04 Bayliner 185 108 OR 99 Four Winns 200?wn

Luke81

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Thanks for all the opinions and thoughts over on my newb boater thread, some of the things in there really made me take a harder look at what I'm buying here and spend a little more for something much nicer. I appreciate the help! So I believe I've narrowed it down to these two bowriders that are sitting next to each other at a local dealer. 2004 Bayliner 18' w/ 3.0 or a 1999 Four Winns 20' w/ Volvo 5.0. The Bayliner is listed at $500 more but he indicated there was room to move, so I'd say the pricing is close enough that's not a factor either way. Both have some pro's and cons to me. The Bayliner is obviously 5 years newer and appears very well cared for. There are a few small tears in the seams of the seats, thats the only things I can find wrong in the interior. The Four Winns is longer, and with the 5.0 I've got to think it's faster. It also appears well cared for, but its registration expired last year which makes me think it's been sitting a while. The Bayliner is still current on its sticker. The Four Winns has a very extensive high end stereo system (Likely $2500 or more), but I actually own a stereo shop and it's not a brand I sell so I can't really use it as a demo of what we do. The Four Winns gives me that extra two feet, and a tandem trailer with surge brake.
Here's what's really bugging me about the Four Winns: It is UGLY. The interior was recently re-done in this really ugly hunter green color, and boat has an ugly green stripe. It looks like a 1970's couch. The stripe I can cover with a wrap, but the interior is what it is..and it's ungoldy ugly. Also the Four Winns has the Bimini top that meet the top of the windshield instead of the more typical higher one, which I do not like. And it's also green. It feels very enclosed in the cockpit, which I suppose is the point of it but I prefer the open feeling of the higher top. But those are cheap, so that's not a deal breaker there.
I am a little concerned the resale value down the road of the Four Winns is affected by the ugly. I have to admit if everything that is green were blue or gray or something else I might have made an offer on that boat last night. On one hand it's a silly superficial thing, but on the other hand I want to at least like the boat, haha.

Both boats appear to be mechanically and structurally sound, and I took a friend who is much more familiar with boats with me and he agrees with that. We have not water tested yet, but I'd like to schedule that for Friday. Honestly I'd really like to test them both to feel the difference in power but I feel bad asking the guy to take me out on two different boats, both of which are low-priced crafts in the boat world.


If anyone cares to look at them they're here:
http://www.boattrader.com/listing/19...-200-102512828
http://www.boattrader.com/listing/20...ider-102480973

Edit to add: I wish the pic of the Four Winns wasn't in the shade...the stripe is actually almost the exact color of the top and it does have some fading going on toward the back. In the pic it almost looks black.


Thank you guys and gals!
 
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Slip Away

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Just a word of caution. The 99' Four Winns have a VDO automotive style gauge cluster, and they WILL fail. They no longer make those gages.
So if they take a dump on you, you have to get the entire cluster repaired ($500) or buy all new individual gages and fabricate your
own cluster. Sound like fun ?
 

Luke81

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Shoot, other things I should have mentioned: The Bayliner has carpet which appears in very good condition. The Four Winns floor is not carpet, which I kind of like. Except inside the various storage compartments it leaves a very unfinished look with the raw spray. Not a huge deal, just not 100% sure how much difference it makes.
 

Luke81

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Just a word of caution. The 99' Four Winns have a VDO automotive style gauge cluster, and they WILL fail. They no longer make those gages.
So if they take a dump on you, you have to get the entire cluster repaired ($500) or buy all new individual gages and fabricate your
own cluster. Sound like fun ?


Thanks for that info! And I have to say, that cluster looked questionable to me as soon as I saw it. Fabbing up the cluster would be no issue (we do lots of custom fab work at my shop) but not something I want to do right off. Also, I don't know if it's because I'm a bit short (5'9" on a good day) but when sitting in a comfy driving position the wheel totally blocks all of the gauges except the voltmeter.
 
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Slip Away

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The Four Winns H200 all years, has a poor use of available space when comparing to other brands of that size and configuration. I would be very careful if you consider this boat, salty boats of that vintage must be really taken care of over their life, or you will have more fixes down the road than you might want. But price is cheap at least.
 

Brian 26

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Here are my thought, although I apologize for not pointing you to one or the other:

A four winns with v8 is definitely a more desirable boat but since you don't like the color I don't think you should buy it.
In regards to resale: a Bayliner with a 3.0 is has very poor resale
How about freshwater vs saltwater on the two?
 

jkust

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I saw mold in a few of those pics of the Four Winns. I wanted to like the FW but wow it is quite a sight. I hate to say it but I wouldn't be interested in either of those two. The 3.0 is a deal killer on the BL. A 4.3 this many years along in the used market isn't any more money.
 

Luke81

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Here are my thought, although I apologize for not pointing you to one or the other:

A four winns with v8 is definitely a more desirable boat but since you don't like the color I don't think you should buy it.
In regards to resale: a Bayliner with a 3.0 is has very poor resale
How about freshwater vs saltwater on the two?


We live on a little peninsula that sticks into the Gulf of Mexico so I think it's probably fair to assume both boats have seen mostly salt water. The condition of the outdrive on the Bayliner looks like (to my untrained eye) that better care was taken of that boat after getting pulled out of the water though.

I can live with the exterior stripe, or actually I'd have it wrapped over another color...but that interior kills me. I want to get past that, but every time I look at it I just see this ridiculous green and say "EW!"

Resale value is sort of lower importance in this case I guess, being as it's a cheaper boat anyhow. I feel like as long as it's taken care of there is sort of a floor of how low they would go over a few years. I started my search looking for a $5000 boat, and honestly a couple years from now I can't see either of these being in the poor condition of the $5k ones I was looking at.
 
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jkust

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Wow that Cobalt is sun beat. Bummer Cobalt exited the Small Bowrider market so many years ago. They are such nice boats.
 

Luke81

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That's a lot of boat for $10k, plus you get duo prop (a $4k upgrade when new) and an aluminum trailer. However that salesman's definition of "Clean" and mine are very different.


We actually walked around this boat lot on Sunday. I don't think I'm ready to go quite to the $10k mark yet......also, I took a good look at that particular boat and I felt (and again I stress, to my untrained eye so take it for what it's worth) that it was at least visually in lesser condition than I'd like. I REALLY like the interior layout of that boat, the bench seating is really cool. But poking around it gave me the feeling of a boat that sat outside uncovered for 90% of it's life and a boat that maybe hadn't been so carefully maintained. I'm a boat rookie but I've been in the car industry for a long time and I know some of the telltale signs of a less-well-cared for vehicle, and I just got that feeling from this one.
 

southkogs

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I just scanned your other thread and didn't see any suggestion about a dual console:

I've been on a 19' out in the Gulf a few times ... that's about as small as I'd want in most cases, at least in a bow rider. Can ya' find any dual consoles with outboards? (I don't necessarily prefer O/B to I/O, I just like a lot of the dual console builds for big water like the Gulf)
 
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Slip Away

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For under 10K budget, you will have a difficult time finding a boat that is NOT going to be a project.(In Florida)
Expect faded vinyl seats, corrosion in engine compartment, oxidized gel coat, and un maintained engines and drives.
If you want to repair more than use, then proceed on your I/O course. Realistically, I would not even be considering
an I/O powered boat in that price range anywhere in Florida, I would be looking at outboard powered DC boats, but
would raise my budget to over $15K to get something decent.
 

jkust

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Just a suggestion....maybe buy something from a not-salt region and have it shipped back home to you. Similar to how the bodies on southern cars are just so much nicer than here in MN for example...the freshwater engines and engine bays still look like new for decades with very little effort...nothing rusts. I get that boats aren't cars but I've bought several of my cars from down south because they don't rust and just paid a trucker to ship them to my door.
 

southkogs

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Atlanta has a decent market, and wouldn't be a terrible drive for you.
 

Luke81

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Atlanta is roughly 8 hours drive, depending on traffic of course. I'm open to the drive for the right thing. I'll look into the dual console option too.

Slip Away I have to somewhat disagree with that, just because I think we may have a different definition of "something decent". I've got a few serious boater customers who wouldn't be caught dead on anything with a price tag lower than my house, and then others are happy with there basic little boats. I certainly understand what you're saying though, I just don't think it's realistic right now to go that far up with the budget for a "starter" boat.
 

Slip Away

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I have seen and heard most all of it concerning "first boat", "starter boat" Each person is different with regards to their budget, what they like, what they need etc. In the end it is indeed your choice on what you want. I will offer nothing more here, as it is pointless. Finally I will add, an inexpensive, project type boat, often ends up being something you may wish you never bought. But, I guess that is how we learn.
 

southkogs

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... you can find something worthwhile under $10k. May not be a Porsche, but it won't be unusable either.
 

Luke81

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I have seen and heard most all of it concerning "first boat", "starter boat" Each person is different with regards to their budget, what they like, what they need etc. In the end it is indeed your choice on what you want. I will offer nothing more here, as it is pointless. Finally I will add, an inexpensive, project type boat, often ends up being something you may wish you never bought. But, I guess that is how we learn.


I'm not in any way trying to discount your thoughts on the topic, and I appreciate the insight. But the reality is the budget has to stop somewhere, especially while we're still figuring out if we are even really "boat owning people". And in the end if it bites me in the tail, well.....it's still probably not the dumbest thing I've ever purchased! :) :)

I'm going out on the Bayliner 185 Friday to try it out, so we'll see how it goes.
 
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