Friend is looking to buy a PWC?

hostage

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I own a boat and love it, though a friend is looking at buying a PWC and I am trying to help him with it. I spoke to my mechanic and he said that you don't want anything older than 10 years old and he also said Yamahas tend to have less issues than Skidoos. The problem is my friend can only budget about $1,500 for a PWC and trailer. He scheduled to take the boating safety course and getting a hitch installed for his car. He says he doesn't mind doing work like rebuilding the engine himself if he needs to, though my only concern is will their be parts for something that old. In that price range he is looking at late 90's PWCs. Any suggestions?
 

oldjeep

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$1500 for a PWC and trailer will be a money pit. Tell him to either save up or borrow some more money.
 

hostage

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$1500 for a PWC and trailer will be a money pit. Tell him to either save up or borrow some more money.


That is what I am thinking. I think most of us usually spend about double what we initially plan to, when we start looking. From what I have been reading and hearing it seems like Yamaha is the better of the brands and go with a 4 stroke over a 2 stroke.
 

oldjeep

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Don't know about Yamaha, but I'd agree on the 4 stroke. We've got a 2006 Seadoo RXP that has been trouble free, but it cost a lot more than $1500 when we bought it 5 years ago ;)
 

H20Rat

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Look for any of the 787 powered carb'ed seadoo's. They will be close to that price range, and the 787 is both extremely reliable and also extremely cheap to replace if you have to. (gsx non-limited, spx, xp, gtx) The 787 is usually advertised as an 800cc.

Surprisingly, that particular model in mid to late 90's vintage is far more reliable than anything newer, ESPECIALLY if you get into the high horsepower models. Something to be said for simplicity.
 
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JimS123

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I disagree wholeheartedly!!! Any mid to late Seadoo is going to be a moneypit, especially a 787. The 717 might be passable, but only if driven by the proverbial little old lady on Sunday. The same vintage Yamaha MAY still be servicable.

The typical PWC is driven by a novice, run hard and put away wet. Naturally, there are cherries to be found (like mine), but they are few and far away and a good one should not be expected.

$1500 is an unreasonable expectation.

If one must buy an "old" watercraft, any of the early naturally aspirated early 2000 4-strokes would be the best bet. I just sold a 2003 for $3000, and that was right at retail book value.
 

smokeonthewater

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I have had VERY good luck with early 90's yamaha 650's and 701's ..... VERY reliable and parts are cheap and plentiful.

I see them for $1000-$1500 all the time and $500 or less with issues.

I have a nice 94 WR III on a double trailer I priced to a buddy for $1500 and a pair of 95 Kawasaki ZX-900 on a really nice newer double trailer that if I ever get around to selling them I'd price em at $3500 for the set so I don't think a budget of $1500 for a ski is unreasonable BUT there IS a but.....

IF his budget is that tight he likely can't afford the gas for a ski..... $50-$100 a day for gas adds up FAST

The same $1500 spent on a 12-14' tinny and a 7.5-15 hp outboard would be worth considering.

Then it would be $5-$40 a day to run it
 

Brian 26

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What the mechanic means by 10 years old or newer is a 4 stroke. Modern day 4 strokes can go 1000s of hours, which was unheard of in the 90s. $1,500 will not by any four stroke jet ski, you're looking at about $4,000 minimum (prices are regional and I'm assuming he needs a trailer too).

mid to late 90s yamaha 2 stroke jet skis are very reliable (by two stroke standards), the 760 is said to be one of the most reliable two stoke jet ski motors ever made. If you want a jet ski for under $1,500 that you don't have to do anything to and will most likely start every time you put it in the water this is the route to go.

The seadoo 787 motor is IMO one of the best motors ever made and I have two skis with them. They are notorious for problems but if you address the weak spots up front and take care of them they can be very reliable. The biggest weak point is that the original fuel lines will cause the engine to seize (sounds crazy I know). Today's ethanol degrades the line and clogs the carburetor. Those must be changed and carbs cleaned out. Another weak spot on older seadoos is the computer, jump starting or trying to start it with a battery charger will cause the computer to blow and they are not cheap. My mint condition '97 SPX that I love left my son and I stranded in the middle of the lake once when the computer blew for no apparent reason - I'm guessing someone before me jumped the battery.
 

hostage

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What the mechanic means by 10 years old or newer is a 4 stroke. Modern day 4 strokes can go 1000s of hours, which was unheard of in the 90s. $1,500 will not by any four stroke jet ski, you're looking at about $4,000 minimum (prices are regional and I'm assuming he needs a trailer too).

mid to late 90s yamaha 2 stroke jet skis are very reliable (by two stroke standards), the 760 is said to be one of the most reliable two stoke jet ski motors ever made. If you want a jet ski for under $1,500 that you don't have to do anything to and will most likely start every time you put it in the water this is the route to go.

The seadoo 787 motor is IMO one of the best motors ever made and I have two skis with them. They are notorious for problems but if you address the weak spots up front and take care of them they can be very reliable. The biggest weak point is that the original fuel lines will cause the engine to seize (sounds crazy I know). Today's ethanol degrades the line and clogs the carburetor. Those must be changed and carbs cleaned out. Another weak spot on older seadoos is the computer, jump starting or trying to start it with a battery charger will cause the computer to blow and they are not cheap. My mint condition '97 SPX that I love left my son and I stranded in the middle of the lake once when the computer blew for no apparent reason - I'm guessing someone before me jumped the battery.

Thank you for your input, I think you brought up a point that I am now realizing it seems like the power plant is more important than the jetski and mentioning the weakest link. I could only find 4 jetskis in a 100 miles that had 4 strokes and a trailer. They were between $3,500 and $3,800. I saw this one and apparently the 4 stroke is bullet proof: http://buffalo.craigslist.org/boa/5046973776.html

I also hear to avoid the super charged 4 strokes as the SeaDoo's super chargers require frequent rebuilds ~100 hours. So I guess in all naturally aspirated modern 4-strokes are the best. He started talking about spending more, though I am not sure how much he is willing to spend. I think he wants a water craft in general. Though he doesn't mind taking a risk on the ~$1500 range then getting something better further on. Though I hope he doesn't get totally put off by the sport, if he gets a lemon. In any case it seems like the in this price range the PWC, doesn't go down in price, unless it is broken.

I also hear a lot of people convert their jetskis into premix as the pumps can fail as well.

In all here is what I am gathering from my research:

2-Strokes:
Easier to work on
Require more maintenance
Will cost less for each fix, though more in the long run
Louder
Smelly
Waste a lot of unburnt gas and oil, up to 4Gal/hour in tests
Less Reliable
Cheaper up front
More power to weight ratio
Can/Is banned on some water ways

4-Strokes:
Most reliable w/ naturally aspirated
Will cost more when repairs are needed, but less in the long run
Some engines are referred to as bullet proof compared to 2-strokes
Much better on Gas/MPG/MPH
Heavier
More expensive up front.
Will retain higher resale value than 2-strokes
 

H20Rat

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I disagree wholeheartedly!!! Any mid to late Seadoo is going to be a moneypit, especially a 787. The 717 might be passable, but only if driven by the proverbial little old lady on Sunday. The same vintage Yamaha MAY still be servicable.

My luck has been different I guess on those! I've owned 4 different 787 powered seadoos between '95 and '99, and other than the gray tempo fuel line issue and new wear rings, I've done absolutely zero to them. My GSX tended to go through batteries at an alarming rate (every other year like clockwork), mostly because of the digital dash/clock taking power all the time and shortening the life of the battery. I didn't drive them like a grandma but didn't abuse them either, and always made sure the engines had some warm up time before getting on the gas.

My neighbors with newer 4 strokes? They have all made at least one, if not multiple, trips to the dealer for repair.
 
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oldjeep

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I also hear to avoid the super charged 4 strokes as the SeaDoo's super chargers require frequent rebuilds ~100 hours.

Guess I'm a couple rebuilds behind ;)

We change the oil and filter every year, plugs every couple years and that is about it. Has over 200 trouble free hours on it, never required any other service.
 
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hostage

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Guess I'm a couple rebuilds behind ;)

We change the oil and filter every year, plugs every couple years and that is about it. Has over 200 trouble free hours on it, never required any other service.

Well it is from all hear say from looking at forums also two of the 4 strokes I looked at said "needs new super charger" or "super charger replaced last year".
 

oldjeep

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Well it is from all hear say from looking at forums also two of the 4 strokes I looked at said "needs new super charger" or "super charger replaced last year".

Not too many folks post up - hey nothing happened with my PWC this year ;) And since the mid 2000's supercharged Seadoos are still pretty much the fastest thing you can buy then there are not a lot of folks upgrading perfectly good PWC's
 

oldjeep

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I should say that I'm not necessarily saying he should look for a supercharged seadoo. They go 71MPH or so and not everyone should have access to that kind of speed - great way to kill yourself.
 

H20Rat

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Not too many folks post up - hey nothing happened with my PWC this year ;) And since the mid 2000's supercharged Seadoos are still pretty much the fastest thing you can buy then there are not a lot of folks upgrading perfectly good PWC's

Some of the neighbors I mentioned above had one of the seadoo supercharged boats. That thing was impressive... An impressive money pit. Over a couple years of ownership, it cost them far more than the value of the boat itself in engine repairs. I suspect they sank it and collected insurance, can't be sure on that though.
 

hostage

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Not too many folks post up - hey nothing happened with my PWC this year ;)

True, though when I was looking at some reviews on the MR-1 people were trying to recall the one person on the yamaha forum who had problems with his MR1. They all said they were reliable. Also another forum said natural aspirated were more reliable 0_o.

On a totally different note I just noticed the no frills SeaDoo Spark is 4 stroke for $5k brand new. I haven't seen anyone complain about it yet...
 

thumpar

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I was reading and another thread and many recommended the Kawaski 750 ss, any input on that. He is looking at this one:
http://rochester.craigslist.org/boa/5062382416.html

I think it is a Yamaha 500, might be a small side?
I had a Kawi 750ss/xi. I bought it for $1100 with trailer. I did a little work to it like removing the oil pump and ran premix. I never had a problem with it. I sold it a few years back for $1250. Those are great skis. They say 2 seater but unless you are moving or both people know what they are doing you will tip. They are fun and about as close as you can get to a standup with a real seat.
 

JimS123

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On a totally different note I just noticed the no frills SeaDoo Spark is 4 stroke for $5k brand new. I haven't seen anyone complain about it yet...

I have seen very few of them actually on the water. I have seen more of them on land for sale.

We saw them at the boat show when they first came out. My wife said "OMG they look like a plastic Fisher-Price Toy". I guess I had to agree with her.
 
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