Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

gjonz · Oct 30, 2008

Who at Johnny-rude decided plain old slot head screws were a good ideal?

I've gotten and entire motor stripped down and ready for the paint shop. Al except the lower unit cap that seems to no want to give up two slot-head screws for any reason on this earth.

What to do? I've tried penetrating oil. Should I now heat the upper part of the lower unit with a torch? Drill them out and remove them with one of those remover things from my hardware store?

The heads are pretty well shot at this point. Of course there is no way to get vice=grips or pliers on the head either.

HELP!!!

Thanks!

Greg

Rick. · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Have you tried an impact driver. I used to find it the best way to break free screw heads on my motorcycle. Heads that I absolutely could not turn out with a screw driver. It came with a bit or two for slotted screws as well as phillips. Rick.

James R · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

An Impact driver is the only way you will free many screws on an outboard. If you can get a dremel tool in to cut deeper slots you can use the impact driver and this will probably do the trick. Wouldn't be without my impact driver.

1946Zephyr · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Yea, and once you get those P.O.S. screws out, chuck 'em and get case stainless allen screws, or stainless hex heads.

58CorrySuburban · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

I've asked the same questions to many people, and have never gotten a real reason.

I bought bolt/screw remover bits when I first got my motor, I bought the best that the store offered, and the stainless steel screws chewed them up, and the brass screws were not tough enough to hold a bite.

I've used the Dremel trick, just don't go too deep or it will weaken the bolt and leave you with a 1/2 moon (obviously). If you don't have an impact gun, I have had success tapping the screw driver with a hammer. Its slow, painfully slow, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

As always, if worse comes to worse, you can always drill out the core of the screw, and then tap out the old screw material.

-Josh

gjonz · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Well I gurantee after tearing down two identical 30hp motors so I can do a full cosmetic and mechanical restoration...I will certainly not be cutting corners on the stainless hardware to put "Humpty Dumpty" back together again!

Definately using hex heads next time. Especially on the lower unit where the two halves of the shrouds attach to the rubber shock mounts. There are flat head screws in the frontside of these mounts too. ArgggHHH!

Fortunately I do outside sales for a hardware store and get a nice discount on these items.

I guess I'll have to find someone with an impact driver. I don't own one. I tried hitting the screw driver with a mallet, and no dice.

Usually that works for me. Maybe tomorrow the penetrating oil will have seeped in a but and then I can make headway.

Thanks for the responses guys!

If anyone else has an ideal, I'm wide open...

Greg

kandil · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

To remove a flat head screw you need the largest screw driver that you can fit in the slot!! you need leverage to be successful. The impact tool is a hand tool that you can get it at Sears or The auto part stores it is about $20 and you use your hammer to strike it I use unitizes on all the stubborn bolts once they come out good luck

Grem · Oct 30, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Yes, I've just got my first outboard and I couldn't believe that slotted screws were o/e. What were they thinking?

With similarly stubborn cross-head screws on early Japanese motorcycles, I've had success by heating the head of the screw with a micro-torch, most recently used a culinary model. When it's REALLY hot, get your screwdriver on it fast! If you don't have a T-bar driver you can grind some flats on a regular one and apply an adjustable wrench for some serious torque.

58CorrySuburban · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Kandil,

Thank you for the clearification. I thought that an impact driver was a neumatic device which required: a compressor, hoses, and misc. fittings and attachments (I'm new to mechanized fiddling).

Funny thing is that I was just trying to free the bottom casing from a lower unit of a parts motor and they just won't budge!!!

I did exactly what was advised.

I pulled the biggest flat head screw driver I had (also happened to be the biggest the screw could recieve). I took a pair of vise gripes and cliped them onto the square shaft of the driver, and proceeded to mutilate the heads of these poor straight slot screws. One out of all came loose. Mind you, it was a one shot deal. I didn't continualy/slowly shread them. All the preasure I could muster, no slips, and they just melted!!! I would have expected them to snap before the were mangled.

What I am dealing with my own lower unit issues will have to be posted on a seperate thread.

But first, purchasing an impact driver.

I enjoy this,
-Josh

F_R · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

An outboard mechanic simply cannot live without an impact screwdriver. And once you have one, you will wonder what all the fuss was about.

Beware, some of them are crap. I have one from Snap-On that I bought 50 years ago and it works good as new. I have another that I bought from Harbor Freight, for a service call kit, and it is almost garbage compared to the Snap-On. And it is getting dang near impossible to find suitable bits for them. The bit has to be as wide as the screw head diameter.

iwombat · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Yes, those slotted screws are a pain to bust loose. But, they are equally as hard to tighten. That's why they were used - so you don't overtorque them. If you replace them with socket-heads be very careful not to tighten too much.

tashasdaddy · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

i have been lucky, and use a huge screw driver, and a cresent wrench, on the shaft of the screwdriver, applying huge pressure to the screwdriver to hold it in the slot.

Chinewalker · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Impact driver - best money you can spend this side of a compression gauge...

Later seamed gearcase screws were SST Phillips-head. I like those much better...
- Scott

Rick. · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

I would think twice about using stainless steel hardware. If for any reason it freezes into threads etc. you will find it next to impossible to drill it and use easy-outs etc. I like the look of stainless but I have had to drill it and cut it before and it is the pits. I'm thinking it's better to use regular steel bolts and dope the threads well before you install them with either loc-tite or some other anti corrosion product. Rick.

ezeke · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

I think that you will find that all of the fill and drain plugs are stainless steel.

I have been gradually changing over to the allen wrench type plugs, which I like.

If you clean up the slot with a dremmel and then use a hand impact tool, the plugs will usually come out, but you can also get them out with a half inch screwdriver.

gjonz · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

Bear with me here...

Before my wife's grandfather passed away, he told me to take the rest of his tools during our last visit with him. We were very close, and we would call each other about problems such as mine in this thread. He had been many things over the years including a machinist.

So last night while laying in bed reading your responses, I remembered a small case that I'd brought home from our last visit with him. At 10:30pm I went down stairs and found the bottom drawer of my machinist chest open...with nothing but a small blue case that was stamped "Impact Driver".

I didn't even know I owned one. I also haven't been near that tool chest in 6 months or more.

Kinda freaky! Especially right before Halloween!!

Anyway, I did use the impact wrench on the three remaining bolts, and it took them right out without any problems!

Thanks so much for the advice gang!

Greg

Rick. · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

What a fantastic story. Rick.

jonesg · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

when all else fails, after destroying the screw head or even snapping the bolt head off , touch it with a mig welder for 1 second , lowest setting, usually the screw will come out by finger once it cools.

steelespike · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

gjonz said:
Bear with me here...

Before my wife's grandfather passed away, he told me to take the rest of his tools during our last visit with him. We were very close, and we would call each other about problems such as mine in this thread. He had been many things over the years including a machinist.

So last night while laying in bed reading your responses, I remembered a small case that I'd brought home from our last visit with him. At 10:30pm I went down stairs and found the bottom drawer of my machinist chest open...with nothing but a small blue case that was stamped "Impact Driver".

I didn't even know I owned one. I also haven't been near that tool chest in 6 months or more.

Kinda freaky! Especially right before Halloween!!

Anyway, I did use the impact wrench on the three remaining bolts, and it took them right out without any problems!

Thanks so much for the advice gang!

Greg

Gramp was helping you.

Grem · Oct 31, 2008

Re: Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

jonesg said:
when all else fails, after destroying the screw head or even snapping the bolt head off , touch it with a mig welder for 1 second , lowest setting, usually the screw will come out by finger once it cools.

I like it - a true 'magic wand'! Beats gramp's help from beyond the grave any day.

Darn it...who thought slot-head screws were a good ideal?

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