Did I get ripped off? I'm thinking so!

[Chad Flaugher]

Last night, I bought a Grand Voyager minivan, for a reasonable price. The gentleman I bought it from seemed honest, and lacking in mechanical knowledge. I looked the van over, drove it, and looked it over again. My father in law was with me as well (old school mechanic) and we scanned it for codes... nothing. Seemed like a very good buy. 110,000 miles, $2,500. Its a 2003, with the 3.3L engine.

I started it just now, and it's smoking like crazy! Smells like its burning oil BAD! What would cause it to smoke today and not yesterday? Oil level is right at full. No way this thing will pass emissions... Any Ideas that don't involve an engine overhaul?

 

[64osby]

Was it warmed up when you made it to the buyers house?

 

[Chad Flaugher]

Was it warmed up when you made it to the buyers house?

I wish I would have thought to check... I am thinking it must have been though, here's why...

UPDATE: So I took it out in the country and ran the **** out of it... Completely stopped smoking. Valve guides?

 

[GA_Boater]

You sure it was smoking? Maybe cold and just a lot of vapor from the tailpipe.

 

[Chad Flaugher]

You sure it was smoking? Maybe cold and just a lot of vapor from the tailpipe.

Positive. Fogged the whole street when I reved the engine. Smelled like burning oil. I'm pretty sure it's hardened valve guides leaking oil into the cylinders while it sits... When first started, the oil burns off over a period of 5 minutes or so. Then it clears up and runs clean. If it were rings, it would burn oil consistently. Some GM engines had that problem a while ago.

I'm wondering if it will run clean enough to pass emissions? I'd sure like to buy some time and wait for warmer weather! Any other thoughts are VERY welcome!

 

[Volphin]

First, check your PCV valve, and scan for codes again. PCV is not very hard to change.
If it still persists, check the valve seals. I've seen some prematurely harden from the additives in "high mileage" motor oil.
If you pop up an injector code, you may have a damaged injector harness.

 

[Chad Flaugher]

PCV valve seems to be fine. I'm going to start it up tomorrow afternoon as a retest. No engine light has come on that I've seen, but I'll check for codes again after I start it tomorrow. Thanks for the help!

 

[NYBo]

Change the PCV valve anyway, and use a genuine Mopar part if you can find one. Also be sure the PCV and breather hoses are unobstructed and not collapsing.

 

[GA_Boater]

2003 is OBD II. Take it to Autozone or one of the other majors and have them hook up a scanner and do the emission check. If it comes up clear, you should pass emissions. According to aircarecolorado,com the test is plugging in to the OBD poet and looking for codes. And checking the gas cap for sealing.

Sounds just like our test. If the check engine light is off, chances are good you will pass.

I would chance the PCV, it's cheap.

 

[Chad Flaugher]

I'll take any advise I can get! I'll pick up a OEM Mopar PCV valve and replace it. Thank you very much. I'll post results of the retest tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Grub54891]

Make sure there is a bulb In the check engine socket!

 

[64osby]

Make sure there is a working bulb In the check engine socket!

Fixed it.

 

[gm280]

Usually with worn or hardened valve seals, it will smoke every time you pull off from a red light or a stop sign if sitting for any length of time. The fact that you stated that it seemed to burn off after about five minutes really doesn't sound like valve seals to me. Check the compression. If it is worn and posts low readings, check it both cold and hot. JMHO

 

[Chad Flaugher]

The bulb is working in the check engine light, good thinking though!

Usually with worn or hardened valve seals, it will smoke every time you pull off from a red light or a stop sign if sitting for any length of time. The fact that you stated that it seemed to burn off after about five minutes really doesn't sound like valve seals to me. Check the compression. If it is worn and posts low readings, check it both cold and hot. JMHO

Started it again today with the exact same results. Heavy blue smoke for a few minutes, then it cleans right up. Nothing seems to make it smoke other than sitting for a length of time. I don't have plates on it yet, so my ability to test it real good is limited. What should the compression readings be? The van runs very strong. Has more power than the van we are replacing with the same motor.

 

[gm280]

Chad, sounds more like oil is settling in one or more cylinders and when you start it up, the blue smoke begins until it burns it off. It still can have bad valve seals, but usually bad valve seal will smoke every time you idle for a bit and then take off again. So do the compression test and post the readings. If there are any that are not close to all the others, you have a problem. And I have no expected numbers other then probably be in the 110 or better range would be okay. I've read numbers in the 170 to 190 range before. But usually when the readings are around 100 or lower, there is problems. JMHO!

 

[boatman37]

may want to try a leakdown test. that can tell you where it is leaking from

 

[Stumpalump]

I wish I would have thought to check... I am thinking it must have been though, here's why...

UPDATE: So I took it out in the country and ran the **** out of it... Completely stopped smoking. Valve guides?

Only if the problem comes back. Could have been a stuck ring from sitting. Change the oil and sea foam the fuel tank. I get minivans as company cars and had an 03. Free car, free maintnence and I'm free to wind them out and jump them. You can't hurt a Dodge Caravan. I've been trying since 89.

 

[WIMUSKY]

Chad, sounds more like oil is settling in one or more cylinders and when you start it up, the blue smoke begins until it burns it off. It still can have bad valve seals, but usually bad valve seal will smoke every time you idle for a bit and then take off again. So do the compression test and post the readings. If there are any that are not close to all the others, you have a problem. And I have no expected numbers other then probably be in the 110 or better range would be okay. I've read numbers in the 170 to 190 range before. But usually when the readings are around 100 or lower, there is problems. JMHO!

I agree with gm. You may have oil leaking down. Usually if it's bad valve seals, it will smoke on start up and leaving a stop light. Biggest thing about compression check is you want all the cylinders to read the same, +/- around 10%. If you have a cylinder that reads a lot lower you found the issue. I have and SBC that reads from 185 - 200psi. I would think you should be around the mid 100s. Also, a bad intake gasket can cause you to burn oil. What happens is the bad gasket creates a vacuum effect and the intake valve sucks up oil into a cylinder....

I don't like the previous owner "lacked mechanical knowledge" I wonder how well, or poorly, it was maintained..... He knew it would smoke so bad that it would kill every mosquito in the county when first started that he made sure it was warmed up before you saw it......

 

[Grub54891]

Had a similar thin​g one time. The brother in laws car was sitting in my yard, would run crappy till warmed up well,I wanted to rebuild the carb but he said no. One day he calls and says, start up the car and warm it up, it needs to be run once and awhile, so I did. Warmed it up good, and shut it down, About 10 min later, he shows up with some guy, starts it and it ran good. Sold it on the spot. Sometimes ya gotta wonder.......

 

[Chad Flaugher]

Yeah, people can really be ridiculous. Too bad that's the world we live in!