I have returned... with a Starcraft this time!

[BWR1953]

Rain, rain, rain... but we got some work done today indoors! Glued, taped, wrapped, stacked, numbered and ready to go in the boat. Just waiting for some sunshine here.

 

[classiccat]

Holy Smokes that is one awesome foam job! Great forward thinking! ...and good thing that you used clear bags...in the event that ATF or boarder control seizes your boat :lol:

As someone who as experienced first hand the aftermath of someone trying to adhere something to the hull skin, I recommend not attempting to glue something sub deck. You are dealing with non-absorbant materials...that factory foam is open cell. As agua stated above, it will trap water. Fasten the deck properly and you won't have to worry about watching your hard work float away as you sink :lol:

 

[BWR1953]

Got 15 minutes of work done this morning. Thirteen of which were in sunshine and 1 minute of sprinkles while I quickly snapped pix and then a minute later the real rain started. Argghh! :yell:

We did pull out 4 more bays of previously cut foam to glue together, etc. and will assemble those today. We also placed the finished blocks we'd completed yesterday into their respective places. Had hoped to measure bays 14 and 15 so that we could make new master templates but the rain ended that for now.

 

[BWR1953]

Holy Smokes that is one awesome foam job! Great forward thinking! ...and good thing that you used clear bags...in the event that ATF or boarder control seizes your boat :lol:

As someone who as experienced first hand the aftermath of someone trying to adhere something to the hull skin, I recommend not attempting to glue something sub deck. You are dealing with non-absorbant materials...that factory foam is open cell. As agua stated above, it will trap water. Fasten the deck properly and you won't have to worry about watching your hard work float away as you sink :lol:

Yeah, I was thinking about those clear bags for that same reason! LOL! :lol:

You're absolutely right that the old white factory open cell foam was nasty. But it's long gone and the pink insulation foam is the good stuff! The foam wedges are glued into blocks and then wrapped with aluminum foil duct tape. That tape is what will be glued to the hull skin. Aluminum to aluminum should work, right?

 

[classiccat]

the problem with trying to glue anything to aluminum is that it adheres poorly, allows moisture to seep under it possibly forming mini electrochemical cells since the water cannot escape...you may end up with worm holes. (ask me how I know :facepalm Thats all we are trying to say...not so much a galvanic potential thing.

 

[BWR1953]

the problem with trying to glue anything to aluminum is that it adheres poorly, allows moisture to seep under it possibly forming mini electrochemical cells since the water cannot escape...you may end up with worm holes. (ask me how I know :facepalm Thats all we are trying to say...not so much a galvanic potential thing.

Got it.

Hmmm... when I cut the foam wedges I made sure that there was clearance from the top of the foam to the underside of the deck. I've read on here where guys had foam in contact with the underside of their decks and had squeaking noises as a result. I was trying to avoid that situation. If I don't glue the blocks down, they'll be bouncing around under the deck. At least in some places.

What to do, what to do? :noidea:

 

[classiccat]

Got it.

Hmmm... when I cut the foam wedges I made sure that there was clearance from the top of the foam to the underside of the deck. I've read on here where guys had foam in contact with the underside of their decks and had squeaking noises as a result. I was trying to avoid that situation. If I don't glue the blocks down, they'll be bouncing around under the deck. At least in some places.

What to do, what to do? :noidea:

how about some hold-down brackets attached to the stringers? they can be simple pieces of angle or even some bent aluminum flashing.

 

[BWR1953]

Day 19 of rain... :yell:

 

[thinepa]

I was browsing through your post and am looking to see what kind of foam you're using? It looks like a polystyrene, but wanted to be sure. Thanks!

 

[BWR1953]

I was browsing through your post and am looking to see what kind of foam you're using? It looks like a polystyrene, but wanted to be sure. Thanks!

This is the stuff I used, purchased from my local big box HD store.



[h=2]Owens Corning[/h]
[h=1]FOAMULAR 3/4 in. x 4 ft. x 8 ft. R-4 Tongue and Groove Insulating Sheathing[/h]

 

[BWR1953]

The sun came out for a short while before sunset so we went out and did a quick check fit of the forward most foam pieces. Not perfect but close enough. That far forward the hull shape changes dramatically so each individual foam wedge had to be shaped accordingly. They're all done now and being glued and taped into blocks as I type!

 

[Decker83]

Your doing a fantastic job on the foam..

 

[Watermann]

Got it.

Hmmm... when I cut the foam wedges I made sure that there was clearance from the top of the foam to the underside of the deck. I've read on here where guys had foam in contact with the underside of their decks and had squeaking noises as a result. I was trying to avoid that situation. If I don't glue the blocks down, they'll be bouncing around under the deck. At least in some places.

What to do, what to do? :noidea:

Those big foam blocks won't bounce around under the deck and if it was rough enough to cause that to happen you wouldn't ever know it over the outboard, waves, wind and inevitable jarring sound a boat makes when it crashes down in heavy waves. Not too mention the shrieking of the admiral telling you to slow down and lets go back.

 

[BWR1953]

Flotation foam under deck is almost done! Just have to measure, cut, shape, stack, glue and tape the wedges for the most forward part of the bow.

 

[BWR1953]

Under deck foam for this boat is just a bit over 9 cubic feet, displacing over 550 lbs. of water if swamped.

Still haven't done anything about securing the foam into place. All blocks need to be scooched to the outer edges and held in place there in order to keep the center channel clear. But boy are we getting fired up now! :joyous:

 

[gberl001]

Flotation foam under deck is almost done! Just have to measure, cut, shape, stack, glue and tape the wedges for the most forward part of the bow.

I'm jealous, I'm going to replace the crappy foam job from the previous owner and follow your process. Not sure if I'm concerned enough to go for the HDPE bags but in any case, I definitely like the look of how this is coming along. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Mark_VTfisherman]

Nice work.
Question for you: is 550# of flotation enough to /not/ let the boat sink if swamped? I know you subtract the 'weight' of the assembly in air but with the motor and such won't that 16 still have negative buoyancy in the water? Not beating you up but wondering if I am missing something.

FWIW I have a friend who sunk a smaller boat with about 12 cubic feet of foam a couple years back; a wake swamped him and then the boat just settled into the depths and was not recovered. Then I remember the Dave Mull experience in a brand new manufacturer's test boat that you'd think wouldn't sink, but a tall follower swamped that one miles from anything on I think Lake Michigan. It too wound up on the bottom but was recovered.

Since I have two boats I am renewing right now, as a result of those two stories this question was on my mind as I watch your build.

 

[MNhunter1]

Nice work.
Question for you: is 550# of flotation enough to /not/ let the boat sink if swamped? I know you subtract the 'weight' of the assembly in air but with the motor and such won't that 16 still have negative buoyancy in the water? Not beating you up but wondering if I am missing something.

FWIW I have a friend who sunk a smaller boat with about 12 cubic feet of foam a couple years back; a wake swamped him and then the boat just settled into the depths and was not recovered. Then I remember the Dave Mull experience in a brand new manufacturer's test boat that you'd think wouldn't sink, but a tall follower swamped that one miles from anything on I think Lake Michigan. It too wound up on the bottom but was recovered.

Since I have two boats I am renewing right now, as a result of those two stories this question was on my mind as I watch your build.

What doesn't stop it, should at least slow it up... Practice due diligence and keep your PFD's handy. It's hard to calculate the power of Mother Nature.

 

[BWR1953]

...Not too mention the shrieking of the admiral telling you to slow down and lets go back.

My wife really liked this part! :lol:

 

[BWR1953]

Your doing a fantastic job on the foam..

Thanks! Been loads of work but I think well worth it in the long run.

I'm jealous, I'm going to replace the crappy foam job from the previous owner and follow your process. Not sure if I'm concerned enough to go for the HDPE bags but in any case, I definitely like the look of how this is coming along. Thanks for sharing.

Yeahh... the HDPE to protect the foam from gasoline is based on an experience I had about 20 years ago. It was my fault for being distracted while fueling but I ended up with a deck covered in about 1/2 inch of gas. But totally worth it!

I'm a retired engineer, so I got kind of obsessive about this foam job for some reason. :tongue-new:

Nice work.
Question for you: is 550# of flotation enough to /not/ let the boat sink if swamped? I know you subtract the 'weight' of the assembly in air but with the motor and such won't that 16 still have negative buoyancy in the water? Not beating you up but wondering if I am missing something.

FWIW I have a friend who sunk a smaller boat with about 12 cubic feet of foam a couple years back; a wake swamped him and then the boat just settled into the depths and was not recovered. Then I remember the Dave Mull experience in a brand new manufacturer's test boat that you'd think wouldn't sink, but a tall follower swamped that one miles from anything on I think Lake Michigan. It too wound up on the bottom but was recovered.

Since I have two boats I am renewing right now, as a result of those two stories this question was on my mind as I watch your build.

But I ain't done yet! :laugh:

What you're missing is that earlier in the thread I mentioned that I'll also be adding front and side panels with flotation behind them, replacing the missing stern bench which will also be filled with foam and that I'll probably modify that stern bench from just straight across into an "H" pattern with still more foam filling. Not to mention the pool noodles that will go into the gunwales. There's going to be a LOT more foam put in place by the time I'm finished.

If I recall correctly, I think I came up with something like 1200-1400 lbs. of flotation when it's all done. My goal is to achieve upright and level flotation. Dunno if I'll get there, but I'm taking a shot at it anyway. Might even test for it too by sinking the boat! Although my wife isn't in favor of that systems test. :lol:

Concept pic below.