What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

[bruceb58]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Actually I need to look at one of my sbc blocks, I'm almost positive the auto blocks aren't tapped for water jacket drain plugs....

Eventually, you are going to realize they are the same thing.

 

[Bondo]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Then why don't you ask me?

Ayuh,... I have,.. Twice,... Here's the 3rd time...
What are your Precieved differences...

Originally Posted by 270win
Actually I need to look at one of my sbc blocks, I'm almost positive the auto blocks aren't tapped for water jacket drain plugs....

Nope,... They're All drilled,+ tapped the Same....

I'm not trying to start a pizzin' match,... Just trying to Educate you....

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Ayuh,... I have,.. Twice,... Here's the 3rd time...
What are your Precieved differences...


Nope,... They're All drilled,+ tapped the Same....

I'm not trying to start a pizzin' match,... Just trying to Educate you....

No problem, you don't come across like you're trying to prove anything. I'm not above learning something. I still can't find the specs on a MCM 5.7 roller motor cam. I'd like to know the adv. duration, duration @.050, lift @ whtever rocker ratio they use(probably 1.5), LSA, ICL, compression ratio and quench.

I know GM says that using their crate motors in a marine application voids warranty...perhaps they're only concerned about salt???

The head gaskets alone would make me want a marine motor vs a truck motor.

Hey, maybe it's just me. I've got airplane buddies that run auto filters and other various parts on their airplanes. Not me, if it's going in my plane it's an aviation part...if it's going in my boat it's marine specific.

I know guys that run chevy motors in their GTO's and Mustangs...not me...like I said, that's just my opinion.

I think a new GM truck motor (crate engine) is about the same cost as a motor from Rapido or marineenginesales...but the marine engines have warranty.



And someone else posted about finding $600 crate motors on CL. If you find new crate motors for that, I'll pay you a finders fee and buy every single one you can come across.

 

[ckgreenman]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

No problem, you don't come across like you're trying to prove anything. I'm not above learning something. I still can't find the specs on a MCM 5.7 roller motor cam. I'd like to know the adv. duration, duration @.050, lift @ whtever rocker ratio they use(probably 1.5), LSA, ICL, compression ratio and quench.

I actually just found this info about 10 minutes ago when looking up the specs for my cam (811658)

http://forums.iboats.com/showpost.php?p=467670&postcount=2

The head gaskets alone would make me want a marine motor vs a truck motor.

You could always take the heads off and put stainless head gaskets in. That's what I plan on doing if I decide to build my own.

And someone else posted about finding $600 crate motors on CL. If you find new crate motors for that, I'll pay you a finders fee and buy every single one you can come across.

Problem is if you pay for that and then go through it making sure all the parts are marine grade you're probably back to the same cost.

I've done some checking and a full marine gasket set is about $250-$300 for everything. Plus I just looked up the camshaft for my engine (350 Magnum Alpha) and it's $417. I can get a custom grind at a local race shop for around $350. Plus a crate engine is probably going to have a bunch of stuff you won't need (intake, carb, etc.). I guess you could always sell what you don't need to help recoup the costs though.

 

[mylesm260]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

I will echo what I've said before.

If you had two options:

#1.

-Remove you're heads, clean you're deck, clean you're heads and install marine head gaskets.
-Remove you're water pump and install a marine water pump
-Remove you're Frost plugs and install brass ones

or

#2.

Install a closed cooling system.


which one would you rather do?

A boat with a closed cooling system is much better to own IMO. And why change all that other stuff if you don't have to.

 

[Bondo]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

The head gaskets alone would make me want a marine motor vs a truck motor.

Ayuh,.... Back in the days when Steel shim headgaskets were the norm, I could sorta agree,...
But,...
99% of All headgaskets now a days are Composites,... They ALL use Stainless Steel firerings in 'em....
Again,... No Difference there....

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

I actually just found this info about 10 minutes ago when looking up the specs for my cam (811658)

You could always take the heads off and put stainless head gaskets in. That's what I plan on doing if I decide to build my own.

Problem is if you pay for that and then go through it making sure all the parts are marine grade you're probably back to the same cost.

I've done some checking and a full marine gasket set is about $250-$300 for everything. Plus I just looked up the camshaft for my engine (350 Magnum Alpha) and it's $417. I can get a custom grind at a local race shop for around $350. Plus a crate engine is probably going to have a bunch of stuff you won't need (intake, carb, etc.). I guess you could always sell what you don't need to help recoup the costs though.

thanks for the cam specs-
MCM roller- 197/207@.050 (the adv. duration would be nice to know, that would tell us how long the valves are off the seat.) .430/.450 adv. lift ecl 106ATDC/112BTDC and LSA 109

Anyone got the GM crate with roller setup specs?...the truck motor since that seems to be the comparison we're trying to make. My iPhone won't work right on GM Performance website bacause it requires flash.

As you pointed out, even buying a good used engine for $400, if you only upgrade the gaskets, water pump and cam, you're still over $1000 total and that's still a used engine...with no warranty.

I'm not about throwing away money, but I just can't make sense out of doing anything other than buying a reman with warranty. And I like building my own engines, that way I know for sure what's been done to it...but it would cast me far more to do that than it would to buy a reman with warranty.



I agree, replacing the head gaskets is pretty simple with the motor on a stand.

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Install a closed cooling system.


which one would you rather do?

A boat with a closed cooling system is much better to own IMO. And why change all that other stuff if you don't have to.

How much is a complete closed cooling setup? That's something worth thinkjg about when I replace my engine next month.

 

[Don S]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

How much is a complete closed cooling setup? That's something worth thinkjg about when I replace my engine next month.

You would be better off starting a new thread with your question instead of starting a whole different line of questions on this post.

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

You would be better off starting a new thread with your question instead of starting a whole different line of questions on this post.

Youre right, not trying to hijack the thread.

Thanks

 

[ckgreenman]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

So along the same lines as the original post, other than the stainless head gasket inserts, are there any other gaskets that are different or could I just use a standard 350 gasket set?

 

[Bondo]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

are there any other gaskets that are different or

Nope....

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Not to contradict anyone, but it would appear that Fel-Pro makes marine specific gaskets. The part numbers appear to be different from the automotive gaskets...Their site also specifies that these are marine specific gaskets...primarily the exhaust manifold, thermostat and head gaskets.

Fel-Pro makes good quality gaskets too...IMO

 

[BigBoatinOkie]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

If I bought the $450 dollar crate engine, I don't think it would end up costing $1000. I have a marine water pump, starter, alternator, carb (assuming the q-jet 750 will work okay for now). Sounds like I'd only be out maybe $50 bucks for freeze plugs and a few gaskets if the motor in good shape. My bro-in-law has a complete rotating assembly if I was to need it as well. It's true that it definately won't be warrantied, and that's a definite downside. But, it's still in the truck and I can see it run, that's worth something.

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

If I bought the $450 dollar crate engine, I don't think it would end up costing $1000. I have a marine water pump, starter, alternator, carb (assuming the q-jet 750 will work okay for now). Sounds like I'd only be out maybe $50 bucks for freeze plugs and a few gaskets if the motor in good shape. My bro-in-law has a complete rotating assembly if I was to need it as well. It's true that it definately won't be warrantied, and that's a definite downside. But, it's still in the truck and I can see it run, that's worth something.

That does make a huge difference. Your Q-jet and accessories should be fine too...for only $500 it's worth a shot for sure. You could still sell it if you decide to don't like it for some reason...plus, you could make a time/dated video of your 305 running prior to removal so you could sell it too. Heck, you might get it done and break even.

I think the $1000 figure would be adding a roller cam setup and the marine gasket set.

Curious to see how it runs!

 

[BigBoatinOkie]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Check these out

http://tulsa.craigslist.org/pts/1541849432.html

http://tulsa.craigslist.org/pts/1533790277.html

Not marine engines, but a good deal nonetheless I think.

 

[BigBoatinOkie]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Allow me to ask about rv cams. Is it correct that an rv cam is intended to yield more torque at lower rpms at the expense of some horsepower at higher rpms? If so, would you say that's a good choice for a boat, given that a boat (at least in my case) will be run at no more that 4300-4600 at wot? Also, would an rv cam cause any undue stresses or vibration on the engine and thereby rebuce the life of the engine? RV cams are pretty mild still aren't they? Educate me please.

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Allow me to ask about rv cams. Is it correct that an rv cam is intended to yield more torque at lower rpms at the expense of some horsepower at higher rpms? If so, would you say that's a good choice for a boat, given that a boat (at least in my case) will be run at no more that 4300-4600 at wot? Also, would an rv cam cause any undue stresses or vibration on the engine and thereby rebuce the life of the engine? RV cams are pretty mild still aren't they? Educate me please.

what are the specs on the RV cam you're looking at?

No undue stresses, vibrations or reduction of engine life...

 

[BigBoatinOkie]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

Actually, there is not a specific one i'm looking at. Just trying to learn. What would you suggest I look for in a cam?

 

[270win]

Re: What makes a marine engine a MARINE engine

This cam would get you close...it's for an 87 or older sbc.
LINK

Of course without knowing the many other parameters like CR, head design, etc it's tough to say.