Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
My 1999 50hp HEDOL outboard struggles to start when cold. Once warmed up it starts very easily however. When i try to prime the engine by squeezing the primer bulb, the bulb goes hard on the first squeeze and then cannot be squeezed again easily. I have unplugged the fuel line from the engine and pumped the primer bulb whilst holding in the little ball and fuel squirts out and i can then pump it easily. I connected the fuel line onto my other engine and it seems to work fine there so not a fuel line problem. Must be problem with fuel pump/carbs?????
 

Ray Neudecker

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 25, 2004
Messages
1,656
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

I would first look to fuel pump and then carbs.
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

Ray said:
I would first look to fuel pump and then carbs.

Sent boat to dealer who replaced all fuel pump diaphrams. Said they looked bad.

Took boat our for a test yesterday and there is no improvement. Phoned dealer and he said perhaps the solenoid needed to be replaced??

Does this sound like the next logical step?
 

deejaycee_2000

Captain
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
3,447
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

Did they clean out the carbs aswell? change the fuel filter? I doubt the solenoid has anything to do with it .....
 

Ray Neudecker

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 25, 2004
Messages
1,656
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

Did they check to be sure the primer was working properly?
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

They did the carbs, although i cannot comment as to how well they were done! I have a racor fuel filter / water trap and have changed this too - or do you mean the small filter on the engine itself?

When you say the primer, i take it that you mean the primer bulb in the fuel line from the tank to the engine. I have tested this with the fuel line disconnected from the engine and it seems to pump fine.

One thing i do notice is that when i try to prime the engine before starting, the primer bulb goes very hard after only one squeeze. It feels quite different to the other side.
 

Ray Neudecker

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 25, 2004
Messages
1,656
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

No I meant the electrical primer the manual shows this model to use rather than the chokes more commonly found on Yamaha carb Motors.
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

No. I dont think they looked at this. But i am taking the boat back to the dealer tomorrow so i will ask them to pay attention to that.

Do you have the time to explain how this electrical primer works?

Thanks!!
 

deejaycee_2000

Captain
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
3,447
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

how is your watertrap set up on your fuel line ..... between the tank and the primer bulb or between the primer bulb and the motor?
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

It is between the tank and the primer bulb. Significance?
 

deejaycee_2000

Captain
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
3,447
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

that setup is correct ..... you sure the connector on the engine for the fuel line is working properly .....
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

Pretty sure. I replaced the male (engine) side fitting as the pin felt stiff. Made no difference though.

The dealer called me yesterday and i went to see him. He says that they checked the electrical primer and that it is working fine. Stripped the carbs again. Said that there was a little water in the carbs. Not sure how this got there as i have good water traps installed.

Not sure where to turn next. It is really difficult to fault find as once the engine starts, it will then start perfectly all day. It is only if it stands for a couple of days that it then struggles.

Thanks!!!
 

deejaycee_2000

Captain
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
3,447
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

After running for the day before storing the motor for a couple of days you should unhook the fuel line and run the engine untill it dies so all the fuel is out of the engine .....
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

People seem to have quite mixed views on this suggestion.

How will this improve things?

Still does not explain why i am only having this problem with the one engine and the other one starts perfectly.
 

deejaycee_2000

Captain
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
3,447
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

Well it will prevent 2-stroke oil from gumming up you carbs .......... what your problem is concerned .... try running it with some fuel system cleaner and see if the condition becomes better ......
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

I will try that - thanks for all your input.
 

Ray Neudecker

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 25, 2004
Messages
1,656
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

The only other suggestion I would have would be to go back over the starting procedure with your manual or dealer to be sure you are not leaving something out such as fast idle or priming while starting.
Yamaha's are cold natured starters the first time each day. The rest of the day you just hit the switch after they have warmed up and it is almost instant starting.
 

ZR4538

Cadet
Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

I will do that. Thanks!
 

rodbolt

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 1, 2003
Messages
20,066
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

I disagree with Ray on this, I have no issues with that motor cold, as long as the enrichment circuit and proper starting method is used.
a brief overview of the "prime start" system on that 50.
it uses a heated wax pellet solinoid to alter fuel enrichment at idle .
when the pellet is cold a rod retracts and allows extra fuel to enter the intake tracts of all 3 carbs, the pellet is heated by the pick off voltage from the stator.
if the carb shutters are not properly sycnded or another issue is happening or your using any amount of warm up lever it will be very difficult to start cold.
the system actually works quite well but kicks many a techs rump cause they dont seem to grasp how it works.
as the engine runs and the pellet gets heated the rod extends and closes off the fuel enrichment passage.
on the middle carb there should be a red lever, make sure it has not been turned to the OFF position.
go on the yamaha parts website and look at the middle carb, you will see some diaphrams and orings and such that can go bad or get trash in them, those parts get overlook and are not part of the carb kit. I complained again today at the seminar about it.
but if everything is set up properly and the correct starting procedure is used those motors start fairly easy down to about 35 degrees F.
below that and I usually have to use the manual overide.
 

Ray Neudecker

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 25, 2004
Messages
1,656
Re: Yamaha 50hp 1999 - starting with difficulty when cold

rodbolt, we are not disagreeing. Many of these motors are used in our area when it is below freezing and the local dealer may have to recomend the manual method of priming rather than the automatic version. All Yamaha's can suffer from hard starting when used under winter conditions here. I certainly see where you are coming from on the prime circuit problem as far as the parts that are included in the kits.
If the parts aren't included in the kits most techs assume they are not necessary to change.
 
Top