94 Johnson 90hp

[Husker100]

This motor has been rebuilt twice now. No alarms go off and it scores the same cylinder wall.It is the bottom right cylinder? Any suggestions?
When I pulled the head off the cylinder was wet and wasn't real dry as I would suspect if there was an oiling problem.The plugs and pistons don't look like they got hot?

 

[Dennisanoka]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Someone here recently wrote that an extremely high percentage of engine failures can be traced back to carburetion. The next thing you're going to hear is why was it re-built before? If the previous causes were not diagnosed properly history would in time repeat itself. Did you rebuild it? Were the previous causes of failure positively identified?

 

[iwombat]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Dennis is right, that doesn't just happen by itself. Carbs in a 2-stroke deliver both fuel and lubrication.

All that being said, maybe you could include some pictures of the scoring. Could be a bent rod if the scoring is all off to one side. Could also just be coking and a broken ring. All kinds of possibilities here. What all got rebuilt/replaced last time?

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

I did not rebuild this engine.When I bought the boat 2 years ago it had been rebuilt the previous year.The boat ran great for several months and one day cruising across the lake it just died.Like someone pulled the gasline off.
When I restarted it I had no power to plane out.Took it in to get looked at and said it scored a cylinder wall.It was using oil and he said it was from a carb running lean. He then rebuilt it and the carbs.Unfortunately I only got to run the boat for one day before I stored it for winter.I finally got it out on Memorial day and ran it up river several miles checking the temp and making sure the oil res was going down.Started easy and ran great.The 3rd day in Canada I was going across the lake and it died on me again.Restarted and had no power.I then pulled the head off and found the cylinder scored again.There was less than 25 hours on this motor from last rebuild.

 

[iwombat]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Have you notified the mechanic that rebuilt it last time? If it's out of warranty, he might be willing to cut you a good deal anyway. It's worth an attempt at negotiating, 25 hours sure isn't much on a brandy-new powerhead.

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Yeah,It is out of warranty.He said he would split the cost of 1900 bucks.My thoughts are what is this engine even worth and with price of fuel would it be better to buy a 4 stroke or e-tec?
Would you happen to know how much this motor weighs?

 

[iwombat]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Truth be told, you're not going to save any significant amount of fuel with a four-stroke. Yes, they burn less fuel for the same displacement. However, you'll need a WAY bigger four-stroke to replace that two-stroke. Count on it being gobs heavier too. It's gonna be about a wash unless you spend a lot of time trolling or just idling around.

Half of $1900 sounds like a hell of a bargain over a new motor. See if you can talk him into a longer warranty this time seeing as it's your second rebuild. Or at least some kind of schedule you'll cover 1/4 the first year out of warranty, 1/2 the second or something IF he does the winterizing. There's lots of ways to negotiate this. And if he stands behind his work, he's probably almost as bummed out as you over the whole affair.

However, if he doesn't want to make you a happy customer, another motor might just be the way to go.

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

I'm still kicking it around.Hate to spend the money on a new motor but have 0 confidence in this motor. I may wait till winter and see what kind of bargains are out there or have it fixed..Thanks alot for your help and ideas on this subject...Sean

 

[iwombat]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

Let your mechanic know your concerns, there's gotta be a deal in there that both parties are happy with. Can he guarantee it for three seasons if he does the winterizing and scheduled maintenance every 100 hours (just to pick a number)? Sure worth talking about. He knows he owes you a favor, play it out.
You save serious $$ on a new motor, he gets some easy maintenance work. From the sound of it, you don't rack up a pile of hours on your boat. Maybe winterizing IS every 100 hours.

I'm just tossing out what I'd be talking about in short order.

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

You are right.Not alot of hours on the boat.I would rather be fishing than burning gas..lol.

I will take all this into consideration and hope he sees it the same way I do.Again, thank you for your help.

 

[Dennisanoka]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

To me, I'd have to have confidence in the person doing the work and also that he is able to identify why it happened with a certainity, if that's possible. If I got that far in the mental process then my pocket book would begin to make the decision. Do I have the $$$ for a new 90hp or do I pay the $900. I absolutely agree with Iwombat $900 is a very good deal. I put $1000 in mine last summer parts alone which included 2 cylinders and all the other bearings, seals and what have you. So if he does a nice job he's not making much on the deal. What's it worth fixed? What's it worth not fixed? I'm in Minnesota and at a dealer that engine re-built would be listed for between $2200- $3000. So as Iwombat says if he is willing to stand behind his work I'd be looking at the $900 pretty seriously.
If mine were to blow up tomorrow I'd be re-buiding it and it'san 88 90hp. I hope you can work this out with him.

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

I did some checking on this motors value if I were to trade it in and NADA says it is worth 1000 bucks.
now the place I had this done at doesnt deal in new motors.So I have two options to think about rebuilding it or it did find a nice deal on a 06 merc 115 4 stroke for 8k installed.that is with tax,prop and rigging,
Maybe the dealer would buy my other motor for parts or something?

 

[Dennisanoka]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

The values in NADA are way way way too low. Don't go by NADA. If you don't believe me call around for a used motor. You will not find your motor in decent condition for less than $2000 and I'd say at least even $500 more than that. I havn't seen your motor but unless it looks like it been run into the ground so to speak, it has decent value to a do-it-yourselfer even the way it is right now. If your motor were in working condition I'd buy it in a heart beat for $1000. As it sits right now the mechanic who did the original work is the only one who knows it's real value because he did the work. Not to get too long winded but there are re-build jobs and there are rebuild jobs and there can be night and day differences. Did he do just enough or did he really go through the engine. When I rebuilt mine I could have put $400 into it and been back on the water, but I put $1000 into it and plan to have it for a long time.

 

[Husker100]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

I'm trying to make sense of its worth and appreciate your time and reasoning.I want to cover all the angles before I decide which route to take.Thank you Dennis and others for bringing up some great points.

 

[reeldutch]

Re: 94 Johnson 90hp

if you like turning wrenches as most of us do on this site it would not be a difficult choise.

if you dont like to get your hands dirty and want to be fishing or cruising and have peace of mind with a 6 year waranty i would buy a brand new suzuki df150 fourstroke.
only $13.000

jeah i could rebuild my evi 150 60* 2stroke about 6 to 7 times for that money.
and if i do it once do it right i would have about 13000 - 2000(rebuild) 11000 dollars left to burn oil and gas.
so whats more efficient??