1973 888 Blew out the engine coupler now!!

[turbosetch]

This boat is cursed I'm sure of it. I have never had it go longer then 5 hours without something major breaking...Here is the run down..

Bought boat...

Dual helm custom steering cable breaks..replaced
Starter locks out on the flywheel and burns up...replaced
Alternator goes bad..replaced
Carb float gets stuck...rebuilt
Stern drive blows gears into pieces..replaced with newer alpha 1
Water pump..replaced
Starter solenoid dies...replaced
Batteries died..replaced
Plugs, wires, cap, rotor, upgrade to electronic ignition..replaced

All of these things happened one at a time all out on the water.

This weekend after replacing the stern drive with a rebuilt one I am 10 miles out of Homer, AK and the engine coupler shears the spline teeth.

Now I am faced with pulling the motor I guess unless anyone knows any tricks. I don't understand why it would rip the teeth right off the coupler but it did. When I pulled the drive shaft out the teeth on that were fine but were filled with what was left of the couplers spline teeth.

A week ago I did a compression check...All cyls have 110psi or higher except #6 which wouldn't blow better than a 70psi. This must be my engine vibration problem which I have not solved.

Question to the board would be..what would you do. The boat hull and interior all in excellent shape.

Should I pull the engine and rebuild??

Convert it to a outdrive setup??

Ditch the old 888 setup and find a volvo setup??

I have over $3000 in parts on this thing now.

Who sells good rebuild kits for the old ford 302 blocks?

Does this engine spin backwards?

Should I set it on fire?

[Bond-o]

I don't understand why it would rip the teeth right off the coupler but it did.

It's Usually caused by,......

a) A Lack of proper Lubrication,........

b) Poor Engine Alignment.........

Did you Slather some Grease on the splines of the new outdrive, before you installed it,..??..??.....

Did you check the engine Alignment before you installed the new drive,..??..?...

[JasonB]

A healthy 302 is a good motor. My 19' bowrider has the 888/302. I rebuilt mine 5 years ago after the previous owner got water in the cylinders and left it over the winter. She hasn't missed a lick since.

Your compression problem my be a valve not seating, or something else. Rebuild kits for 302's are relatively inexpensive. Check out Northen Auto Parts. You just have to watch the cam you use and other items that are marine specific (alternator, starter, brass freeze plugs, etc). Also, long/short blocks are easy to get if you go that route from places like Rapid-o. Since you have to pull the motor to replace the coupler anyway, use it as an opportunity to pull the head with the low cylinder and find out what's going on.

[turbosetch]

Yes I greased it all very well. New U-joints as well. Alignment was good. Drive shaft was tight going into the gimbal bearing all around but not out of alignment. New bearing. Its an aftermarket bearing and inside diameter was a touch on the tight side. Drive still slid into place without hammer or foot.

It's Usually caused by,......

a) A Lack of proper Lubrication,........

b) Poor Engine Alignment.........

Did you Slather some Grease on the splines of the new outdrive, before you installed it,..??..??.....

Did you check the engine Alignment before you installed the new drive,..??..?...

[turbosetch]

Yeah I do have to pull it. The engine has over 2000 hours on it from what I can tell. 1973 engine looks original but who knows. I plan on sending the heads to the machine shop for a rebuild and presure test. I will rebuild the bottom end myself I guess.

I found some rebuild kits that are for marine engines that come with new pistons as well. $640 for the whole setup.

There is a question about the size of the bearings from standard - .040 I guess this is for over sized if I had to have some thing machined. There is also a question about reverse rotation. The distributer goes counter clockwise I know that much.

A healthy 302 is a good motor. My 19' bowrider has the 888/302. I rebuilt mine 5 years ago after the previous owner got water in the cylinders and left it over the winter. She hasn't missed a lick since.

Your compression problem my be a valve not seating, or something else. Rebuild kits for 302's are relatively inexpensive. Check out Northen Auto Parts. You just have to watch the cam you use and other items that are marine specific (alternator, starter, brass freeze plugs, etc). Also, long/short blocks are easy to get if you go that route from places like Rapid-o. Since you have to pull the motor to replace the coupler anyway, use it as an opportunity to pull the head with the low cylinder and find out what's going on.

[Bond-o]

The engine has over 2000 hours on it from what I can tell. 1973 engine looks original but who knows. I plan on sending the heads to the machine shop for a rebuild and presure test. I will rebuild the bottom end myself I guess.

Just bring the Whole Motor to your Machinist,........
With 2000hrs,..... You'll need atleast a .030 Overbore to true up the cylinders,.....
For the Bearings,..... That's also Best left to the Machinist,.... They can get bearings in Made to Match sizes, instead of Machining sometimes......

Let an Engine Builer build it for you,+ She'll be ready for Another 2000hrs......

[Coors]

Like Bondo said; I don't get where people in here come in, ask advice, and then state that they will get it bored so and so; have the crank turned .40! I think not, etc. The machine shop knows the limits, I would not run a crank turned .40. I have enough problems in life already. Some blocks are marginal at a .30 over bore. Read up on your block, the info used to be kept close, but it is on the internet now.

[Coors]

Ranting in the wrong post; sorry. As soon as I saw .40, I went nuts.

[qaztwo]

You stated that you replaced your outdrive. Did the new one have a short shaft. Would eat up a coupler fast.

[JasonB]

Bondo is on the money as usual. Let the machine shop sort out what you need. That 302 should be fine with a .030 bore. The bearing sizes you are seeing are in case the crank journals need to be cleaned up, etc. My 302 is .030 over with the crank journals .010.

For education purposes, what internal components are different for a counter rotating motor if this is one? I can see cam, distributor, and maybe oil pump off the top of my head?

A single engine running counter rotating surprises me a bit.

Edit, just checked (it's late and my brain had shut down). Normal distributor rotation for a ford 302 should be CCW, so I think you are dealing with a standard rotation engine.

Look here: http://boxwrench.net/specs/ford_289_302-5.0.htm

[Haut Medoc]

I agree.....
A counter rotating Ford really does boggle the mind!....

[JasonB]

I believe I have read there were some, but I don't think they were mercs.

I edited my post above while you posted Haut, according to the website I pulled up, it's a standard rotation motor. It's too late for my muddled brain to try to remember which my my distro spins without Google..... Site has a cool graphic though showing distro rotation and cylinder numbers since they mirror the typical chevy.


Check here for a rebuild kit idea: http://www.northernautoparts.com/Pro...?ProductId=551

One of these + a cam of my choice in the kit + a marine head gasket set from somewhere like iboats or ebasic = my rebuild. I used the hypertectic kit with good results so far. not sure if that was the best call or not.

[turbosetch]

Ok...Very good info here guys...I am trying to keep the expenses as low as possible since at this point I am running out of cash on this deal. I have to do this myself where ever possible.

Yes the sterndrive was replaced after the gears blew apart on the old one. The drive shaft was matched exactly to the original so it wasn't shorter.

I am wondering if when the gears went at about 1500 rpm it locked everything up. Motor wouldn't even spin. Pieces of the gears were lodged between the case and the gear so it was all seized. This suddent lock up may have weakened things perhaps.

Again thanks for the great info so far. Looks like I have a normal spinning engine. I'm going to call some machine shops and find out what they would charge to go over the block and heads for me, pehaps its not that much cost.

[Limited-Time]

Ok...Very good info here guys...I am trying to keep the expenses as low as possible since at this point I am running out of cash on this deal. I have to do this myself where ever possible.

Yes the stern drive was replaced after the gears blew apart on the old one. The drive shaft was matched exactly to the original so it wasn't shorter.

I am wondering if when the gears went at about 1500 rpm it locked everything up. Motor wouldn't even spin. Pieces of the gears were lodged between the case and the gear so it was all seized. This sudden lock up may have weakened things perhaps.

Again thanks for the great info so far. Looks like I have a normal spinning engine. I'm going to call some machine shops and find out what they would charge to go over the block and heads for me, perhaps its not that much cost.

Sounds like you homed in on a very real possibility there. No telling what else is teetering on the edge of failure in that package. I think you’re on the right track with the total rebuild.

[turbosetch]

I would say it this point anything is possible. If it can break on this boat it has.

My next project is how to get the motor out. Looks easy enough but I have to rent a forklift or find some properly spaced trees to use for a engine puller.

Ahh the fun never ends.

You know when I had my volvo penta system on my last old boat that thing was bullet proof. These mercruiser systems seem to be prone to problems in the drive train.

[Coors]

I would say it this point anything is possible. If it can break on this boat it has.

My next project is how to get the motor out. Looks easy enough but I have to rent a forklift or find some properly spaced trees to use for a engine puller.

Ahh the fun never ends.

You know when I had my volvo penta system on my last old boat that thing was bullet proof. These mercruiser systems seem to be prone to problems in the drive train.

Oh no, you didn't! Now here come the volvo/omc haters...

[bjcsc]

Nonetheless, that's not a bad repair list 34 years later...

[JasonB]

I think the machine work on mine was about $325-350. That included dipping/checking the block, bore 8 cylinders .030, clean/check all 8 rods, remove old pistons from rods, press new ones on, install new freeze plugs, install cam bearings, deck block slightly, clean and deck heads, replace 4-5 valves and rework the seats in one head, turn crank journals .010 to clean them up.

Lot of work. I was happy with the results and price.

[turbosetch]

I'm wondering if for the sake of time and since I'm here in Alaska, it takes a while to get parts shipped I should just order all the parts .030 and have the machine shop over size no matter what. I would imagine one couldn't go wrong in that scenario.

I figure once the engine work is done there isn't much left to break. I will have replaced or rebuilt every moving part just about!!

[JasonB]

There's always a chance that the shop may find your block has some issue that can't be fixed. At that point, it may be worth considering a short/long block instead for time/money sake. Or you may end up paying to bore the block/turn the crank/etc unnecessarily. once a 302 is .030 over, that's about as far as you can go. Next time, you would likely need a new block. I've heard .040 is doable for a car, but it makes the jacket too thin for the rigors of marine use. You may only need a hone, or it may have already been bored in the past. You just won't know till the shop gets it.

Just some thoughts.

[turbosetch]

Yes your bringing up some good points. I guess patience will be the key here. Alaska summers are short. It sucks not having my boat!!

Well first things first I suppose have to figure out how to lift the engine out now!!

There's always a chance that the shop may find your block has some issue that can't be fixed. At that point, it may be worth considering a short/long block instead for time/money sake. Or you may end up paying to bore the block/turn the crank/etc unnecessarily. once a 302 is .030 over, that's about as far as you can go. Next time, you would likely need a new block. I've heard .040 is doable for a car, but it makes the jacket too thin for the rigors of marine use. You may only need a hone, or it may have already been bored in the past. You just won't know till the shop gets it.

Just some thoughts.

[JasonB]

A quick trip to the Home depot or Lowes, then a Hoist from Harbor Freight, and I cam came up with this: http://www.kimandjason.net/webpics/u...2_IMG.JPG.html

We found a boom truck when we did a friends motor as my contraption wasn't quite tall enough to clear the transom.

I've also heard of folks using a forklift.

[jfaraci01]

This boat is cursed I'm sure of it. I have never had it go longer then 5 hours without something major breaking...Here is the run down..

Bought boat...

Dual helm custom steering cable breaks..replaced
Starter locks out on the flywheel and burns up...replaced
Alternator goes bad..replaced
Carb float gets stuck...rebuilt
Stern drive blows gears into pieces..replaced with newer alpha 1
Water pump..replaced
Starter solenoid dies...replaced
Batteries died..replaced
Plugs, wires, cap, rotor, upgrade to electronic ignition..replaced

All of these things happened one at a time all out on the water.

This weekend after replacing the stern drive with a rebuilt one I am 10 miles out of Homer, AK and the engine coupler shears the spline teeth.

Now I am faced with pulling the motor I guess unless anyone knows any tricks. I don't understand why it would rip the teeth right off the coupler but it did. When I pulled the drive shaft out the teeth on that were fine but were filled with what was left of the couplers spline teeth.

A week ago I did a compression check...All cyls have 110psi or higher except #6 which wouldn't blow better than a 70psi. This must be my engine vibration problem which I have not solved.

Question to the board would be..what would you do. The boat hull and interior all in excellent shape.

Should I pull the engine and rebuild??

Convert it to a outdrive setup??

Ditch the old 888 setup and find a volvo setup??

I have over $3000 in parts on this thing now.

Who sells good rebuild kits for the old ford 302 blocks?

Does this engine spin backwards?

Should I set it on fire?

Just a different point of view or perspective... If you are considering a repower why not dump the ford and go with the GM. 305 or 350 marine blocks they are much cheaper than the ford counterparts and places like Jasper sell complete long block with warranty 1-2 years depending. A low compression reading will not give you a "vibration" issue. A misalignment issue will do 2 thing: Will give you a "transferred" vibration (coming from the drive shaft and U joints) and 2: It will eventually wipe out the engine coupler. Normally a misalignment is caused by a motor mount gone a rye due to rot somewhere where the mounting lag bolts are located. You will find which when you pull the motor.

[HT32BSX115]

Just a different point of view or perspective... If you are considering a repower why not dump the ford and go with the GM. 305 or 350 marine blocks they are much cheaper than the ford counterparts and places like Jasper sell complete long block with warranty 1-2 years depending. A low compression reading will not give you a "vibration" issue. A misalignment issue will do 2 thing: Will give you a "transferred" vibration (coming from the drive shaft and U joints) and 2: It will eventually wipe out the engine coupler. Normally a misalignment is caused by a motor mount gone a rye due to rot somewhere where the mounting lag bolts are located. You will find which when you pull the motor.

Howdy,


and welcome to iBoats!


When you post a reply to a thread, it might be a good idea to have a look at the actual date of the thread.


You just replied to a thread that had a last post date of JUNE 2007.


that guy may not even be alive now.......at the least, he's probably already sold or junked that old boat!!

His last post was in MAY of 2010........

don't fret though.........we've all done it!!!!!



Cheers,


Rick