1952 QD-13 Johnson 10hp

[Jeremy1986]

hi everyone.

i was wondering how to set the points and change the impellor on this old motor.

does anyone know where i can get the carb kit for this motor or the part number from omc.

thanks jeremy

[1946Zephyr]

Awesome motor! Fortunately, coils, points and impellers are still available at your local marine parts dealor. If not, you can find stuff here at iboats. If they don't have it, then try vintageoutboard.com, Seaway Marine, in Seattle, WA or Engine Blade and Prop in Milwaukie, WI.

The top secrete file here is a good source of information on all your repair needs. http://forums.iboats.com/johnson-evinrude-outboards/top-secret-file-updated-8-1-2012-a-299680.html

If you have any more questions, we're all here to help.

[Jeremy1986]

this motor has a different setup for the points i didnt see any rocker points all i see is the condensors, coils and the stands where the coils and condensor wires screw to. but no rockers points.

[1946Zephyr]

Are you sure that it's a QD-13? I seem to recall that the ignition system was changed to the more modern rocker style points in 1951. At least they were on big twins and fast twins. You might look for a welch plug on the powerhead, the size of a quarter and see if the model and serial number on it, match that on the transome brackets. It's possible some one changed the powerhead to an older one. QD-12 and newer shows the later style point and coil set up, according to my Johnson manual. The QD-10 and 11 have a system that is similar, but the points set up have a push rod.

[Jeremy1986]

that one the push rod how do you set them when i got the motor today the customer told me it was a 1948 but when i did reearch the motor has forward neutral reverse but 1948 didnt but there no plate on transom bracket. they saying the 1951 was the first year with the shifting and still had the slide throttle.

[Jeremy1986]

i looked at pictures and mine looked like 1952.

[Jeremy1986]

another thing to is the condensors lay down they do stand up.

[F_R]

another thing to is the condensors lay down they do stand up.

The 1949-50 QD-10 & 11 have that goofy magneto with the obsolete 580040 coils, push rod points, and condensers that lay down. The "stands that the wires attach to" that you mention sound to me like the push rod points. They also have the goofy primer carburetor, no such thing as a kit for it.

1952 has the familiar-to-everybody OMC Universal Magneto with rocker points and condensers that stand up. I'm reasonably sure the 1951 did too, but don't have the book on that one.

[1946Zephyr]

Yep, QD-12 1951 was the first year of the universal ignition and I believe that the QD-10 of 1949 was the first OMC with the F-N-R shift and the Fastwin of 1950 was the second OMC product with it. As far as the carb kit, I would try Engine Blade and Prop. They have a pretty good NOS supply of parts for this motor and way earlier. I actually picked up a new set of rings for a 1937 Sportsman single from these folks.

As for your condensors, they lay down. The points on these set at .020. just like the modern ones. You may want to pull the push rods and clean them up and apply a fresh coat of grease on them, so they'll work free. These tend to get sticky, if the motor has sat for many years.

The design for the QD model was pretty much the same, from 1949 - 1952, with the exception of the ignition system. In 1953, the QD and the Super Fastwins were introduced with the Roto-grip handle. It was pretty cool lookin on a "fins forward" motor. 1954, the CD models and Fleetwins were introduced with the Roto-grip. Of course, the first OMC with the Roto-grip was introduced on the Big Twins and the RD's in 1951.

[gjonz]

I have a QD-11 that has the push rod points. The coils are fairly fragile and susceptible to failure I am told.

Most parts can be gotten for this old gem at vintageoutboard.com.

Sea-Way Marine still has points and gaskets too. But your points probably just need to be cleaned and they should be fine.

Greg

[F_R]

I advise complete disassembly of the push rod points and thoughly clean all the grease and gunk out of them. Clean the contacts individually, then reassemble with just a hint of grease on the push rod. Excess only fouls things up again. Note that the flat end of the rod goes against the cam.

Do one set at a time so you have a sample of how the parts stack up when assembling, and don't lose any of the many little insulators and stuff.

If those 580040 coils are still good, consider yourself extremely lucky. Most of them melted down over fifty years ago and you will have to sell the farm to buy new ones now. Some guys have figured out a way to install other coils on the old laminations.

[1946Zephyr]

You could also change over the an armeture plate assembly from the next model year too. I still believe your powerhead is a '49 or a '50.

[Jeremy1986]

hi guys

i uploaded a pic of what the points look like.

after putting back together is it the same theory to set them. make sure im on the high then set with the feeler gauge at .020.

the coils are in very good shape and there are not cracked they look new. the motor has 90pounds of compression on both clylinders and getting spark on top clylinder but not the buttom. customer told me it was running last spring.

anybody know where i can get a shop manual for this motor.

i have a cymer shop manaul but it covers 1956-1972 1.25-125hp.

thanks jeremy

[samo_ott]

Huh. The coils do look in good shape! I'd work on cleaning up the points to try and get the other spark. And as mentioned, maybe see if you can convert a modern mag plate over... that'd make it easy for parts in the future...

[samo_ott]

BTW, I have the '53 QD14 parts manual but it has the modern ignition so no idea what other changes there'd be.

[Jeremy1986]

hi steve

will that manual show me how to remove the lower unit to change the water impellor.

where do think i can get the updated timing plate with the newer coils and points.

how much do you think the motor is worth if is running and do you think i will get my money back if i was to sink 150 to 200 in parts in to. or should i try to get spark back get it running put a new impellor in use it. instead of sinking money in it with all new parts were i wouldnt get my money back.

thanks jeremy

[samo_ott]

It's a parts manual only so it shows the parts breakdown. But lower units are not usually hard to get off. Although I have not done the early QD's but I have several. Even running that engine is not worth much in my area... Maybe $300 if it was running well... And as for a 'modern' ignition plate, you can get one off any OMC engine from 3-40hp from '52/'53 to the early 70's, give or take. But I'm sure a year or two later QD would probably be the closest... But again. I have not worked on my early QD's so don't know for sure.

[Jeremy1986]

steve

do you want me to send a pm with email for that manual. i did recieve the 5.5
i hearing that the early are a pain to take the lower unit off

thanks jeremy

[TN-25]

When my 1950 Johnson 5 was restored, Peter McDowel (North York Marine) ended up using a newer 1953 block because it wasn't worn out in the crank / bearings as was my original. The added benefit was that the newer block uses the easy to find point & condensor, not the museum piece guilotine points. When he put it together he discovered that the flywheel was different on the newer block with the updated ignition system.

I'm not sure if the flywheel was changed when the QD switched to the modern ignition but you would be well advised to research it (or run it by one of the pros on this site).

BTW, the revised flywheel meant a revised ready-pull starter assembly in the case of my 5 so be prepared for that.

I think the revised ignition made its debut on the BigTwin 25s of 1951 and was phased in on the other outboards for 1952.

[asdasc]

You would probably not get your money back out if you put the $200 into it. Around my area, older motors like these don't sell that well. Guys that don't know how to fix them won't touch them, even if they run. Guys that know how to fix them are like us, all know what it will cost, and not willing to pay much. When I see one online, I am pretty picky. If he wants $2-300, I just pass by. If they want $25-75, I might pick it up if it is interesting.

THere are plenty of old motors around, that are still serviceable. Many guys on this site have 20-100 of them already. Face it, we are a dying breed. Most guys today want a new motor without any headaches. And it is a safety thing if they don't know how to make emergency repairs on the water.

[1946Zephyr]

My Johnson service manual shows the QD's changed over to the universal in 1951. As I said before, I think the power head on the motor in this thread has been changed over to an earlier one.

[wbeaton]

I agree with you, 1946Zephyr, That is a 1949-50 ignition so the motor is likely a QD-10/11. The coils look like new style Sierra's on the old laminations. Test them with a multimeter. They probably work.

The old mag plate may not work as a direct replacement. I know JBJ had some trouble trying to retrofit a newer mag on a 1952 QD (I think). Turned out the timing was different. If Jason comes mayb e he'll shed some light.

The QD-10/11 lower unit is completely different than the 1953. Post your model number so we can help.

[F_R]

I agree with you, 1946Zephyr, That is a 1949-50 ignition so the motor is likely a QD-10/11. The coils look like new style Sierra's on the old laminations. Test them with a multimeter. They probably work.

The old mag plate may not work as a direct replacement. I know JBJ had some trouble trying to retrofit a newer mag on a 1952 QD (I think). Turned out the timing was different. If Jason comes mayb e he'll shed some light.

The QD-10/11 lower unit is completely different than the 1953. Post your model number so we can help.

Somebody has replaced the original coils with newer ones on the old laminations. Looks pretty good.

As for replacing the whole thing with the newer style, somebody's got to show me and I'm not even from Missouri.

[1946Zephyr]

Yea, it's possible that the points cam may be keyed a little different on that model, than on the universal ignition system models. The only way to tell, is if the part numbers on the cranks are the same or not. If the cranks have the same part number, then I can't see a reason why one couldn't take the mag plate off of a 1951-52 QD and convert it. the Cam will have to be changed too, in order for the timing to collaborate with the points and coil. The 1953 model could possibly have some differences, because that was the first year that the QD had the Roto-grip throttle set up.

[wbeaton]

Somebody has replaced the original coils with newer ones on the old laminations. Looks pretty good.

As for replacing the whole thing with the newer style, somebody's got to show me and I'm not even from Missouri.

My 1949 QD-10 has the universal ignition. I know its not original, but I don't know how the conversion was made since I never really cared to look into. Could be I have a later QD powerhead or possibly the crank and mag were swapped together. Maybe I'll take a look when I go home in a couple weeks.