90HP Honda 4 Stroke Fuel Problem

[johnnyquest]

Honda 90HP 4 Stroke Fuel Problem. I am having tremendous difficulty starting my Honda initally. Just when I am about to give up starting, the engine starts. After the inital ignition, the motor starts immediately. I begin startup by raising the auto choke lever. Eventually I have to use the manual choke and flip the auto choke up and down to get it going. And by the way, the gas bulb is pumped and the tank vent is open while attempting to start. This problem began when I somehow got bad gasoline. The gas had water and some red (rust?)residue. Since that time I took it to a dealer for repair. They rebuilt the carburator. I now have a rebuilt carburator, an oversized fuel filter, new gas tank, and pristine gas. Dispite this work, it still doesnt work properly. I took the motor back to the dealer who could had to jump the battery because they cranked the motor so many times. Dealer said that the problem was a weak battery. Not true. I am still having problems starting. The motor is somehow fuel-starved on the initial ignition. Any thoughts on what could be causing the problem?

[JB]

Hi, Johnnie.We don't get to hear about many problems with Hondas, but yours seems pretty straightforward. Your engine is either flooded or fuel starved on initial startup, and on initial startup only.It is unlikely that all four carbs have the same problem at the same time, unless they were set up incorrectly for cold starting in the first place.Since it is a 4 stroke, it is safe to try a little starting fluid as a way of confirming that the problem is fuel starvation, not flooding.The most common cause of your symptoms is insufficient fuel pumped to the carbs before attempting to start. It then falls to your fuel pump to fill the carbs under starter power. When the carbs finally have enough gas, it starts.You may have some fuel flow restriction between the primer and the carbs. Remember that you may have the filter and four carbs to fill when you pump that bulb.Good luck and let us know what you find.

[Skinnywater]

Hello JoHnny,JB has you going in the right direction. Since you have to be on the choke as much as you are, I agree that your engine is fuel starved.I'd suggest that a copy of your post here, your reciepts of thier recent work, and 3 firm words to the Service Manager.........."Please fix it."Were you told or under the assumption the previous diagnosis and repairs would not be guarenteed?Again, please keep us informed.

[Hawaiian]

What year is the motor? Is it still under warranty? It may be a fuel pump problem.

[johnnyquest]

The motor is a 96/97 vintage. And I have ordered two new fuel pumps. I don't know for sure if the fuel pump is the problem, but the carb was rebuilt and fuel filter is clean. Unfortunately, there are no rebuild kits so one has to buy the entire pump for about 60+ bucks each.

[Hawaiian]

Johnny, when you say the CARB was rebuilt, you do mean that all FOUR carbs were rebuilt dont you?

[jim dozier]

I am not familiar with the control equipment on the Honda, but I have one question from your description. You say you are flipping the auto choke up and down. I was just wondering, that sounded suspiciously like moving the fast idle lever on some other brands of OBs. What kind of choke mechanism does the Honda have and have you verified that it is actuating the choke butterflies in the carbs completely shut whent you flip the "choke" lever. Again I don't know this engines controls but its just a thought.

[JB]

It amazes me how people will throw money away replacing parts that don't need replacing.I seriously doubt that your fuel pump is your problem, Johnnie. If it were your engine would start, then die. You are getting the opposite.Same for the carbs (4).Your problem is getting the carbs full of gas before you try to start.Did you do the test with the starter fluid? What was the result?Quit replacing/rebuilding stuff and troubleshoot to identify what is really wrong before you go broke.

[Hawaiian]

Johnny, on my 2002 Honda 90, I push the key in and the choke is engaged. There is also a manual choke on the motor. Also, I said the fuel pump MAY be the problem. I didn't intend for you to go run out and buy a new one. It may well be worth the hour of labor (approx. $65) to have a technician have a look at your motor to determine the problem.

[hondon]

You need to take this engine back to that dealer and insist that this carb work was not satisfactorally done.Did they vaccume sync those carbs?Why did my trip to your shop not help me much?How much hands on training do your techs have in dealing with multi carb 4 stroke engines?This stuff is not fun and games.Those carbs can be hard to clean.There is no way to accomplish the starting fluid test JB suggests on this engine, without breaking the airbox. What are the results of a compression test, or better yet a leakdown?

[45_red]

Make sure you are getting a good flow of fuel to the fuel pump, disconnect the fuel line as near the pump as you can&pump the bulb, make sure you get a steady stream of fuel.

[MajBach]

It's safe to assume you are using the same technique to start this motor that you did before you got the bad gas. Of course that means that something got snafued. However, you may want to try 'pumping the gas' with the throttle a few times first. I have the same motor and I was always disappointed with how it started - even from new. On the other hand, mine is coupled with and OMC control box, not Honda. I have found that using the choke does little in anything but cold weather and priming the bulb also is not needed since your carbs will have plently of fuel in them. My technique is to pump my throttle 3 times and then bring it back to about 25%, hold the key down (choke) just until it kicks in and start it to about 1500 rpm or so for about 10 seconds, then bring it back to idle. Of course, this is only when it is cold. When it's warm, I can start this thing just by winking at it.