Disappearing restorations.

sogood

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
May 11, 2016
Messages
361
In my lifetime, to date, I have always enjoyed restoring things, including houses, cars and boats, along with a myriad of smaller jobs, bringing numerous things back from the brink, to live again. I appreciate that it can sometimes be a long hard lonely road, often with no end in sight. It used to be particularly so in pre- internet days. No forums with all the help and encouragement on offer, not to mention the mountain of invaluable, first hand information and tips.

​It also helps to have the right mindset , accepting that it will most likely take a lot longer and cost a lot more than was originally envisaged. It also helps to try and enjoy the actual journey, and focus a little less on the destination.

​This is where, I think, many such projects fall down. I'm always disappointed to come across some such interesting youtube blog, only to find that it disappears shortly after the initial tear down/ gutting stage. I'm not so much disappointed for myself, but for the blogger who starts out full of hope and optimism. Time and money spent, that only leaves a bad taste and an oily stain on the driveway.

​I think we owe it to al the DIY'ers out there to encourage them whenever possible. To answer questions and make useful suggestions if possible. Without them, many great boats, cars, and a plethora of memorabilia from times past would be consigned to the crusher or landfill.

Just my thoughts.

Now I'm off to youtube to see what's new............
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
Staff member
Joined
Jul 23, 2011
Messages
47,297
Im a die-hard repair/restore/resurrect vs replace guy.
 

Davetowz

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
227
I won't buy it if I can make it, and if it can be fixed, I fix it. Good post.
 

ahicks

Captain
Joined
Sep 16, 2013
Messages
3,957
I've done everything from boats & boat engines, to fabric covered airplanes, to complete houses built from the ground up. There's few things I enjoy more than taking a worthless hunk of junk, adding some love to it and making it right again. I've been doing this so long and have so many successes, I am not easily intimidated by the size of the project. The bigger question is what I'll do with it when it's done!

My point is, while I get the concept of encouraging rookies, encouraging somebody to take on a project that's completely out of scope from anything else they've done, is kind of like asking them to learn how to swim in the deep end of the pool. That's not helping anyone.

Somebody taking a big project on needs to have their eyes wide open. Way too often, they enter into a project with blinders on, which pretty much assures their failure. If new to the concept of bigger projects, I think it much more worthwhile to ask some pointed questions, like, do you have a place to work on it? Or, is your wife breathing down your neck trying to get the kitchen reno. completed?

From that point, chances of success are greatly increased. How can I help? -Al
 

oldrem

Commander
Joined
Nov 7, 2013
Messages
2,002
I've had a few small projects over the years that I've had to finally give up on, but large projects I see though to fruition. I've done a lot of remodeling of rentals and parts of my home over the years, some of which I could never have done without help from sites like this. Some I just engineer what I need and muddle through.

Hints and encouragement from other members help us all keep going. Nothing worse than getting into a project and end up in a funk because you can't figure something out and can't find guidance or help with a solution.
 

hvymtl939

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Feb 6, 2017
Messages
495
Owning and restoring watercraft has been one of the most frustrating and fruitful endeavors I've ever undertaken. These smiles are why I wouldn't trade all the blood, sweat, and tears for anything.

PLwOuFN.jpg

PLwOuFN
 

Stumpalump

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Dec 5, 2013
Messages
413
I think the down fall is people think they need a beautiful restored project. I don't restore anything. Period. What I do do is refirbishing. I'm fixing up a 1976 outboard tin right now. Points, lube, fuel pump, carb clean ect. No paint. Just a filed clean prop. Trailer gets bearing pack and one tire so it will be good for years. I even cut down an old lens cover and drilled holes to fix a light. Came out great! Boat got a few dents pounded out and an acid wash. I'm almost done! 1951 Ford 8N tractors get restored very nicely all of the time. I tuned mine, put a clutch in and fixed everthing to perfection. It's not restored but it's one hell of a refirbishing that I'm just as proud of because it's finished and I use the heck out of it.
 

Old Ironmaker

Captain
Joined
Dec 28, 2015
Messages
3,050
I believe restorations or lack thereof may be an economic driven endeavour today. I look at these Gen Xers and they have to work longer if not harder hours than we did as Baby Boomers to keep up with the cost of living. Longer hours for less pay than I earned if you base it on the cost of living today, in Ontario at least. It seems everyone is on Salary today, like my wife, to avert paying overtime which is illegal here, unless in a Unionized environment the squeaky wheel gets the pink slip. When I retired we were hiring, post secondary education need to apply only for the same job 30 years earlier a High School education was a plus. How these kids can come up with $200,000.00 and carry a $300,000.00 mortgage around here in Southern Ontario is beyond me? Then there are 2 student loans to deal with. We are not talking about Mc Mansions these are 3 bedroom 1 and 1/2 bath working family homes maybe with a single car garage, maybe for 500K. Then they need 2 cars on the road because both need to work to carry the expenses then there is child care to boot. At 30 something years old raising a family with that burden is a Herculean task. Hobbies that cost money is the last thing in their budget. Boating is a luxury today here and most everywhere, restoration of cars and boats are the last thing on the needs list when you have a home that needs tender loving care nor do they have "spare time." I was born at the right time in the past century in the mid 50's as I believe many here are too and I sure wouldn't want to be 30 in todays economy trying to raise a family. I did restorations after work and days off in between night school at the local College, but it was the home, and old furniture where there was a return on investment. My toys were a set of used Golf clubs and power tools. The average house price in Toronto Ontario today is $895,000.00, Vancouver B.C. the average home today is 1.44 million dollars. Not a typo, $1,440,000.00. Our niece has a condo in downtown Toronto, 500ftsq 1 bedroom 1 bath, appraised last month for $900,000.00. Her mortgage is $500,000.00. She works 3 jobs to keep to keep the Wolves at bay. She has a nice bicycle that I bought her. Restorations?

Health wise of course I would kill to be 30 again but not financially. That's my take.
 
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sogood

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
May 11, 2016
Messages
361
I believe restorations or lack thereof may be an economic driven endeavour today. I look at these Gen Xers and they have to work longer if not harder hours than we did as Baby Boomers to keep up with the cost of living. Longer hours for less pay than I earned if you base it on the cost of living today, in Ontario at least. It seems everyone is on Salary today, like my wife, to avert paying overtime which is illegal here, unless in a Unionized environment the squeaky wheel gets the pink slip. When I retired we were hiring, post secondary education need to apply only for the same job 30 years earlier a High School education was a plus. How these kids can come up with $200,000.00 and carry a $300,000.00 mortgage around here in Southern Ontario is beyond me? Then there are 2 student loans to deal with. We are not talking about Mc Mansions these are 3 bedroom 1 and 1/2 bath working family homes maybe with a single car garage, maybe for 500K. Then they need 2 cars on the road because both need to work to carry the expenses then there is child care to boot. At 30 something years old raising a family with that burden is a Herculean task. Hobbies that cost money is the last thing in their budget. Boating is a luxury today here and most everywhere, restoration of cars and boats are the last thing on the needs list when you have a home that needs tender loving care nor do they have "spare time." I was born at the right time in the past century in the mid 50's as I believe many here are too and I sure wouldn't want to be 30 in todays economy trying to raise a family. I did restorations after work and days off in between night school at the local College, but it was the home, and old furniture where there was a return on investment. My toys were a set of used Golf clubs and power tools. The average house price in Toronto Ontario today is $895,000.00, Vancouver B.C. the average home today is 1.44 million dollars. Not a typo, $1,440,000.00. Our niece has a condo in downtown Toronto, 500ftsq 1 bedroom 1 bath, appraised last month for $900,000.00. Her mortgage is $500,000.00. She works 3 jobs to keep to keep the Wolves at bay. She has a nice bicycle that I bought her. Restorations?

Health wise of course I would kill to be 30 again but not financially. That's my take.

​I take on board a lot of what you say, but disagree somewhat on some points. I don't think there is a lack of restoration projects being undertaken "nowadays", but quite the opposite. Thanks to all the encouragement and information available on line through forums such as this, many people are encouraged to have a go. They feel armed in advance, with a ton of information and a catalogue of others' successes.

​Back in the day, much of the repair and restoration "projects" undertaken, were done so out of necessity. Financial constraints meant that things had to last longer and simply replacing something wasn't always an option. Like yourself, I am of an age where I would like to be 30 years younger, but I wouldn't wish to be 30 again, at the present time. My reason for embarking on restorations is varied. I like to keep things alive and useful. I like to save things from extinction. And I really like to give myself a challenge and the pleasure of having something to look forward to. Like waiting on Christmas morning as a child, it's important to have something that keeps your heart beating and your blood pumping.

​The central point to my original post was that often, people seem to embark upon their projects a little naively, taking on too much too soon. It's often not too long before they become overwhelmed by the enormity of what they've started. At this point it's useful to remember the old adage, "How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time"

​I always feel a sense of loss, when, as previously mentioned, I come across an introductory youtube video, showing the sad remains of a neglected boat, with a commentary, outlining the plans to bring this wreck back to its' former glory. Sometimes you see little warning signs, when the commentator suggests that the crumbling, flaking woodwork can be "resurrected" with "a lick of paint" But for the most part, these would be restorers, are fully armed with enthusiasm and idealism and often not a lot more. Depending upon your own personal disposition, this can often be enough to see you through the bad times, those times when you think "What have I taken on here?" But more often than not it seems, the weight of what you've embarked upon overcomes you and your project is resigned to the "Disappeared" file.

That's when you should walk away, for the moment. Take stock and prepare a proper, ordered, "to do" list. Break the enormity of the task down into a lot of little individual jobs. One by one, they are worked through, enjoying the gradual process. Enjoy the journey and don't allow yourself to be rushed to the finish line. Ask yourself, "Why did I take on this project boat?" Was it primarily to go fishing? You can do that any time without all the hassle! Or was it to do something useful and worthwhile, to use your hands, your brain, to give you something to do, for you! To have some activity in your life that you were engaged in because you wanted to be. Life is filled with things we must do, but often lacks the things we'd like to do.

Having said that, it's not for everybody. But if you decide to go ahead, make plans, take small steps, ask questions, develop a hard skin to deal with anybody of the "High horse brigade" and pat yourself on the back for each little success. Share your experiences and you'll get lots of encouragement on board, which helps to keep you going. I look forward to seeing your project, from the first day, when it's dragged into your yard, right through to the big splash. It will put a smile on my face and no doubt, teach me something new.


 

DeepCMark58A

Commander
Joined
Aug 17, 2015
Messages
2,030
There are many reasons that some resoratation projects go by the wayside, some economic, some times people just lose interest. I have a project boat a 1957 Starcraft speed queen that I disassembled cleaned up and painted. I could not find a supplier for the 14' 1x2 white oak needed for the gunnels so the project was put on hold for the summer. In the mean time I found another more desirable boat to restore. I did try to offer up the boat to any other parties that wanted a project boat at no charge, that is against policy so I could not give the boat away. I will be reducing the boat to scrap today, only so much room for boats.
 

Mopie

Cadet
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
23
Photobucket certainly has done their share of Disappearing the Restorations.
 

Blind Date

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
462
Restorations can take a long time. MY '79 GC CVX18 (Currently gutted) is taking so long I went out and bought an '85 GC CVX18 this fall because I missed it so much. The plan was to sell the '85 once the '79 is done but I might have to keep it. It's got some rot in it too so maybe I'll rebuild that once the '79 is done.

Considering what a new boats cost I can put a LOT of dollars into an old one and still be money ahead.

 

BWR1953

Vice Admiral
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
5,802
Wow, I counted over 100 not-finished projects in that list. Whew! Yes, I actually counted. :rolleyes: I had plenty of time in the doctor's waiting room this morning. :cool:

I'm trying to get mine on the completed side of things! :lol: Which brings me onto topic.

I'd suspect that a fair number of unfinished projects are due to health related issues. Lots of middle-aged to senior citizen members (like me) on iboats. They get started but health and/or treatment interferes and they either lose interest or are incapable of completing their boats. So they go away. Others (like me!) just hang around and annoy folks with their slow-to-no progress! :pound:

And we know there are also the pie-in-the-sky dreamers who think that they can buy a trashed hull and fix it up for "a few hundred dollars" and have something as nice as a brand new $30,000 boat. Why do they always compare their 30 or 40 year old restoration project to a new boat and not another completed restoration? :noidea:

People move, change jobs, get deployed, lose interest, have competing interests, run out of money or time, and so on and so on... it's life. But it's okay. At least we enjoyed them while they were here. :)

And a big thumbs up to all who actually got it done!

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Watermann

Starmada Splash of the Year 2014
Joined
Jan 12, 2013
Messages
13,747
I think Facebook may have some responsibility too as it makes most people in the groups want for near instant gratification with likes/reactions and most times they get horrendous advice.
 

Stumpalump

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Dec 5, 2013
Messages
413
Wow, I counted over 100 not-finished projects in that list. Whew! Yes, I actually counted.

And we know there are also the pie-in-the-sky dreamers who think that they can buy a trashed hull and fix it up for "a few hundred dollars" and have something as nice as a brand new $30,000 boat.

It's nice to know the Starcraft resource is there to show people what to look for. The dreamers that don't understand the cost is probably a big part of it. I tell young folks all the time to start your tool collection and guard them with your life. I needed a 5/8" fine thread tap the other day and with a 25% discount it was still $26.00. But get this. I misplaced my red loctite a while back and had been using blue. I figured I'll just grab one of the 1.69 oz bottles while getting the tap. It was thirty one dollars and change! 31 bucks for one bottle of lock tight. The tiny bottles ones were 10. I went home and found it and I'll be more careful where I set the liquid gold down next time. Home Depot, lowes, West Marine stores all eat you alive plus tax on everthing as well. I restored a park bench that my father made. As I walked out with $80 worth of wood and supplies I saw new China benches for $59. Let's just say I fix up old stuff for fun because it sure does not save much money.
 

Watermann

Starmada Splash of the Year 2014
Joined
Jan 12, 2013
Messages
13,747
Yeah well, this is a 2017 Starcraft 18' fishing boat, Cost $35,000 on boat trader.

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My 1979 rebuilt 18' Starcraft into a fishing boat. Cost $7,500

y4mwtWowsn3l79G3GCCCHERqBnYAjeW21nVysqDo-D4ZziJmT5nQrp8ve45xSCa_YcCpTl5GaEAGGXbJXeKEl6I4Q7_KqqUehyU0Xi71K4GRAFdUuJ1ouA7A3qIHzh6CxDkloHjSzKE-ypdFM1MrXPVs2qKjDiO0HjygW1MG5QfPNCJ-hs6SlP7QilP_aawyIckxJgDVJjUwwzBCLkaxtvfAA
 

shrew

Lieutenant
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Messages
1,309
At what cost, though? Just because something CAN be done doesn't mean it SHOULD be done. There is little point in spending 10K to restore something that is only worth 5K when the restoration is done. Restoring for the sake of restoring is a fools errand. I'm personally not interesting in 'buying nostalgia'. I can't and won't pay for the memories I already have. I'm certainly not going to pay so someone else can take a walk down memory lane.
 

Watermann

Starmada Splash of the Year 2014
Joined
Jan 12, 2013
Messages
13,747
I've read that twice and have no idea what you're talking about. I think other old to new vintage lovers / fools won't understand either.

Pride in your hard work and craftsmanship is one thing you can't pay for with your precious money. I've seen people walk by a new 100k wake boat (that's now worth 20k less after using it) without a glance and then stop to look and ask me about my nearly 50 year old Chief.
 
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