Newbie- learning all there is to know before getting first boat

[kay.cookie]

Hey everyone!
So my longterm boyfriend and I recently decided we want to get a used boat. Originally we were planning to start a project boat, but after doing a good amount of research, getting others' opinions on it and learning about the amount of time and work that would need to go into it, we decided it was far too big of a project for a first boat and two people with limited knowledge on boats in general. So we're looking at used boats under $6,000 that are older but in working order, have good maintenance histories, and everything we're looking to get out of it.
The main reason for getting a boat is, simply out, pure enjoyment and entertainment for us as well as friends and family. We'd like to use it for camping, taking family and friends out, etc. We live in Maine so there are plenty of lakes for us to explore.
We're interested in getting a cruiser or bowrider, outboard. From what I've read there's pros and cons to both cruisers and bowriders but I'm interested to hear some more experiences with the two, and which ones anyone would recommend.
Basically, we're starting from scratch, knowledge-wise. I've been on my stepfathers boat more than a handful of times but I've never driven it. My parents have experience with boats- including totally renovating a project boat- so they're a good resource for us.
We're currently working out showings for some on Craigslist that we're interested in, just to get more of a feel for what we're looking for and talk with more experienced boat owners. We're also planning on getting our boat education cards soon, and taking the course for that will help us significantly.
Just thought I'd introduce myself to the boating community! Anyone else here a newbie?
If you have any "must know" tips on boating, please feel free to share! We want to learn all there is to know before making a purchase.
If you have anything to offer about buying used boats, please share!
We look forward to referencing these forums often to ask questions, share our experience and learn from the vast amount of knowledge and tips on here!

 

[tpenfield]

:welcome:

​You budget of $6K will put you into some level of 'project boat', but hopefully you can find something that is workable.

There are three areas (at least) that you will want to learn about . . .
1) finding a boat - inspecting it and knowing what to look for
​2) navigation, seamanship and boat handling - the courses are a good start, but if you have friends who boat, then that may help as well.
​3) Maintenance - Boats always seem to need a certain amount of fixing, and it is difficult and expensive to rely on boat mechanics for all this work.

So, you have come to a good place to do some reading and learning about all of these things.

 

[Rick Stephens]

Kay,

Two things that bite first time buyers in the wallet and in their enjoyment - 1) hidden dry rot (should be called wet rot) and 2) mechanical issues.

Mechanicals are usually the easier of the two to determine. Look at everything inspect like crazy and don't buy anything you can't do a pretty extensive test run. Engine and power train repairs are more costly on a boat than on a car but nearly the same in knowledge needed.

Dry rot is the biggie. Learn how to see it and how to test for it. I can't tell you how many buyers have seen that pretty new floor in their 'fell in love with' boat, only to find the no good so and so who sold it covered over a rotten structure underneath with new plywood layer and some carpet. Frankly I am guilty of not doing a very good pre-purchase exam of the wood under the deck of the last boat I bought, and just plain lucked out that it was in decent shape. I cannot stress enough though, if there is anything you take from this early conversation on buying used boats, take the time to educate yourself on how to test for rot. Every boat has places that are hard to see and harder to determine structural soundness, and cruisers are one of the hardest designs to inspect. The typical cruiser has more nooks and crannies and bulkheads stuck in making it nearly impossible to see many small water capturing spaces. Be a wise buyer and run scared.

Last, but the most important thing of all - don't fall in love with a boat until after you prove you should own it. THERE ARE ALWAYS MORE BOATS FOR SALE. Always.

Good luck, and have fun!

Rick

 

[shrew]

You won't be able to learn "Everything". You'll be lucky to at least get a handle on what you don't know. Boating is a long, slow, process where you're always learning. When you start boating, you have a full bucket full of mistakes (some will call it a bucket of 'luck', but it honestly doesn't always feel 'lucky') and an empty bucket of experience. Every mistake you make subtracts one from the mistake bucket and adds one to the experience bucket. It takes a lifetime to complete the process of filling the experience bucket.

 

[JASinIL2006]

In that price range, it would be very easy to inadvertently wind up with a project boat, so I would strongly advise you to find a friend who knows boats and take him/her along when you go to look at prospectives. Even better if you can find someone who has had to rebuild/restore a boat; they'll really know what warning signs to look for! (Keep in mind that even experienced boat buyers can wind up with a lemon, but it's much less likely.)

If you've never boated before, a cruiser might be a lot of boat... bowriders are nice for starters as learn to operate/dock/etc. a boat. Also, as you're figuring what you can afford, keep in mind that boats are expensive. Figure in annual maintenance costs, fuel costs, insurance costs and, if you plan to keep the boat in/near the water, the costs for wet or dry slipping the boat and annual winter storage. If you plan to trailer, make sure you have a tow vehicle with enough capacity.

Boating is a ton of fun, and I don't regret any of the time or money I've spent, but it is a costly pastime. Many new boaters don't anticipate the expense.

Make sure you take a safe boating class; many are available online (and they can be quite helpful), but a face-to-face course would be especially valuable.

I was very lucky to have a good friend show me the ropes when I first started. He helped me with launching and retrieving, figuring out how to get the boat trailer to go where I wanted, and operating the boat on the water. His help was priceless, so if you don't already know that stuff, finding someone to help is really nice!

Good luck and you have come to right place!

 

[Grub54891]

Being this late in the season, be cautious if the temps have been freezing for several days. I've seen boats people bought in the winter, solid as a rock. The saturated, wet wood is frozen, when it thaws out in spring, you have a rotten boat.

 

[kay.cookie]

Thanks to all the replies everyone! It all helps so much.
We don't mind having a workable project boat- we just don't want to end up having to gut a boat and work from a skeleton.
We're currently mostly looking at Sea Ray cabin cruisers- the one we're most interested in is a 1984 Sea Ray 245 Sundancer Sport Cruiser for $5,995. It's in excellent condition (according to the listing) and only has 120 engine hours. My biggest concern is the size in relation to our experience- or lack there of. We do want something that we can camp out on for days at a time (e.g. a weekend camping trip) and take multiple people out on, so the 24.5' size is simultaneously appealing. JASinIL2006 you mentioned that a bowrider would be easier to learn on- would you (or anyone else) say that a 25 footer cabin cruiser is too large for first-time boaters? Or is it not out of the question?

 

[Mischief Managed]

I highly recommend getting a copy of Chapman's Piloting and Seamanship. It'll be great study material for the Winter.

A 1980s Sea Ray can be a great boat, but can be a nightmare too. I do not want to discourage you, but odds are good you'll be getting a project cruiser for 6 grand. Hope you're handy... Coincidentally, I've been helping a new boater with his $6500 1986 Sea Ray cruiser all Summer, ran great for about 2 hours, now has a "new" engine. I hope your experience is better.

Sebago/Songo River/Long Lake, is a really cool place to cruise.

 

[Silvertip]

24 foot cruiser for a first boat? I merely question the wisdom as that size can not only be a project but better called a "money pit". Enter that arena with extreme caution. Next, what do you have for a tow vehicle? If you've never towed anything that big that alone is a learning experience. You also need to understand that when a seller tells you "all it needs is a tune-up" that really means it likely needs major engine work or possibly a new engine. If you are not mechanically and/or electrically inclined, you either need to learn quickly or have someone with that knowledge test the boat -- ON THE WATER. If any seller refuses an on-water test you either low ball offer or walk away. Beware of ad content. Everyone that's trying to sell something on Craigs list will say it is in mint condition. Then there is the issue with I/O vs outboard power. Outboards are far easier to maintain and generally less expensive. With an I/O you almost need fingers and elbows with universal joints to get into very tight places. Being small of stature helps you get into those spaces. Finally, do not let your enthusiasm cloud your judgement.

 

[Old Ironmaker]

You are looking at a 34 year old boat as your introduction to boating. A 34 year old anything including some houses will need a ton of love along with a ton of 20 dollar bills, The difference from a used cruiser and a used bowrider for 6K is like comparing a basket case Benz to an old Lada that might start on occasion. For $6000.00 you won't get a cruiser that runs and for 6 grand you will get an old bowrider project boat that may cost you an additional 3K, at least and a DIY. For that budget you are looking at a water worthy 20 year old 16" side council aluminum with a 70 HP outboard and trailer, maybe. I am sorry for being blunt, that's me, but ignorance is bliss. Please research what you can buy in the marine market for $6000.00. not much.

 

[tpenfield]

I started out with a 22 foot sailboat for about $4500 . . . then after a few years decided to get a power boat, figuring I could get something decent for $10K or less . . . $25,000 later I had my first power boat . . . a 24 foot Formula.

I looked at what I could get for the $10K or less range and it just did not seem too appealing to me at the time. Your budget being $6K is even tighter, and the hopes that a $6K boat will bring you joy and utility may be a stretch.

24 feet is not an impossible starting point, if you can quickly develop the boat handling skills, but the budget of $6K is really geared towards smaller boats. . . but then there goes the utility of camping out, etc.

So, I'd see if you can go higher on your budget, or be prepared to do some work on the boat, and also have some budget to go along with the work.

Would a 22 - 26 foot trailerable sailboat do the trick as a starting point? It will get you on the water, and do the camping thing, but you won't get anywhere all that fast. You will learn about boating and not spend a ton of $$$$ at first, then you could make a move to a powerboat when you are ready to go to the $20K level.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Read this sticky from the top of the forum

http://forums.iboats.com/forum/gene...eeding-help-buying-a-boat-a-buyer-s-checklist

for your first boat, look at an aluminum outboard powered boat like a starcraft. something where the wood floor is not structural and the transom can be replaced in a day.

Skip the large searay, especially a 34 year old searay with only 120 hours. an under-used motor is worse than a motor used every day. after 34 years, there should be between 1500 and 2000 hours on the motor (normal 50 hours per year). the lack of hours is a lack of use. lack of use also potentially means lack of annual maintenance. lack of maintenance will mean lots of money to fix things

I would recommend getting a survey, however many surveyors wont even look at boats under $20k because they find too much wrong with the boat.

as other have said, $6k is project boat territory, especially with a fiberglass boat. you may get lucky, however if $6k is your budget, you may have to buy a $2k wreck with a rotten hull and dump $4k into interior and hull.

 

[briangcc]

The other guys/gals have touched on a lot of subjects so I'll leave those alone.

How about this as an option....Pontoon boat with camper canvas. Gives you a light weight platform, definitely a lot of leg room for camping, probably outboard powered, and worst case you have to replace the deck with some plywood & covering. You might sneak one in at your budget.

Otherwise...look at my signature line and you'll see the progression I made - from 15' to 19'. That's since 1986 and I'm still learning! I personally think it's a stretch to start with no experience and jump right into a 24' cruiser but that's just me.

 

[aj10203]

[FONT=&quot]I think with patience you will be able to get a damn good boat for $6k. I bought my boat, a 1989 Larson 25' San Marino with just under 500 hours, from the second owner, for $2500. It is as solid as a rock, came with a ton of extras and everything works (of course it has some signs of wear though, it is 28 years old!). But I was searching craigslist and looking at boats for almost 5 months before it popped up. So my advice would be to be patient and eventually a solid boat in your price range will show, be weary of a boat that seems like a good deal that has been for sale for months... My boat was posted on a Thursday and I bought it on Sunday.[/FONT]

 

[JASinIL2006]

Patience and luck!

 

[frankthomas]

I just bought my 2nd boat and still feel like a newbie. I just took the Michigan Boating safety online course from Boat-ed.com. Michigan requires young boaters to be certified and this is the online course for them. I am far from young and do not need to be certified but just in my 2nd year of boating with a 18' bow rider. So I wanted to learn what I could from a course like this about safety and navigation and it was a good start. I checked the boat-ed.com site and for Maine they just offer a state of Maine safety hand book. Not an interactive course like Michigan offers. I think you'd do well to pay the $30 to take the interactive Michigan course. Good stuff. At least now I know what "red-right-returning" means. lol If you don't know and you are on any larger lakes and waterways you will want to know.

 

[nola mike]

I bought my 19' for < $4k 9 years ago, so I think a $6k budget for a bowrider is perfectly reasonable. Knowing what I know now, I think that I'd much rather deal with mechanical issues than cosmetic or structural. Though as others have said, structural stuff can be tough to find. I just over the past year sank about $1500 into redoing the floor and interior (could have done it for a good bit less, though I could have spent a ton more if I didn't do the glass work myself). If you plan to pay someone to do the stuff for you, you WILL be paying for it. Smaller/outboard/newer is less expensive to maintain than Bigger/IO/older, although seems to me that the bigger OBs are harder/more expensive to fix/replace when they break.

 

[kay.cookie]

Thanks again for all the info everyone- it really helps! This is another Sea Ray we're interested in. Take a look at it- just based on the listing, what can you say about pursuing this as an option? It's 20' so it's a bit more manageable than a 24' Sea Ray. https://nh.craigslist.org/boa/d/1993-searay-200-cuddy-with/6328688364.html

 

[Chigwalla]

You didn't mention your locale, so I won't comment on the price since that's a regional thing.
What I would suggest on top of the great advice here is to take your prospective purchase to a shop BEFORE you buy it.
A couple hours of a mechanic's time is cheap peace of mind.

I just had a Trophy come in that the new owners got a screaming deal on. I called them an hour later to tell them they were down a cylinder, the transom was punky and the walking beam on the trailer was cracked right through at the pivot. I just had a chance to buy a (late-80s?)19' Wellcraft center console...till I crawled around and saw how badly everything was bojangled together. It looked great from the outside but the first problem would turn it from a running boat into a project because of everything that would need to be fixed before you could get to whatever failed.

Anytime I hear about someone getting a 'great deal' on a used boat, I cringe because it makes me wonder what gremlin they missed and when it will rear its head....

When the 'right' boat pops up, don't hesitate. You'll never be the only one looking at it.

 

[nola mike]

Looks like it's in good shape, reasonable price, underpowered likely. That head looks like it would be fun to use, esp at night with someone else sleeping in there...