290 outdrives tough shifting

[Anzezaf]

Hi,

It's my first time writing here so forgive me if I forget to mention anything.

I have a 1986 ~30ft fairline targa with dual VP AQ290A engines coupled to 290 drives. The shifter levers mounted are I think still the original ones from VP, and its probably worth mentioning that they don't have any interrupt or start-only-in-neutral switches (http://www.volvopentastore.com/mall/...ighres72_2.jpg) .
Now, whenever I try shifting in forward, both levers offer the same little amount of resistance at the shifting point, but they are still relatively comfortable to use, they just need a slighty more confident push and they shift normally.
But shifting in reverse is a totally different matter - they wont move at all. You would literally have to use your whole body weight to get them to shift, and it's really impossible to control the boat shifting normally. When they do jump in reverse gear though, they operate the throttle quite normally, albeit with noticeably more resistance than when in forward gear. When I shift from reverse back into neutral, the levers produce a noticeable bang sound as opposed to a soft click when shifting from forward to neutral. After I get them in reverse the first time, they start shifting into reverse a little bit easier, but they still always require a hefty amount of pushing. When I leave the boat for a week or two, the levers again become harder to shift. The shifting is also becoming harder by the month - I remember it was softer when I first got the boat.

I also started noticing that (rarely) the drives will not shift out of reverse/forward when I put the levers in neutral, and it will take a few retries to get them out of gear.

This is the same on both of the levers, so I am really wondering if the cables could be at fault here. I checked quite a few other threads regarding shifting problems and I couldn't find one that would fit my symptoms.

I can't say when the shift cables were last changed as I got the boat last year and the previous owner wasn't of much help.

I think it's probably best to start at the control levers themselves? Unscrew all the cables and try moving only the levers?

 

[alldodge]

Hey Scott Danforth you have a 290, can you help?

 

[Scott Danforth]

I can try.

Anzezaf, welcome aboard.

Your going to have to pull the boat into the hard, or you have to work under water.

Pull the shift cover from each drive. Lower screw comes all the way out, upper one just gets loosened a bit

Pull the cotter key on the cable end so you're only moving the cables.

If you have a high amount of resistance, get new cables. Best to have the boat in the hard to change.

If thare is no resistance, most likely either the cables out of adjustment or the cables are out of adjustment and the reverse latch is bent and your forcing it into reverse is further bending the latch.

The reverse latch is activated by the shift ball crank and the push rod that goes to the front of the drive where the H frame is.

 

[Anzezaf]

I was wondering before if changing shift cables could be done in the water, so you're saying it's possible? I just didn't know if the cover plate was sealed, or if there is water behind it. Most probably i'm gonna do the procedure in the water in the late spring, as it's a hassle and a nice sum of money to get the boat out.

If I understand you correctly, when I pull the cover plate off and detach the cable, I should move the cables using the shifters? I was also thinking I could try to move the shift assembly on the drive by hand as I heard it should move easily by hand. Like this fella in the video

. I'm gonna have to see if I will be able to do it from the bathing platform though.

It could be something to do with the reverse latch as you said, because both the drives lift up when put in reverse (issue for another thread?). I already checked out the 3 springs on the latch, and the largest one of them was stretched on one of the drives, so i'm gonna replace the whole set on both drives.

 

[Scott Danforth]

the cover plate is not sealed. however to feed the cables out and the replacement cables back in will probably sink your boat as you struggle to get everything done while under water. best recommended to get the boat on the hard.

you have to pull the drives to inspect the bellows and u-joints anyway

the video shows a DP-B or DP-C and not a 290. however very similar.

 

[Anzezaf]

Forgive me for being stubborn, but are you sure that water would get in the engine compartment? As far as I see, the cable is routed through the rubber hose / sheath that is attached to the transom and is sealed? You just pull the cable through the hose, once it's disconnected?

Here, at about 6:45, he didn't mention anything else besides detaching the cable and pulling in through from the engine side.

Again, you definitely know more than me in this case, I'm just trying to check every possibility.
As for the bellows and the U joints, they were checked and bellows replaced when I first got the boat.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Replacing the cable is easier with the drive off.

However first and foremost, pull the cover, disconnect the shift cables and check.

If you bent the reverse catch, you have to pull the drive off, and pull it apart to separate the H-frame from the drive. That can not be done under water

 

[loco]

I had an engineer tell me there was some kind of cone that needed replacing, which was causing the drive leg to bang into gear. He said he swapped it over when I last had it serviced/rebuilt, then it needed to bed in and might need adjustment, but to me the leg seems exactly the same. Quite stiff to move it either forward or aft, and bangs into gear. This couldn't be a similar issue?

I'll have to try mine out when it's next on the drying blocks. Might be worth swaping the cable anyway as a preventitive measure - I towed someone back to shore a couple years ago who had had his drive fail by not being able to go into gear....

 

[Anzezaf]

Mine doesn't bang into gear, it's the shift levers themselves that bang when put from reverse into neutral.
What you're talking about must be some part of the cone clutch system that I read about regarding this leg.

 

[Scott Danforth]

if the cone clutch wears (from improper cable adjustment) it would simply not go into gear. most of the time the issue is poor adjustment on the cable, not pushing the unit far enough into reverse and the reverse catch gets screwed up. I have replaced the sheetmetal part of my reverse catch twice. once when I bought the boat because it was bent by the PO, and once when I had the drive apart last time simply because I had it apart. the sheet metal part is the mechanical fuse if you hit something with the drive

the little shift rod pushes thru the drive against the cone like portion of the catch. it works, however its a bit cheezy

if you wore the cone clutches out, its been out of adjustment for a long time.

 

[Anzezaf]

Well, when I got the boat it did have a period of a few months where sometimes when shifting into gear, there would be a loud bang from the drive and the whole boat shook, but now it doesn't anymore. Looks like the problem solved itself (hopefully there isn't a disaster looming around the corner because of this).

 

[Scott Danforth]

The loud bang was the shift cable out of adjustment and the cone clutch fighting to engage.

The more you reveal, the more i suggest pulling the boat on the hard and getting the shift cables adjusted or replaced, and everything gone over

 

[Anzezaf]

Hi, reviving this thread.

Scott Danforth

So now that the water is warm I jumped in the water and disconnected the cable from the drive. The cable along with the shift levers moves freely like it was new.

Then I tried turning the shift mechanism on the drive by hand - the pivot/eccentric piece (http://i.imgur.com/P02Wsrl.jpg) - like the guy in the video in #4 post above turns it.

It would go into forward gear with a little resistance, but it could be turnt by hand nevertheless, so no problems there.
Reverse is another story though, it wouldn't turn by any means - it would only move about half the way it needs to go to shift. And it has a high amount of resistance - and it's hard to explain but it's like a hard resistance, like you're trying to turn it and it hits something that shouldn't be in the mechanism / something metallic, plus it has a "scraping" feel to it in the area where it does turn..
It's not a "soft" kinda resistance if I'm making any sense - it's a hard, definite "clunk" when you reach the limit of how far the shift piece will turn.

Is this a sign of a problem with the innner shift assembly itself / gears? ( http://i.imgur.com/K6mW60x.jpg )

 

[Maclin]

Try moving the prop while you do that and see if it acts differently.

 

[Anzezaf]

Anything else that I might try while I'm down there?