Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

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CharlieW

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Creating a new post regarding this issue so the subject reflects the issue. Previous post was regarding availability to public of Yamaha Service Bulletins online.<br /><br />Anyway, tried the tilt trim again this weekend and is doesn't work now. All I hear is sound of solenoid like clicking in the engine. Makes no difference whether using switch on binnacle mount or the one on the motor itself.<br /><br />After first occurence of this, I had dealer check it out. It was working fine when they got it. They said they checked voltages and fluid levels. No sign of water in fluid. <br /><br />After picking up the boat after their checkout, I ran the boat for about an hour on the lake. All was fine. I put it away for a month. Now the same problem. <br /><br />Is anyone else seeing this intermittent tilt/trim motor not running on relatively new motors?<br /><br />Anyway, I will be making another trip to dealer for warranty repair.
 

imported_JD__

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Don't know about your situation but if a solenoid is clicking on a car engine its usually a weak battery, low voltage/loose connection to solenoid, poor ground, bad solenoid, something of this nature
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

SCFisher, did you ever get this resolved? I'm having the same problem. I have 2002 Yamaha HPDI 150. The power tilt works going down but not up. I can hear (and feel) it clicking on the square relay in the fuse box. This shouldn't cause the problem since it's the ignition relay. The manual says to remove and test the relay panel above the fuse box. It looks easier to simply replace the square relay.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

head banger<br /> are you in the grey fuse box or the electrical panel? I am thinking you may be confused, there are several relays in there. what are the wire colors on the relay you wish to test ?<br /> scfisher. if its still under warrenty dont mess with it. most likly its a loose contact or a bad trim relay.
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

The black fuse box definitely only has two relays, the rest are fuses. Above it is a panel that the repair manual calls the trim relay. It's a single panel with several wires connected to it. I think, a blue, a green and at least 2 red wires. That should be the likely source but the clicking is coming from the relays in the fuse box. There are two 3/4" square relays. The fuse box has two clips to take off the cover, the "trim relay panel" has a seperate cover that has to be unscrewed to get off.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

most lilkly behind the panal with the screws.<br /> the relay in the snap on panal is just a power supply for the trim relay and its called the main relay. the trim relay will have a 10 Ga blue,a 10Ga green,a10Ga black and a 10Ga red all held on with 10mm nuts. the other 3 wires are black,light blue and light green on a pigtail about 5" long and a triangle shaped connector. most people get confused and many techs get lost but its a very simple device for reversing polarity to the trim motor. its also about 450 dollars.<br /> when at rest both 10Ga motor wire,blue is up anf green is down, are grounded inside the relay. when a direction(up) is toggled it moves one relay wiper arm from the negative side to the positive side (blue to red). now we have a circuit. when you let off the button both wipers are spring loaded and the one that moved returns to ground. when you hit the trim the opposite way (down) the down relay arm moves to positive and the up stays grounded (green to red) a quick test of the motor circuit is to remove both the 10 ga blue and green wires. attach the blue to a known good 12 positive and the green to a negative or block ground. motor should move up. reverse and it should move down. if it does the motor is ok. now touch the blue wire to the red terminal on the trim relay and the green to the black, should go up again if it did in the first test. reverse for down. if it pased the first and not the second find the loss of power on the red wire or a ground loss on the black. also test for operation of the trim switches. jump from the red wire to the blue 18 ga wire at the plastic connector on the relay pigtail. it should click and go up. if it clicks it means the arm is moving anyway. repeat for the green 18ga wire. if it does not pass the first test the motor is bad.if it passes the first and second test we confirmed the motor is good and the positive and negative to the relay are good and if all 3 tests pass yet the motor only runs for the first 2 tests the relay is bad.<br /> no worries :)
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

rodbolt, thanks for the thorough description of how to test it. Sounds like you're pretty sure it's not the main relay? I guess it wouldn't work at all in either direction if the main relay was bad. I'll read it again carefully and decide if this is something I can do myself.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

a quick test is with the key on engine off, watch the tach when you hit the trim. if the tach goes blank the main relay just dropped out. if it does not it didnt.<br /> do you have the service manual or the owners manual?
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

I have both the owners manual and the Clymers shop manual. I'll definitely try the tach test, but even with the shop manual I'm a little nervous disconnecting wiring on the motor.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

hello <br /> its no worries:)<br /> but the terminals are painted for wire colors on the trim relay.<br /> the mnanual gives a long drawn out test procedure for the relay. the above test is quicker and does not require a multimeter nor the knowledge to use it. I willagree that there are a lot of wires there :) :) .you would not believe how many technicians are befuddled by them. to many techs are scared and ill trained with electronics. electronics for the procedures required for most outboard testing is very simple. only requires a basic knowledge. <br /> trons are like me and Bass. kinda lazy. they will do nothing if the circuits open and they will always take the path of least resistance. all that relay is is an electro-mechanical switch,the trim motor is a permmanat magnet 2 wire design. it will run clockwise as well as counter clockwise depending on which lead is positive and which is negative. you would not belive how many relays,solinoids and such I see replaced due to improper trouble shooting and poorly trained techs. and at over 400 dollars a pop they can get expensive. that is why I developed a quick easy test that will confim or eliminate votltage supply problems or relay issues. and usually I can demonstrate it to a tech one time and they got it. I go to Venezuela a couple times a year and train/asist some techs there. I dont speak spanish and they dont speak english but luckily motors dont care. sometimes the facilities are less than optimal and parts are non-existant. requires a working knowledge of what is going on. on your HPDI the power tap for the trim relay bypasses the main relay. the power tap comes off the starter solinoid batt terminal I believe. the power requiurements are heavy. under certain conditions the current draw of the trim motorcan exceed 50 amps. so you have to have a method of using a low current draw switch to control a large current draw motor, thus the relay was born. a relay and a solinoid are ,for practicle purposes, the same.
 

CharlieW

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Great discussion. Boat/motor has been with dealer for two weeks. Claim it has worked for them each time they check it. It wasn't when I took it in to them. So for now they can't find anything specific. Asked them to change "something" regardless. He suggested they may start with relay components vs tilt motor. Hope to get it back next week.
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Well it stopped raining long enough for me to get down to the boat and test the relay. <br />rodbolt - the test procedure you wrote worked exactly as you described it. I tested each of the 10ga wires to a pos/ground source and the motor works in both directions. Next I tested the red wire at the relay, works for both the blue and green wires. last I jumped it to the pigtail and it clicks for both. the good news is I know what's wrong, the bad news is it's a bad relay. oh, and I tried the tachometer test first, it stayed on when i hit the trim switch. So the main relay is fine. I'll order the part on Monday and I'm confident I can replace it myself. It's not that tough, you just need to take a moment to orient youself before disconnecting anything. Also having rodbolt's instructions helps. They are better than the shop manual. Thanks rodbolt. I'll let you know when I get the new part installed.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

just be sure to secure the power before you try to remove the relay. the test procedure in the manual is great howewver it takes to long. I am to busy and I understand how the system works. some procedures can be short cut some cannot. its all a matter of understanding.
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

what do you mean turn the power off? is turning the battery switch off good enough or do I need to disconnect the battery cables at the terminals?
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

depends on how the battery switch is wired.<br /> i have seen them where you can secure both switches and start either engine, just make sure that 12v to the solinoid is off.
 

Headbanger

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Power tilt/trim is fixed!<br /><br />Once again the repair manual had more instructions than necessary. I only had to turn off the battery switch, tested it at the unit, no power, so I proceeded to remove the relay unit. I disconnected the red, black, green and blue wires and one pig tail. Put in the new unit, reconnected the wires and viola. Everything works fine. It only took 20min to replace, plus $236 for a new relay. Rodbolt, thanks for the help. This site is awesome.
 

rodbolt

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

no worries
 

bigbrownbuku

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Originally posted by scfisher:<br /> Great discussion. Boat/motor has been with dealer for two weeks. Claim it has worked for them each time they check it. It wasn't when I took it in to them. So for now they can't find anything specific. Asked them to change "something" regardless. He suggested they may start with relay components vs tilt motor. Hope to get it back next week.
a volt drop test usually points to the problem that only happens sometimes in this area. been there for sure. mostly ive seen the ground side go bad in that relay pack
 

CharlieW

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Re: Tilt/Trim Doesn't Work Again (2003 Yamaha 115 4-stroke)

Finally had it fail again while at the dealer. Replaced the trim motor under warranty. So far, all is well. 2 weeks at the SC coast and no problems.
 
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