Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

[spikeitaudi]

I have heard alot of discussions about bayliner has bad floors due to rotting what not. Being a new owner I was alittle worried but after reading the Warranty in detail again this put my mind to ease:

LIMITED Lifetime Structural Hull Warranty to Orginal Owner:

Bayliner will repair or replace, at its sole discretion, any Structural Hull Defect, as defined below, which is reported during the period of ownership of the original retail owner. For purposed of this limited warranty: 1) The "HULL" shall mean the single fiberflass molded shell and integral structure within that shell, incliding stringers, floorboards and related structural reinforcements, all of which are below the hull flange; and 2) a "Structural Hull Defect" shall mean a substantial defect in materials or workmanship in the Boat's Hull which causes the Boat to be unfit or unsafe for general use as a pleasure craft under normal operating conditions.

If sold to another owner the second owner gets Ten years of the above warranty from the retail purchase of the boat.

Sounds like they are doing the right thing by backing up their reputation in the warranty now.

This might not help you older owners with the older models but at least the newer ones are trying to dispell the Bayliner reputation.

Not trying to defend the brand here but more educating new boater that are thinking of going new. Sure I like the searays and cobalts better but they are to expensive for me at least. Sumation: Look at the warranties in depth for each boat manufacture for that particular boat. This warranty is specific to my 2010 185 Bowrider. Same manufacturer has different warranty for their other lines.

 

[The Famous Grouse]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Most people understand that Bayliner has dramatically upped its game in terms of quality.

The reason why Bayliner's reputation continues to be dogged by the quality and build issues from the 1990s is simply that so many new boaters come to boating via the used boat market. So therefore it still is relevant to discuss the common failure points and structural issues that can occur on Bayliners of that vintage. Everyone gets the fact that many of these issues come about because of owner neglect, bad storage, and maintaince practices, but they ARE still issues and it's not unfair to point out that not all boats suffer from the same failure points, specifically around the use of wood in hulls and decks.

I understand you Bayliner owners don't like to see the reputations of your boats being called into question, but you have to accept the there were significant issues in the past. While I'm sure it hurts your sense of ownership pride, you need to understand that people are not bashing your boat.

For the most part, they're just trying to help those considering purchasing a used boat and it would be doing them a diservice because today's warranty doesn't apply to boats made in the 1990s.

Grouse

 

[oldjeep]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Just be aware that letting your boat fill up with water or snow is not a structural issue. An awfull lot of rot issues come from people who don't properly care for their boat. The 80 something Bayliner 195 I had, had a rotted rear floor section and rotted seats which were obviously due to owner neglect (lots of rotten leaves in the boat and the carpet was all moldy)

The only complaint I have about my 2005 Bayliner Classic is that it has the same issue with the diagonal carpet seams back by the jump seats that they have had since the beginning of time. The carpet shrinks and the seam exposes some wood. I still can't believe that someone is not selling some sort of vinyl corner protector specifically for that location.

 

[Pez Vela]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Not trying to defend the brand here but ...

Sure sounds like it. You've defended the warranty, but you'll have to rely on your personal experiences with the boat to defend the boat's construction. If the boat stands up to your intended use and you never have a warranty issue, you will have made your point, and the warranty itself (good, bad or indifferent) just won't matter. You should be more interested in your boat's construction specifications than its warranty. That holds true for any boat, not just a Bayliner.

 

[Beefer]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

This is not a Bayliner bashing post, it's a general warranty bashing post.

Structural defect(s) won't cover much. It won't cover rot damage (unless that is secondary caused by a structural failure). If your floor rots out from under you in 5 years, it won't be covered. Oldjeep's issue with the carpet is not a structural problem, but could lead to a rot problem. If it does, I'm guessing Bayliner will explain how a) it is not a structural problem, and a problem with the carpet and b) had he better maintained the boat (and carpet) it wouldn't have happened. (Not saying you don't maintain your boat oldjeep.) I look at a warranty that warrants against materials and workmanship much like I do the 100,000 mile drivetrain limited warranty by the automakers. It's there, but who has ever used it, or how many have been honored?

My $0.02

 

[Pez Vela]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

This is not a Bayliner bashing post, it's a general warranty bashing post. It's there, but who has ever used it, or how many have been honored?

My $0.02

Make that $0.04. Better to have a good boat with a sketchy warranty than a good warranty with a sketchy boat.

 

[edwardh1]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Even more off topic- we had a 1999 1850 Bay and loved it but it was stored in a garage so no rot anywhere. Hull was plenty tuff for the harbor, never went offshore.

I would buy the new Bayliner 2010 180 OBoard but you can get only the merc engine and here (Charleston SC) the Yamaha / Merc outboard ratio is about 10 to 1. Or maybe higher.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

This is not a Bayliner bashing post, it's a general warranty bashing post.

Structural defect(s) won't cover much. It won't cover rot damage (unless that is secondary caused by a structural failure). If your floor rots out from under you in 5 years, it won't be covered. Oldjeep's issue with the carpet is not a structural problem, but could lead to a rot problem. If it does, I'm guessing Bayliner will explain how a) it is not a structural problem, and a problem with the carpet and b) had he better maintained the boat (and carpet) it wouldn't have happened. (Not saying you don't maintain your boat oldjeep.) I look at a warranty that warrants against materials and workmanship much like I do the 100,000 mile drivetrain limited warranty by the automakers. It's there, but who has ever used it, or how many have been honored?

My $0.02

I don't for the life of me know why people have such a hard time reading warrenty clauses. Pretty simple English. You hit the rest on the head.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Just be aware that letting your boat fill up with water or snow is not a structural issue. An awfull lot of rot issues come from people who don't properly care for their boat. The 80 something Bayliner 195 I had, had a rotted rear floor section and rotted seats which were obviously due to owner neglect (lots of rotten leaves in the boat and the carpet was all moldy)

The only complaint I have about my 2005 Bayliner Classic is that it has the same issue with the diagonal carpet seams back by the jump seats that they have had since the beginning of time. The carpet shrinks and the seam exposes some wood. I still can't believe that someone is not selling some sort of vinyl corner protector specifically for that location.

Rotting floor and stringers is not a care issue. The only one neglecting anything is the builder who built a boat and didn't bother to fully encapsulate the floor and stringers in fiberglass to save a couple of bucks. Had they done so, you could have used the boat as a swimming pool and still not had a rot problem.

 

[spikeitaudi]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Man it's a tuff crowd here. But its all good.

Again I just posted for informational purposes for any new potential owners. But I agree in general that good maintanance is the key. I have already started that practice in my short time of ownership of my boat. Regardless of brand or whatever you have or condition the key here is we all enjoy being out in the water in our boats with family and friends. Heck I am sure alot here even like having to do maintenance or tinkering with our boat. I think that part of the fun.

 

[spikeitaudi]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Make that $0.04. Better to have a good boat with a sketchy warranty than a good warranty with a sketchy boat.

No. Its better to have a good boat with a good warranty.

 

[spikeitaudi]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Just be aware that letting your boat fill up with water or snow is not a structural issue. An awfull lot of rot issues come from people who don't properly care for their boat.

Totally agree, that is more like stupidity at it worst.

 

[jeeperman]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Rotting floor and stringers is not a care issue. The only one neglecting anything is the builder who built a boat and didn't bother to fully encapsulate the floor and stringers in fiberglass to save a couple of bucks. Had they done so, you could have used the boat as a swimming pool and still not had a rot problem.

That would be a design issue.
I do not see the term design mentioned in the warranty.
The best materials and workmanship ain't worth squat when the resulting problems are from faulty design.
Which is not covered by the warranty.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

This is not a Bayliner bashing post, it's a general warranty bashing post.

Structural defect(s) won't cover much. It won't cover rot damage (unless that is secondary caused by a structural failure). If your floor rots out from under you in 5 years, it won't be covered. Oldjeep's issue with the carpet is not a structural problem, but could lead to a rot problem. If it does, I'm guessing Bayliner will explain how a) it is not a structural problem, and a problem with the carpet and b) had he better maintained the boat (and carpet) it wouldn't have happened. (Not saying you don't maintain your boat oldjeep.) I look at a warranty that warrants against materials and workmanship much like I do the 100,000 mile drivetrain limited warranty by the automakers. It's there, but who has ever used it, or how many have been honored?

My $0.02

I hate warranties as well. Your comments on structural defects is probably right on. I can't comment on Bayliner's wearranty, but I CAN comment on some others.

I own a 2009 aluminum Starcraft. It has a PT wood floor, covered in vinyl, and riveted to aluminum ribs / stringers. The warranty on the vinyl is 5 years, but it has a lifetime warranty that covers leakage of the double riveted main seams, plus any rot or warpage of the wood floor.
The verbiage looks good to me. It tells you how to notify them of a claim, and naturally excludes repairs needed because of something like a car accident, but it does not specifically say you have to keep the boat dry!

My son had his transmission go out on a 5 year old Dodge Ram with 60K miles on it and it was replaced free of charge, not a penny out of pocket, plus he got a free coutesy car for the day it was in the shop. That's the only one I ever heard of making a claim. I had a friend have a claim denied on his Chevy engine, but that was a justified denial in my opinion because he drove it over a concrete post and the damage to the engine was his own fault.

 

[mtrainTurbo]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Rotting floor and stringers is not a care issue. The only one neglecting anything is the builder who built a boat and didn't bother to fully encapsulate the floor and stringers in fiberglass to save a couple of bucks. Had they done so, you could have used the boat as a swimming pool and still not had a rot problem.

I have it on good authority (my step father used to sell both Bayliner and Grady White - owned Clayton Marina, Clayton NY) that they replaced more stringers and transoms in Gradys than they ever did in Bayliners.

The only reason Bayliners rot is because their owners allow them to. I had a 1986 Bayliner 2450 Ciera bowrider, and a good SUnbrella mooring cover. I never had a rot issue, and the floor and upholstery was original and in great shape at 22 years old.

And unfortunately, Bayliner attracts the entry level boater who doesn't know any better, so new and used, the boats live a tough life.

I got lucky on my Ciera, but then again, I was looking for 3 years to find the right one.

 

[Subliminal]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Bayliner, Searay...whatever. They probably just roll 18 footers off the assembly line at Brunswick and this one gets a Searay sticker and that one gets a Bayliner sticker. This one gets SS pop-up cleats and that one gets the standard issue.

Is that a Ford Escape? No, silly...it's a Mercury Mariner...much better.

 

[cwhite6]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Does Bayliner still use wood in it's floors or stringers? We are looking at buying a BR in the next year or so and I am not buying anything with a wood floor or stringers. We are also looking no older than 5 years.

 

[spikeitaudi]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Does Bayliner still use wood in it's floors or stringers? We are looking at buying a BR in the next year or so and I am not buying anything with a wood floor or stringers. We are also looking no older than 5 years.

Yes, but you do also have the option of a fiberglass floor with snap in carpet. About an additional 1500 option or so at least on the 185.

 

[mtrainTurbo]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

Yes, but you do also have the option of a fiberglass floor with snap in carpet. About an additional 1500 option or so at least on the 185.

...and most likely, special order only. Same with the 4.3 MPI. Find one with both, and not only are you looking at a spec that has production numbers you can count on one hand, but you're looking at a $30,000 Bayliner 185.

If you want no-wood, you are looking at Cobalt, Bryant, and maybe one or two others, and again, you're going to pay dearly for the privelege.

Wood construction is not an issue if you care for the boat like the $25,000 purchase it is. Put a good cover on it, wash and wax it, maintain it properly, and in general don't treat it like a commode. There's plenty of Bayliners and Sea Rays out there in superb condition that are 20 years old, back when construction techniques were REALLY dreadful.

My Ciera had embarassing quality and fit and finish gaffes. I'd still take it out on Lake Michigan in 3 footers, though.

 

[MacPointMan]

Re: Bayliner Warranty on new boats for Hull and floorboards.

spikeitaudi: First of all I hope you are enjoying your new brand new Bayliner (It seems as if you are very much) as much as I am enjoying my 1988 Invader.

Thank you for posting this. This confirms what I have been told and read about. Makes me feel much better about looking at and buying a new or used Bayliner in the future and gives the new Bayliner owner and dealer ammo for the brand bashers out there.

I very nearly bought a 2010 Bayliner 175. My wife and I really liked it and the price was right for a new boat with a payment. The Bayliner 195 with the Mercruiser 4.3 was a close second and a Regal 1900 came in a distant 3rd (Wow is that a nice boat the price reflected that fact as well).

I shopped new to start with to see what was out there. I looked at Loads of great boats. Regals, Carvalles, Cobalts all expensive but nice. I asked the salesmen (non Bayliner) about Bayliners and talk about bad mouthing a brand.

Then I went to the Bayliner dealership I talked at length with the salesman and compared features and fit and finish. No, the Bayliners did not have the extra features that the much more expensive boats had. The thing that struck me was how solid the new Bayliner was, it was right up there with the rest.

After some discussion with the salesman he was quite taken aback when I told him about what the other dealers were saying about his brand. he showed me that the Bayliner hulls are built right next to and in the same factory with the Sea Rays. Hull construction is the same specs. He in fact said that when it comes to construction he would put any new Bayliner up against any other brand. Then he asked me what other brand is going to offer you a Lifetime warranty on the Hull construction of the boat? Not many. He stated that Bayliner now uses composite materials and fully encapsulated / fiberglassed marine plywood in the construction of their boats.

Bayliner is most certainly addressing the issues of the past and making an attempt of ridding itself of the substandard boat manufacturer reputation it has.

I have been around Bayliners my whole life. All of which have been very well maintained and cared for. Thus I never saw a bad or rotting Bayliner until I went boat shopping. I was never aware of the Bad reputation of the brand and everyone that I know that has owned one has been happy with theirs.

Construction, warranty, and reputation aside a boat is only as goods as its owner. A ChrisCraft, Cobalt, Crownline, Regal, Carvalle, Mastercraft will all rot and fall apart just like any affordable Bayliner if not properly maintained and cared for.

Are these boats built better than a new Bayliner? Maybe. Have they been built better than Bayliners of the past? Without a doubt they have. with that being said it still is not an excuse for poor care and maintenance.

In the end I chose the boat that I could pay cash for and have money left over. I love my Invader it is bigger and has a deeper hull. It does not have all of the features the Bayliner has but it has the features that I need.

1: it Floats
2: it runs good
3: it is in great shape
4: it is MINE, no boat payment.
5: most importantly It gets me my family and friends out on the lake for some fun in the sun and unforgettable experiences.

Brand, warranty, and reputation aside thats what boating is all about.

My wife is adamant that my 22 year old Invader be cared for and maintained in the utmost.

MacPointMan