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  1. #1
    Petty Officer 2nd Class mudweiser's Avatar
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    Default Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    I'm installing an Edelbrock 1409 carb and a 2104 Intake on my 1989 305 mercruiser. Rather then mess with rebending the steel fuel line and buying adapters, can i use a small part of rubber fuel line? The old Q-jet had the fuel inlet in the front of the carb and the Edelbrock has the fuel inlet at the rear of the carb. Thought it would be easier to just use a 3 to 4" piece of rubber fuel line to make this conversion. I was to make sure the boat is both safe and will be coast guard approved. Thanks in advance.
    "2 strokes", get it done in half the time!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    You can buy premade steel braided line for very reasonable cost....

  3. #3
    Rear Admiral JustJason's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Nope, you need to bend up some new steel line.
    just because you found it that way... doesn't mean it's supposed to be that way.

    Part of diagnostics is spending time figuring out not only what the problem is, but also sorting through what it isn't.

    The older the engine is, the chances of it having more than 1 problem goes up exponentially

    Boating has always been a rich mans hobby. Buying a new boat gets cheaper every year, but the maintenance, the repairs, and the overall cost of ownership of a boat has never gotten any cheaper.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    I did a 2 barrel to 4 barrel carb swap about yr ago and went with stainless braided line. But I think a short section of marine fuel rubber fuel hose is OK with USCG requirements. Not 100% sure though.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeneal View Post
    I did a 2 barrel to 4 barrel carb swap about yr ago and went with stainless braided line. But I think a short section of marine fuel rubber fuel hose is OK with USCG requirements. Not 100% sure though.
    My suggestion is to avoid rubber fuel line on the pressure side of the pump. I'm not sure of the USCG requirement, but prefer to er on the side of caution for this. Sierra sells the braided line you want.

    James

  6. #6
    Petty Officer 2nd Class mudweiser's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    I ended up getting a pre made line from Spectre P/N 29883. It screws right into the carb and drops down 90 degrees. It also has a connection for a fuel pressure gauge. From there chop and reflare the stock line and it screws right in.
    "2 strokes", get it done in half the time!

  7. #7
    Lieutenant Commander mkast's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeneal View Post
    But I think a short section of marine fuel rubber fuel hose is OK with USCG requirements. Not 100% sure though.
    Pressure fuel lines (after the fuel pump) can't be rubber hose, not even little ones.

  8. #8
    Rear Admiral 180shabah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Pressure fuel lines (after the fuel pump) can't be rubber hose, not even little ones.
    Yes they can. From Federal Law 183.558 - Hoses and connections

    "If a hose is used in the fuel line running between the fuel pump and the carburetor, the hose must be “USCG Type A1” and so labeled as required by 183.540. This requirement is applicable whether the fuel pump is engine mounted or mounted remotely from the engine, as permitted by 183.566.

    This requirement does not apply to a tube used to detect fuel pump diaphragm failure."

  9. #9
    Chief Petty Officer Mkos1980's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    On my engine I used the A1 hose as mentioned above with no problems. My boat got "randomly" searched memorial day weekend with a long checklist from the USCG out of Cleveland and they said everything was perfect and even issued me a little decal to put on my window to show that I passed if I ever encountered this inspection again. The check the carb install, carb marine number, flame arrestor (Had the KN and they looked for the numbers on that as well) Other then that all went good.
    90 Chaparral 2150SX 350 MAG Alpha 1
    Vortec Heads, LT4 HotCam Upgrade
    GM BowTie 1.6 Roller Rockers
    Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap Intake
    Edelbrock 600CFM Marine Carb * New MPH* 65.2
    Laser II 21 Prop 5400 RPM's Corsa Exhaust

  10. #10
    Petty Officer 2nd Class mudweiser's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Got it all wrapped up today and had a chance to hit the key. Distrubutor was off even though i marked it. Follow up later. The throttle lever on the edlebrock is a tad forward. I just driled out the other throttle lever hole on the cable and made adjustments for now. Unreal, it was a hit the key and run swap. So far i love that carb. The draw back i found was the stock fuel line fitting for the carb was too short so it didn't bottom out into the spectrem fuel line. Caused a leak. I found fittings just to run the motor. However i don't leak the added 3 fittings where fuel can leak on the motor so tomorrow if i have time i'm getting a new steel line or swapping to braided rubber line.

    Off topic: when i pulled the distributor i had the engine at TDC compression and the rotor in the dist. was pointed at #1. I marked the dist base inline with the rotor and also eyeballed the rotor and marked it on the valve cover. The battery was disconnected prior to the dist. removal and upon the reinstall, my rotor want to point more forward the it was upon removal. WTF? I got it fired up but i can't time it cause the dist is maxed out against the coil. I can't move it any further cause the lower vent on the dist bumps the coil. I'm not gonna move the coil to fix. I need to figure what happened here. Any ideas?

    BTW, the motor runs nice, but edlebrock claims no more then 6-7 PSI on the fuel pressure. I have 8 to 9. they say this can cause a problem when you chop the throttle. 1 pound, really? Not sure. If it will i will install a fuel pressure regulator. Just don't want to put money where it's not needed.
    "2 strokes", get it done in half the time!

  11. #11
    Chief Petty Officer Flargin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Quote Originally Posted by mudweiser View Post
    BTW, the motor runs nice, but edlebrock claims no more then 6-7 PSI on the fuel pressure. I have 8 to 9. they say this can cause a problem when you chop the throttle. 1 pound, really? Not sure. If it will i will install a fuel pressure regulator. Just don't want to put money where it's not needed.
    get the regulator. look at it this way. that is up to 50% more pressure than expected. You will blow past the float and flood your system. If this was a car you could just wait until you smelled the fuel, on the boat you will flood your motor and be stuck high and dry.

    Quote Originally Posted by mudweiser View Post
    Off topic: when i pulled the distributor i had the engine at TDC compression and the rotor in the dist. was pointed at #1. I marked the dist base inline with the rotor and also eyeballed the rotor and marked it on the valve cover. The battery was disconnected prior to the dist. removal and upon the reinstall, my rotor want to point more forward the it was upon removal. WTF? I got it fired up but i can't time it cause the dist is maxed out against the coil. I can't move it any further cause the lower vent on the dist bumps the coil. I'm not gonna move the coil to fix. I need to figure what happened here. Any ideas?
    remember the gears on the distributor are "slanted", so if you want the rotor to be at 12:00, you have to slide the rotor back to 10:30 and then slide it down. it will move as you drop it the last 3/4".

    Good luck

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    In my country there is not laws about transformations or conversions about engines running at sea.So when i needed new hoses i needed ruber ones which i could easily find in the local market.Next season i found out that the metalic hoses grounded the fuel filter and its base.I don't know if it was dangerous.In theory maybe yes.Maybe a cause of static electricity and fire? At least i grounded with a wire the filter.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Quote Originally Posted by 180shabah View Post
    Yes they can. From Federal Law 183.558 - Hoses and connections

    "If a hose is used in the fuel line running between the fuel pump and the carburetor, the hose must be “USCG Type A1” and so labeled as required by 183.540. This requirement is applicable whether the fuel pump is engine mounted or mounted remotely from the engine, as permitted by 183.566.

    This requirement does not apply to a tube used to detect fuel pump diaphragm failure."
    Thank for looking this up. It is good to know the rules since opinions sometimes differ. Personally I see no reason using rubber fuel line providing it is approved and meets the spec. In some cases rubber is better, since it will not crack from vibration. Have seen it happen before, steel line cracks, and what was the fix after it happened twice, replace it with a rubber section. This was in an automotive application.

    Have a great day

    Rob.

  14. #14
    Rear Admiral 180shabah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    At least a short section of rubber hose is required for the transition between "boat" and "engine" for just that reason.

  15. #15
    Chief Petty Officer Mkos1980's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    When I did my swap, I used Edelbrocks steel line that is used on their performer carbs that goes from the carb, down, and to the front of the motor. I only have about 16in of A1 hosethen from that to the fuel pump. Let me know if anybody wants a pic.
    90 Chaparral 2150SX 350 MAG Alpha 1
    Vortec Heads, LT4 HotCam Upgrade
    GM BowTie 1.6 Roller Rockers
    Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap Intake
    Edelbrock 600CFM Marine Carb * New MPH* 65.2
    Laser II 21 Prop 5400 RPM's Corsa Exhaust

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Please provide one mkos1980, I am going to be upgrading to a 4bbl Edelbrock with a performer intake in the next few weeks on a 351, so the original metal line will not likely work.
    1976 Mark Twain 200VBR w/Mercruiser 233 (Ford 351w) "Heart & Soul"

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Quote Originally Posted by mudweiser View Post

    BTW, the motor runs nice, but edlebrock claims no more then 6-7 PSI on the fuel pressure. I have 8 to 9. they say this can cause a problem when you chop the throttle. 1 pound, really? Not sure. If it will i will install a fuel pressure regulator. Just don't want to put money where it's not needed.
    my experience is that if you're even right at 7 there is a good chance that after a little time the fuel will push past the needles and wind up running down into the carb at idle... it has happened on two different edelbrocks for me now...

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    If any of you are going to use rubber fuel line on the pressure side of the pump please atleast use the propper fittings and double clamp the hoses.

    It is not safe to cut off the steel fuel lines and clamp the rubber lines to them.

    James

  19. #19
    Chief Petty Officer Flargin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Some of the relevent subsections: http://cfr.vlex.com/source/1082/page/118

    (note there are others, I just did not copy and paste them!)


    183.530 - Spud, pipe, and hose fitting configuration.

    Except when used for a tank fill line, each spud, pipe, or hose fitting used with hose clamps must have: (a) A bead; (b) A flare; or (c) A series of annular grooves or serrations no less than 0.015 inches deep, except a continuous helical thread, knurl, or groove.


    183.532 - Clips, straps, and hose clamps.

    (a) Each clip, strap, and hose clamp must: (1) Be made from a corrosion resistant material; and (2) Not cut or abrade the fuel line.

    (b) If tested in accordance with the fire test under 183.590, a hose clamp installed on a fuel line system requiring metallic fuel lines or USCG Type A1 hose must not separate under a one pound tensile force.


    183.538 - Metallic fuel line materials.

    Each metallic fuel line connecting the fuel tank with the fuel inlet connection on the engine must: (a) Be made of seamless annealed copper, nickel copper, or copper-nickel; and (b) Except for corrugated flexible fuel line, have a minimum wall thickness of 0.029 inches.

    183.540 - Hoses: Standards and markings.

    (a) USCG Type A1 hose means hose that meets the performance requirements of: (1) SAE Standard J1527DEC85, Class 1 and the fire test in 183.590; or (2) Underwriters' Laboratories, Inc. (UL) Standard 1114.

    (b) USCG Type A2 hose means hose that meets the performance requirements of SAE Standard J1527DEC85, Class 2 and the fire test in 183.590; (c) USCG Type B1 hose means hose that meets the performance requirements of SAE Standard J1527DEC85, Class 1.

    (d) USCG Type B2 hose means hose that meets the performance requirements of SAE Standard J1527DEC85, Class 2.

    Note: SAE Class 1 hose has a permeation rating of 100 grams or less fuel loss per square meter of interior surface in 24 hours.

    SAE Class 2 hose has a permeation rating of 300 grams or less fuel loss per square meter of interior surface in 24 hours.

    (e) Each USCG Type A1, USCG Type A2, USCG Type B1, and USCG Type B2 hose must be identified by the manufacturer by a marking on the hose.

    (f) Each marking must contain the following information in English: (1) The statement USCG TYPE (insert A1 or A2 or B1 or B2).

    (2) The year in which the hose was manufactured.

    (3) The manufacturer's name or registered trademark.

    (g) Each character must be block capital letters and numerals that are at least one eighth-inch high.

    (h) Each marking must be permanent, legible, and on the outside of the hose at intervals of 12 inches or less.

    183.542 - Fuel systems.

    (a) Each fuel system in a boat must have been tested by the boat manufacturer and not leak when subjected to the greater of the following pressures: (1) Three pounds per square inch; or (2) One and one-half times the pressure created in the lowest part of the fuel system when it is filled to the level of overflow with fuel.

    (b) The test pressure shall be obtained with air or inert gas.
    1
    183.558 - Hoses and connections.

    (a) Each hose used between the fuel pump and the carburetor must be USCG Type A1 hose.

    (b) Each hose used (1) For a vent line or fill line must be: (i) USCG Type A1 or USCG Type A2; or (ii) USCG Type B1 or USCG Type B2 if no more than five ounces of fuel is discharged in 2 1/2 minutes when: (A) The hose is severed at the point where maximum drainage of fuel would occur, (B) The boat is in its static floating position, and (C) The fuel system is filled to the capacity market on the tank label under 183.514(b)(3).

    (2) From the fuel tank to the fuel inlet connection on the engine must be: (i) USCG Type A1; or (ii) USCG Type B1 if no more than five ounces of fuel is discharged in 2 1/2 minutes when: (A) The hose is severed at the point where maximum drainage of fuel would occur, (B) The boat is in its static floating position, and (C) The fuel system is filled to the capacity marked on the tank label under 183.514(b)(3).

    (c) Each hose must be secured by: (1) A swaged sleeve; (2) A sleeve and threaded insert; or (3) A hose clamp.

    (d) The inside diameter of a hose must not exceed the actual minor outside diameter of the connecting spud, pipe, or fitting by more than the distance shown in Table 8.

    Table 8 If minor The inside diameter of the hose outside must not exceed the minor outside diameter of diameter of the connecting spud, the connecting pipe, or hose fitting by more spud, pipe, or than the following distance: fitting is_ Less than \3/8\ 0.020 in.

    in \3/8\ in. to0.035 in.

    in Greater than 1 0.065 in.

    183.560 - Hose clamps: Installation.

    Each hose clamp on a hose from the fuel tank to the fuel inlet connection on the engine, a hose between the fuel pump and the carburetor, or a vent line must: (a) Be used with hose designed for clamps; (b) [Reserved] (c) Be beyond the bead, flare, or over the serrations of the mating spud, pipe, or hose fitting; and (d) Not depend solely on the spring tension of the clamp for compressive force.

    183.562 - Metallic fuel lines.

    (a) Each metallic fuel line that is mounted to the boat structure must be connected to the engine by a flexible fuel line.

    (b) Each metallic fuel line must be attached to the boat's structure within four inches of its connection to a flexible fuel line.


    183.564 - Fuel tank fill system.

    (a) Each fuel fill opening must be located so that a gasoline overflow of up to five gallons per minute for at least five seconds will not enter the boat when the boat is in its static floating position.

    (b) Each hose in the tank fill system must be secured to a pipe, spud, or hose fitting by: (1) A swaged sleeve; (2) A sleeve and threaded insert; or (3) Two adjacent metallic hose clamps that do not depend solely on the spring tension of the clamps for compressive force.

    (c) Each hose clamp in the tank fill system must be used with a hose designed for clamps.

    (d) Hose clamps used in the tank fill system must: (1) Have a minimum nominal band width of at least one-half inch; and (2) Be over the hose and the spud, pipe, or hose fitting.

    183.566 - Fuel pumps: Placement.

    Each fuel pump must be on the engine it serves or within 12 inches of the engine, unless it is a fuel pump used to transfer fuel between tanks.

  20. #20
    Chief Petty Officer Mkos1980's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    OK here we go. This pic is from the day I installed it. I still was running stock 217 heads and the Mag intake. You notice the round silver connector to the carb for fuel. It then runs down to the manifold and to the front of the motor. Makes from a clean installation. I then went with A1 hose to the fuel pump. You will also notice I added the PCV valve. The front port is already drilled and when you turn the carb over its dimpled where its suppose to be drilled up. I drilled about 1/2 inch and it intersected the front pro drilled hole. I then tapped it and added a fitting. Its nice having this after a good run and then ideling. Suck up all that condensation.

    I'm working on the pic...
    90 Chaparral 2150SX 350 MAG Alpha 1
    Vortec Heads, LT4 HotCam Upgrade
    GM BowTie 1.6 Roller Rockers
    Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap Intake
    Edelbrock 600CFM Marine Carb * New MPH* 65.2
    Laser II 21 Prop 5400 RPM's Corsa Exhaust

  21. #21
    Chief Petty Officer Mkos1980's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Here we go
    90 Chaparral 2150SX 350 MAG Alpha 1
    Vortec Heads, LT4 HotCam Upgrade
    GM BowTie 1.6 Roller Rockers
    Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap Intake
    Edelbrock 600CFM Marine Carb * New MPH* 65.2
    Laser II 21 Prop 5400 RPM's Corsa Exhaust

  22. #22
    Petty Officer 2nd Class mudweiser's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    Thanks to all who replied. Flargin, where did you located the regulations?

    I'm going to scrap a good portion of the steel line, re flare it, tread that into a flared/riged fitting to rubber, then from there route it to a regulator then to the carb. I'm not going to be chasing my tail due to having an extra 1lb of furl pressure.

    I know the distributor has gears at angles, i tried dropping the gears in behind the marked location thinking it would spin in but then it will not go all the way flush with the manifold. However the way the distrubitor shaft is set up, it can only go in either 180 or right on. I don't understand what could have happened here. If i could drop it in on any cog, i'd understand but like i said i think it can only go in 180 or right on. Am i wrong in thinking this way?
    "2 strokes", get it done in half the time!

  23. #23
    Petty Officer 2nd Class mudweiser's Avatar
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    Default Re: Edelbrock carb install? Can i use rubber fuel line?

    I answered my own question on the distributor. I know for some it's a no brainer, but i have never changed out a distributor in the past. If any one runs into the same problem, here is a nice topic on Hot Rodders. http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/sbc-...all-90108.html
    "2 strokes", get it done in half the time!

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