Cut out switch adjustment question

[BackWoodsTracker]

Yes I did read this

Cutout switch
The cutout switch should also be checked. The correct adjustment for the switch is to activate when the switch arm has moved 1/8". Check this with a 1/8" drill and a multimeter. With the key 'OFF' put the multimeter across the switch (points ignitions will have to have the points open for this) and start moving the switch arm. When the meter shows that the switch has closed, check the gap between the switch arm and the actuating lever, it should be 1/8". Bend the arm of the switch to achieve the dimension.
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My boat had points, but has been converted over. When I put the meter to the two wires, and the meter set to where it gives a sound, no matter what I do with the switch, it still buzzes. Am I using the wrong setting or what? If I start the motor and activate the switch, it kills the motor, so I know the switch is good. Also, am I putting the drill in the right place, just under the roller in the little valley, or should I be in a different spot? I have the feeling I'm not the first one messing with this, the arm was bent to where the switch didn't activate til it was at the top of the peaks. I have new cables in it now, and they are adjusted properly. Lake test is tomorrow again and I would like it to go smoothly for my dad. He's been patient with it so far, but he needs it right soon, or he might toss me overboard!

 

[Bondo]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

If I start the motor and activate the switch, it kills the motor, so I know the switch is good.

Ayuh,... Leave it Alone til the water test....

You don't Know that there's a Problem,.... And, if you Break that switch,.. That's a Real Problem...
Most of them are NLA....

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

I know there's a problem, we already had a day on the lake. I just turned the motor off when we wanted to hit neutral. It works fine on the muffs, just not so good in the lake. I know this is out of adjustment, and I'd like to have it close so my dad can have a relaxing day rather than working on it more. He isn't one to let me mess with it out there, and it's kind of hard to do in the driveway. I know I could just keep bending it til it works while I'm out there, but, he wouldn't let me do that. We have tried to launch 6 times now, and only once has he let me leave the harbor. I'd love to have it shift smoothly for him so he can feel good about bringing his friends out to fish. No boat owner wants to kill the motor to shift, not if it can be adjusted to work right.

 

[jtybt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Sounds like you need the lower shift cable replaced.

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

I replaced both the lower cable (from shift plate to stern drive), and the upper cable ( shift plate to control box). I haven't tried it on the lake since replacing them, but I'd still like to know that I had adjusted everything before I went out. Not find out that I could have avoided a bad day at the launch holding up the ramp, when all I might need to do to avoid that would be to adjust this before I go, not after I get there. So, can anybody help me?

 

[Bondo]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

I haven't tried it on the lake since replacing them,

Ayuh,... If it needs Adjusting,......
It Has to be done,.... IN THE WATER.....

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

I just wish my dad had the patience to let me mess with it at the lake. I know I still need to adjust some things, but I'll have to do that when he's not around. So, should I just keep bending til it works, or can somebody give some details on it? The shift cables are right, just checked them again. I wasn't allowed to go out on the lake because the problem was still there. I only got to bend the arm twice, and it was time to go, he had enough. I sure wish my Chevy Tracker could pull a 4000 lb boat!

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Maybe I have to be a bit more specific in my question. When I need to check this part, When the meter shows that the switch has closed, check the gap between the switch arm and the actuating lever, it should be 1/8". Bend the arm of the switch to achieve the dimension. where is this gap supposed to be? A picture would sure help, and I can't seem to find this in my manual.

 

[jtybt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

To be able to adjust the cutout switch, a little understanding how it works might help.

I will be referring to a merc but the principles for the dog clutch are the same.

Forward gear and reverse gear are on the same shaft separated by the dog clutch. The dogs are heavy duty 'square' protrusions coming out the side. they align with dogs on the forward and reverse gear. To shift into forward and reverse, all you're doing is sliding the dog clutch into meshing with either forward or reverse.

The trick is to get the dog clutch positioned in neutral exactly in the middle. The dog clutch has a finite amount of movement. Let's just say 1" travel so it will go into forward 1/2" throw and reverse 1/2" throw every time.

You can test this out of water by first putting in forward gear and rotating prop clockwise so it clicks or ratchets. Helps if you have someone doing the shifting.

Now shift into reverse and rotate prop counter-clockwise and feel and hear the ratcheting. They should have the exact same feel and sound. The adjustment is to turn the barrel of thew lower cable on the inside of the boat. It's a little trial and error thing.

For the cutout switch adjustment. bending the little SS lever to control amount of movement it has against the switch button has to be done in the water but you should be pretty close by getting the clutch adjusted correctly.

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Thanks jtybt and Bond-o. I'm glad to read about the clutch having the same feel and sound, it does. I also found the place to put the leads to my multi-meter for the switch. I filled one of those plastic totes with water to try it in the driveway, it seems to shift fine now, but I lost 1/2 the water when I shift so it might not be right yet. I guess I'll be pulling a 22' cabin cruiser with a little Chevy Tracker so I can mess with it. I'll bet it take low 4x4 to get it out! I'll be doing that after the Packer game tonight. Maybe get the old man out fishing tomorrow, I hope!

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

trust me this is not a trial and error thing and some posters still dont understand what and why the shift cut swicth is there and when it activates and it has hothing to do with positiong the shift clutch.
most modern large displacement high HP outboards and stern drives utilizing a dog clucth cut what is called a back draft on the dogs on the gear and clutch usually 5 to 7 degrees.
once engaged you either MUST relive the load on the propshaft, hard to do with the prop rotating in the water, or momentarily relive the load on the input,drive, shaft while moving the clutch away from the gear.
thats the sole and only function of the shift switch used on dog clutch mercruiser,mercurys,yamaha out board and stern drives as well as OMC and BRP large motors.
most modern v6 outboards and dog clutch stern drives utilize shift cut switchs.
when the cable is adjusted as per manual and all spool or shift cam wear is measured as per manual it usually works just as the engineering dept wrote it in the service manual.

 

[jtybt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

BS

It has EVERYTHING to do with the position of the dog clutch in relation to the gears.

You are right in that the cutout switch's only purpose is the relieve pressure on the under-cut of the dogs but unless positioned correctly you can chip the dogs if not fully engaged and it continues hit and miss.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

repeat, the cut out switch has NOTHING to do with clutch location.
thats the function of the cables and shift mechanism.
the ONLY function the shift cut switch has is to momentarily disrupt the ign system to release the load on the input to the gearbox to allow the clutch to disengage.
stalling going into gear is indicative of a bad low cable or a binding shift shaft or gross cable misadjustment.
stalling coming out of gear is indicative of the same or could be the shifter is being moved to slowly.
all shifting should be done with quick firm movements.
bending the cut out switch arm IS NOT reccomended.

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

I'm happy to see some action about the question. I know the cables are adjusted properly. I get a good positive shift in both forward and reverse on the muffs. The cables are new and they move freely. The arm was bent to where the switch didn't activate til the roller was completely out of the valley and up on the peaks. I know the previous owner had some hack working on it, it had automotive parts such as the starter and alternater. The carb was rebuilt, but the little spring that goes in the accerator plunger wasn't there, mixture screws only 1/2 turn out from seated, ect.... Wires were spliced, most were left bare, but 3 did have tape, masking not electrical.

If I could get a way to set the cutout switch here on land, I'd be tickled pink.

Cutout switch
The cutout switch should also be checked. The correct adjustment for the switch is to activate when the switch arm has moved 1/8". Check this with a 1/8" drill and a multimeter. With the key 'OFF' put the multimeter across the switch (points ignitions will have to have the points open for this) and start moving the switch arm. When the meter shows that the switch has closed, check the gap between the switch arm and the actuating lever, it should be 1/8". Bend the arm of the switch to achieve the dimension.


Can somebody please show me what part is the actuating lever? And where do I check the gap at?

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

like Bondo pointed out, you CANNOT test the shift cut switch operation on a flusher, unless you also have a dynomometer.
prop shaft MUST be loaded to test the operation of the shift cut switch. switch should NOT activate at all on a flusher. if it does a cable or shift part is failing between the transfer block and the clutch.

 

[JustJason]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Maybe this is an easier way to understand it. You have 2 shift cables. 1 from the control box to the shift plate(UPPER cable). The other from the shift plate to the drive.(LOWER cable)

When you push on the shifter to go into gear, the first cable (upper) starts to move, at the same exact time the other cable (lower) moves as well, they are syncronized.

When you pull on the shifter to come out of gear, the upper cable starts to move. The lower cable WANTS to move, but it can't. It can't because the teeth on the clutch and gears are under cut, and want to still stay together. They want to stay together because the propshaft is still loaded when the boat is in the water. That propeller acts like a giant parachute when the boat in the water, and drags/loads the prop shaft. Now the cables are unsyncronized.

Unsyncronized cables basically means 1 cable is moving, and the other cable is binding. It is that binding that activates the cut out switch. As soon as the switch activates, the load is released on the driveshaft, the lower cable can then pull the clutch into nuetral. As soon as that happens, the cables become syncronized again and that cut out switch deactivates. The whole process happens in less than 1/2 a second, very quickly.

The binding of the lower cable is calculated into how the entire shift system works as a whole. If the cable starts to go bad then the bind becomes to great. What happens then is intermittent stalling coming OUT of gear, followed by stalling all the time coming OUT of gear, followed by not being able to come out of gear at will withought shutting off the boat.... OR...The the customer will usually crank up the idle rpms. Then the customer replaces the cutout switch with a new one, and wonders why it still doesn't work. Then his frustration the customer will take that new shift cutout switch he installed out of the loop completely. Then the customer finally calls you after he's ripped the arm off the remote control.

Now that you know how it works maybe you'll take a minute and stop effing with that switch.
I've replaced 100+ cables.... maybe 3 or 4 switches.
If you've already bent that switch arm to hell and back you may be better of just replacing it at this point and moving on to the real cause of your problems.

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Why can't I get a straight answer from you guys? Even if I put a new switch in, wouldn't it then have to be adjusted to that 1/8"? I read the sticky about how it works, no need to keep reposting that info. All I'm asking is where to get this 1/8" measurement from. Please don't tell me why it shouldn't be the problem, or that my lower shift cable needs to be adjusted. There are plenty of threads I found on that. My arm was bent by a previous owner, all I need to know is where to bend it back to. The cables are adjusted right, the thing is, even with them adjusted right, that dumb switch needs to activate when the engineers wanted it to activate. I really didn't think it would be so hard to get an answer to this.

 

[totx]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

The arm was bent to where the switch didn't activate til the roller was completely out of the valley and up on the peaks.

Can somebody please show me what part is the actuating lever? And where do I check the gap at?

Don't know your type of engine and shiftplate, can you post a picture?

But sound like the switch was activating to late.

If you have the switch with an arm and roller.

The switch should activate when the roller is 1/8" (3 mm) out of the grove.
(Move the shiftplate by hand and messure when the switch activate with the engine off)

Then you can idle the engine, and move shiftplate by hand.
When you are able to putt a 1/8 drill bit in the bottom of the grove, the engine should kill.

Then you should be close, but need to test in water...

 

[BackWoodsTracker]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

Thank you for that simple answer. It's a Merc system just like the one in the sticky about how they work. I now have it to where it kills when there is room for the 1/8" drill to fit. Now to find another day to bring it to the lake.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Cut out switch adjustment question

problem is once that switch arm gets bent to odd angles and such sometimes its simply impossible to reset.
the switch arm is correct from the factory and once installed on the plate should never be touched.
I wish they would take the section on bending it out of the manual.
when you go to the lake make sure you remember why the switch is there and what its trying to do and if the arm is bent to much the 1/8ths thing may have to go out the window unless the switch is replaced