can my crank shaft be seized?

[rewdan]

I have a merc 4.3l v6. Unfortunately it got washed ashore and filled with sea water last year. We lifted it out straight away and got everything running as normal before fogging the engine and spraying a couple of cans of wd40 everywhere. I went to use it this year and the starter was clicking, I took it off and it was rusted inside so I have bought a new one. I am concerned that the flywheel could be seized as well, is this possible. The small section I can see looks a bit rusty but solid and I can't turn the crankshaft. There is no water in the oil and the camshaft turns easily by hand but not the crankshaft. Should I just give the new starter a go and see what happens?
Also, the starter solonoid has two small studs and I only have one small cable, does it matter which one I connect the small wire to?
Thanks in advance

 

[FreeBeeTony]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

How can the camshaft turn and not the crankshaft?

 

[rewdan]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

Ok, you must have guessed i am a long way from being a mechanic!
What I meant is that there are two large wheels on the front of the engine, they have belts that drive the alternator and powersteering pump. I can easily turn the upper one of the big wheels which I was guessing was connected to the camshaft. I can't turn the lower one which I was guessing was connected to the crankshaft. Sorry I got it wrong but engines aren't my strong point.

 

[futz]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

remove the spark plugs, and use the starter to turn over the motor. if it turns then it's not siezed, if it doesn't turn, remove the drive, and try turning it again the motor. if it doesn't turn with the drive off your looking for another 4.3.

 

[airdvr1227]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

You'll never turn the crankshaft by hand. Have you installed the starter and attempted to start it?

Also, the starter solonoid has two small studs and I only have one small cable, does it matter which one I connect the small wire to?

How was it wired when you took it off?

 

[windsors03cobra]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

That upper big pulley is the water pump, you should be able to rotate the lower pulley which is the crankshaft atleast a little by hand.
Remove the plugs and try to turn it over by hand, should be easy as pie and smooth.
Sea Water soaked, man that sucks and I'm sure its not good all over that boat, the starter is just the beginning. I'm sorry.

 

[rewdan]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

I havn't tried the new starter yet, I have fitted it but was wondering, if the flywheel is stuck will it damage the new starter? If it won't damage the starter motor then I will give it a try, it may be that there is nothing wrong with the engine but I didn't want to damage another starter motor!

 

[airdvr1227]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

I say give it a try. I don't think you'll hurt the starter unless you hold the key on and it's not turning anything.

 

[rewdan]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

thanks for all the advice guys. I am in Ibiza, Spain and only have a few days left before returning to the uk. I am going to try the starter motor tomorrow, kill or cure. I will let you know how I get on.

 

[jtybt]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

For one thing WD40 is OK for freeing up something 'right now' The problem are the solvents that evaporate it quickly leaving a dry surface that readily oxidizes (rusts)..Start using something like PB blaster or Marvel Mystery oil. They 'evaporate' slightly as any petroleum product but still leave an oily/protected surface behind. There are the more expensive marine products if you must use strictly marine products.



OH! And I think you're WAYYYY past the point of reviving this engine.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

Ok, you must have guessed i am a long way from being a mechanic!
What I meant is that there are two large wheels on the front of the engine, they have belts that drive the alternator and powersteering pump. I can easily turn the upper one of the big wheels which I was guessing was connected to the camshaft. I can't turn the lower one which I was guessing was connected to the crankshaft. Sorry I got it wrong but engines aren't my strong point.

Howdy,


I hate to say this but it appears that we are not going to be able to effectively "repair" your engine/drive etc......


You should REALLY have someone look at it that knows what they're doing since you're time crunched and... "engines aren't my strong point"

Cheers,



Rick

 

[Maclin]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

For future reference, one or more pistons are usually rusted to the cylinder walls or rust has built up from the cylinder wall and is underneath or on top of the rings keeping the pistons from moving up and down. The crankshaft could probably turn in the journals but cannot due to the leverage the pistons have over it.

 

[Polar_Bus]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

In my experiences with ANY type of internal combustion type engine, once any type of water has been introduced to the internal components, no matter how "aggressive" the person attempts to combat the ingested water (I.E WD40, pouring Mystery oil down the cyl, and so on). The engine may run ok for a short period of time, but the engine now has a very high probability of corrosion related mechanical failure. Corrosion from water sets in way more quick that most people think. PWC's are notorious for this exact scanario, as the PWC engines frequently ingest water when they are "rolled" over in the water. This is also an issue with snowmobiles, when operators run their snowmobiles over thin ice, and break through sinking the sled in water.

 

[futz]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

fresh water i would say maybe 24 hours if water was left in the cylinders.

Saltwater would have to be flushed 2-3 hours tops and even then i don't know.

 

[grahamh]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

Just for the sake of argument, I have successfully revived a car engine which was "seized" when the piston rings rusted to the cylinder walls. It was a b18 Volvo motor, basically the same as the b20 found in some older boats. (I was a Volvo tech)

Anyway, for those who care, we did it by:

Putting a mixture of penetrating oil and atf in the cylinders, and then letting it sit overnight. (or over a weekend, I forget)

Then we tried to break the engine loose using a breaker bar on the crank pully, but it still wouldn't move, and we were going to break the bolt trying any harder.

So we put it in 4th gear, had someone push the clutch in, rolled it down the shop drivway as fast as we could, and dumped the clutch, and after a couple tries, it broke free! (I'm sure it didn't do the drivetrain any help though)

We ran the starter motor with the plugs out to clear out as much oil as we could, cleaned out the carb, and she started right up! It smoked like crazy for a few minutes while all the oil got burned off.

2 years later, the car is still on the road and running great!



I'm not saying it will work for your situation, but every now and then motors do come back from the dead.

 

[futz]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

Oh yea fill the whole motor to the top with kero, diesel fuel. Used to be called " pickling a motor " let it sit for a week.

Drain all the diesel fuel. then see if you can break it free. Those were the good ole days. When you do get it running mix 1/3, kero to 2/3 oil capacity of the oil pan and run the motor. Will clean it out. Drain and pour in the proper amount of oil run it for a hour or 2.

Drain again and pour in the proper amount of oil run again for a few hours and drain again. Need to change the oil filter , at every fluid change.

Or you can pull the motor, pull the head, turn it over open it up and see whats what.

Can it be saved? Don't know i can't see or touch the motor.

 

[rewdan]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

hi guys
I tried the starter motor and got a click, checked out the 'Adults only' section on this forum, went and bought a testing light with ground clip and tested. Turns out its the slave solenoid. Late last night I shorted out the two large points on the slave solenoid and the engine turned over. Then I had to leave Ibiza and am now back in the uk so cannot continue getting my boat operational again for a few weeks. (back there in september). Great testing advice in that section. I did want to ask one thing. Do I just change the slave solenoid or could there be a reason it's not working properly? Do they just wear out.
Thanks for all your advice, I think my boat will be back in the water next summer!

 

[gadget73]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

The solenoids do go bad. Most likely it got water in it and corroded internally. When I was turning wrenches on these things for a living, I usually had to replace a couple a year that simply quit working.

 

[rewdan]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

well, most of you won't believe this but anyway...
in november I went back to Ibiza and changed the solenoid, the engine turned over!
I have just been back there again and for 4 days and tried starting the engine every day, it was turning over but flattening the battery before starting. I even had jump leads from my car hooked up but no good.
There was plenty of fuel collecting in the carb and I checked one plug that was clean and sparking as I think it should do when I turned the engine over, any ideas? maybe the battery is no longer powerful enough even though it was fully charged overnight each time.
I think its goning to start somehow!

 

[rbh]

Re: can my crank shaft be seized?

Take the battery out and get it load tested, the battery may only hold enough energy for a couple of cranks before it dies.