarification to this comment--Mercury did not file a lawsuit against Yamaha regarding importing too many engines. Mercury asked the United States International Trade Commission (USITC) to investigate to see if outboard motors imported from Japan were being sold at less than fair value (LTFV). After a lengthy investigation, the USITC did conclude that outboard motors were being imported from Japan and sold at LTFV, however they also concluded that this was not causing any harm to domestic producers. Therefore the USITC did not find it necessary to impose a remedy. Mercury had asked that the USITC impose a remedy which would have been in the form of an import duty of 22-percent of the value of the motors.

The decision was controversial and came with a 3-to-2 vote, so it was not exactly a clear win or lose. Mercury made its point--the Japanese were selling at LTFV--but they failed to prove they had been harmed by it. Thus they got no remedy.

As a result of the bitter nature of the USITC testimony and investigation, Yamaha tried to unilaterally break off their contract with Mercury to supply them with motors. This then forced Mercury to bring a lawsuit against Yamaha asking a court in Wisconsin to compel Yamaha to continue to import more motors from Japan and sell Mercury the four-stroke motors it wanted to buy from Yamaha. In this dispute Mercury prevailed, and Yamaha was forced to continue to sell Mercury the four-stroke motors it needed. So the actual lawsuit filed by Mercury against Yamaha was not to reduce or limit their imports, but to force them to continue to import and sell motors to Mercury, which is just the opposite of what was mentioned above.

Overall all I feel that the USITC investigation ended up making enemies for Mercury. Also, in the process of the testimony there were many embarrassing moments for Mercury. In any case, Mercury spent a lot of money and effort with the USITC and got nothing for it, no remedy. And all of the Japanese makers had to spend a lot of money defending themselves in the investigation. Perhaps Mercury felt it was a victory because the USITC did decide there was selling by the Japanese at LTFV, but that may have only been a bitter satisfaction. I am sure Mercury would have much rather had a tariff imposed. If that had happened it would have really shaken up the outboard motor marketplace in the United States. Adding 22-percent import duty to every Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki, and other Japanese brands would have been a stiff economic penalty for the sellers to absorb. They would have had to raise their prices.

If the Japanese had been forced to raise the prices of their outboard motors, it was generally believed that this would have been followed in suit by Mercury, who would have raised their prices. In fact, this was one of the arguments made by the Japanese outboard makers and their supporters, that the real purpose of the action by Mercury was to drive the price (and thus the profit) of outboard motors to a higher level.

The testimony, arguments, and findings of the USITC make for fascinating reading. Most of the documents are still available on-line from the government website that published them. Unfortunately, much of the pricing and sales volume information has been redacted in the public versions. If it had not, they would have been very, very interesting reading.

Ultimately, Mercury did not prevail in this matter and for that I think we can be thankful, otherwise these expensive outboard motors would cost even more.
 

irv64

Cadet
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
24
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Thanks for the tips/help guys, my motor looks exactly like the one in the link that Tim posted. I am glad to hear it is a strong motor and should last for years. So I guess the final conclusion is that it is all Mercury? No Yamaha parts what so ever?
I wonder if my Yamaha Grizzly has a Merc motor in it? LOL. Thanks again.........Irv64
 

T_I_M

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Messages
80
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Well 99% Merc. They are still using the same oil pump under the powerhead, but don't worry the pumps are pretty much bulletproof.
 

T_I_M

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Messages
80
Re: Merc 4 strokes made by Yamaha?

Not on the the all Merc powereads.
 
Top