1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

  • Fix it , shouldn't be that bad

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    4
  • Poll closed .

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
OK, I have a 1988 Four Winn 235 Sundowner that I have way more in repair $$$ than I spent on the boat in the 1st place. 7.5 L engine overheated last weekend in 2-3 minutes at moderate RPM, impeller to blame, I sure. Now the mechanic at the marina is telling me that I have water in the cylinders, dip stick level is way high, and motor is DEAD...

I have overheated before 2X, and after a new impeller , was fine. This time it seems I did more damage.

I am sooooo tired of fixing this boat, and the associated costs . 3x Stern drive , 2 starters , and many many misc other repairs.

My question is , is it worth having a mechanic dig into the moter to find out what is really the issue , paying the hourly rate, or should I just give up on this POS, and try to part out remaining good items ( stern drive, other engine components)? Any suggestions on how to determine ( inexpensively ) finding out where the problem is , and where I would go to find a new engine , if I chose to go this route. Love the boat , but 'bout had it with the repair costs .

Model # Engine : 754BDRGDP Serial # T1070994 Stern Drive Cobra 985289
 

a70eliminator

Captain
Joined
Sep 9, 2007
Messages
3,694
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Part it out, anyone who does relies on a mechanic shouldn't even consider owning a Cobra, not bashing mechanics just saying your kinda over a barrel with that one. Don't take it wrong but unless you are your own mechanic the obsoleted cobra Drive will destroy your finances.
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Funny thing , the oil does not look at all milky on the dipstick, however it is 2" above the full mark. I could be that the water leaked into the oil pan after the motor was shut off, as I only had it running about 2-3 minutes when the overheating occurred
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Funny thing , the oil does not look at all milky on the dipstick, however it is 2" above the full mark. I could be that the water leaked into the oil pan after the motor was shut off, as I only had it running about 2-3 minutes when the overheating occurred

Howdy,


I had a similar problem with the 460 King Kobra I had in my 87 Four Winns 211 Liberator.

I don't think I had a lot of water in the pan but there was some. I had leaky riser gaskets on both sides. It allowed water to run back into the cyls that had open exhaust valves when I shut down.

Then it would hydrolock if I tried to start it immediately after shutdown and for about 30 min thereafter.........If I let it sit longer, it would usually crank right up (presumably after the water leaked past the rings)

It did this for quite some time.......until I removed the engine the following winter.

If you have a few inches of water in the pan I would think it's more than just leaky riser gaskets. You just cannot get all that much water past the rings.....and if you get it started, and run it for a while, the little bit of water evaporates out rather quickly.

It's possible that you might have a severely corroded intake manifold, enough that it's allowing water into the "valley", a cracked block or a cracked head.




You will have to make your own decision........

When I pulled my engine, I was unable to find replacement exhaust manifolds.....then they became available for some ridiculous price of $1600 EACH!!:eek:

The coupler was NOT available and there were several parts for the drive that were NLA (or ridiculously priced used etc)


This was only about 5 or 6 years ago...... I understand that Sierra NOW has couplers again and there's someone actually making exhaust manifolds for the 460 again. (albeit DOUBLE the price of other manifolds!!) There are companies that will rebuild the drive too.... http://www.allamericandriveservice.com/OMCCobra.html

So you're not DEAD in the water as it were.........


I decided to DUMP everything though and I found a used 454/Bravo III setup locally from a wind damaged boat and bought the whole shoot'n match for $5k and replaced everything.

I subsequently sold all the OMC Junk, piece by piece over 3 years or so for a total of about $3500.


Now, if you wanted to replace the engine you could easily find a truck engine that would probably work just fine..........just MAKE DOUBLE sure that your exhaust manifolds and risers and coupler are serviceable (Those are MAJOR show-stopper parts)


Part it out, anyone who does relies on a mechanic shouldn't even consider owning a Cobra, not bashing mechanics just saying your kinda over a barrel with that one. Don't take it wrong but unless you are your own mechanic the obsoleted cobra Drive will destroy your finances.

Yeah.......it's hard to argue with that attitude...... I went through a LOT of gyrations on how to fab a different coupler when I couldn't find one, and go with different manifolds etc.....

There are still a LOT of 460 King powered boats out there. The used parts supply is slowly drying up. People are willing to buy all the parts. (I sold my old KC drive for $1450 to a guy on the east coast and he paid the shipping !!)

I sold my flywheel housing to a guy in CA that was going to have to part out his boat after he hit something submerged and his coupler literally EXPLODED. He couldn't find a flywheel housing anywhere!!! His insurance company was going to "Total" his boat because it wasn't worth repowering. (80's 26ft Bayliner)

I sold my Exhaust Y-pipe to a guy in FL when his severely corroded y-pipe started leaking and nearly sunk his boat!!! You cannot buy them either!

Anyway, you get the picture.

A Mercruiser BBC/Bravo will bolt right in. the transom cutout is the same (you do have to drill 2 additional holes for the 8-stud Merc transom-mount though)



Good luck! I was there about 5 years ago!


Rick
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Ok , so I thought I would at least try to get this engine running, and so far so good . Water is out of engine , mechanic has it started . Rebuilding starter , but I need new exhaust manifold gaskets . Advance auto has gaskets for a 1985 460 Ford Carburated Block , can these be used on my 460 OMC 1988 ( serial # T1070994) ?
 

Joshua Nichols

Lieutenant
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,431
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Ok , so I thought I would at least try to get this engine running, and so far so good . Water is out of engine , mechanic has it started . Rebuilding starter , but I need new exhaust manifold gaskets . Advance auto has gaskets for a 1985 460 Ford Carburated Block , can these be used on my 460 OMC 1988 ( serial # T1070994) ?

Okay but how did the water get in there?
 

sethjon

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jun 8, 2010
Messages
692
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Part it out, anyone who does relies on a mechanic shouldn't even consider owning a Cobra, not bashing mechanics just saying your kinda over a barrel with that one. Don't take it wrong but unless you are your own mechanic the obsoleted cobra Drive will destroy your finances.

You have obviously never had a Cobra. I used to think as you did until my son bought a used boat with one on it. Hes had it for 3 years now without a problem. And the best part is you can change the impeller with your eyes closed. Its all in how it was maintained. He got it from aguy that was a maintenance fanatic and it runs like new.
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Its all in how it was maintained.
EXCEPT when you have a 460 King Kobra........ Then all "bets" are OFF....


but I need new exhaust manifold gaskets . Advance auto has gaskets for a 1985 460 Ford Carburated Block , can these be used on my 460 OMC 1988

What exactly do you mean by "exhaust manifold gaskets"?


If you mean #30 below, Yes. They'll probably fit.
convert
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

The gasket is OEM #0912405.......and is also Sierra 18-0992 and Mercury 27-68715 (for the infamous 3.7L Mercruiser)
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

We are thinking that it got in through the exhaust port because when I realized it was overheating and running top speed I immediatly put it in neutral and shut the engine off.
Problem is that is doing that the "wave" from stopping fast hits the back of the boat and the flappers can't react that fast , and hence water through the exhaust port. At least that what I have been told by a few mechanics in my local. Comments ?
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Yes # 30, local auto parts had the part and mechanic says it looks right, being assembled tommorow.
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Can both the engine & the drive be a "King Cobra" ? I thought just the stern drive ( lower unit) could be a king. I have the 460 OMC 7.5l with a standard cobra drive ( parts were replaced in it last year). I know this is not a good combination ( tears up the gears too quick) , but now I am concerned about parts for the engine if it's a king cobra engine too.
Serial # & model are in my first post?
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Can both the engine & the drive be a "King Cobra" ? I thought just the stern drive ( lower unit) could be a king. I have the 460 OMC 7.5l with a standard cobra drive ( parts were replaced in it last year). I know this is not a good combination ( tears up the gears too quick) , but now I am concerned about parts for the engine if it's a king cobra engine too.
Serial # & model are in my first post?


You indicated
754BDRGDP

You meant 754BPRGDP Right?



The only drive ever mated to a 460 is the 1.41:1 (if memory serves) drive.

It holds 108oz of oil. (the smaller drives hold FAR less oil) It was the first drive to be called "King" Cobra.

In 1990 and later they called several (different) drives "King".

There's nothing really unique about your engine other than it's a carbureted FORD 460 with an OMC (and unavailable) flywheel housing bolted to the back The (formerly unavailable) exhaust manifolds are fairly expensive as is the coupler. (only available from Sierra now I think)
You can view engine parts here: http://epc.brp.com

The above parts are show stoppers. I don't know how long they'll be available........ you should buy spares if you intend to keep that thing.

I don't think you can put a smaller drive on the back of the gimbal. If your drive holds 108oz of oil it IS the (big, real) KING Cobra for that year. They only made that particular (dog-clutch) drive from 1987-1989 Then it was discontinued.

The other Cobra dog-clutch drives were produced (or sold) from 1987 to about 1993 or so.


If you have any water in the cyls, you MUST remove the risers from the manifolds and replace the riser-gaskets(#29 in the picture above) !
They DO leak and if they are leaking, they'll allow water into open exhaust valves after shutdown (every time) If you have an internal crack in a manifold, it will also allow water into open valves......
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

BPR is correct, sorry. When I had to change gears last year we determined that is was a regular cobra drive because the parts were still available, and were not for the King drive. It went together fine with the "cobra" parts, been running on that gear set for about 1.5 years now. Serial # on stern drive is 985289 ????? I'm sure it will need a gear set in the upcoming years ... Can you tell me about the drive based on the seial # ?

The link you provided above does not have an OMC section, just Johnson- am I missing something on the website?

We will make sure to change the #29 gasket as well - very much appreciated.

Can the manifolds be visually checked ? , the wall thickness between the waterjacket holes and the exhaust port look pretty solid albiet rusty . Mechanic has one off , and has stated that it looks fine.

The plan right now is to get this thing started and watch for oil in the pan over time, any suggestions on what else to watch for ? I am worried that if water gets back into the cylinders without me knowing that, I could easily hydrolock and destroy the engine.

What do you think about the concept of shutting the boat down hard and the wave generated at the back of the boat getting up through the exhaust and into the cylinders? This is my hope that this is how this all happened in the first place , may be a bit optimistic ?
Mechanic is pretty sure that this is how the water got into the cylinders???? .....
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

It went together fine with the "cobra" parts, been running on that gear set for about 1.5 years now. Serial # on stern drive is 985289 ?????

I am not sure that 985289 is the "drive". Are you sure it isn't the transom assembly?

http://epc.brp.com is the BRP site where you can view parts for ALL OMC engines and drives. (it works without an email address btw)
Just click the drop down menu and select STERN DRIVE once you're inside. You'll see year, engine and specific model numbers etc.

How do you know you have a "regular" Cobra on the back? There's a LOT of parts commonality with all the drives...... If you have found a way to make the smaller Cobra work (different yoke, gimbal etc) good luck. That's a LOT of HP for the smaller models.


How much oil does your drive hold?


Can the manifolds be visually checked ?
Not really.


There is a way to fill them with acetone and look for leaks but you really cannot see far enough inside.
See MUST HAVE Technical Information for DIYers. #14.


The sealing surfaces between the risers and manifolds must be perfectly flat so they'll seal. if they leak internally, you will get water running back into the exhaust valves (that was my problem with mine)

There's a LOT of people that are running without exhaust-shutters. (Volvo has eliminated them altogether)

I don't think shutters will positively prevent water from coming back into the risers and "over the hill" every time but if you do not have them (or they're stuck open) your risk is greater.

Just about any stern drive boat can have a reversion event if the engine is shutoff while underway at speeds well above idle. (DON'T DO THAT!)


When I had my OMC service manual, the only place I could find actual OMC drive model numbers was there. If you don't have one for your engine/drive, you can usually find them on ebay.
 

Joshua Nichols

Lieutenant
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,431
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Hmmm I would think the cone drive king woulda been tougher???

How much do you love this boat??
 

SSLAGH

Cadet
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
12
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

I am neutral on keeping this boat , but afraid that if I buy another used boat , I'll just be buying similar issues that are hidden.
 

skideck2

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2011
Messages
29
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

I think you should start digging in to your engine with the intent of parting her out, that way you'll have everything neatly labeled n out to look at.. eventually you'll find the the path the water took, n can make a more informed decision n it'll probably be cost based. I've learned that you are right, you might just be buying similar issues in another boat, but there's a big difference in being familiar with your own issues and breaking new ground with the knowledge you have gained. knowing what the problem isn't is a good thing in your current boat vs. another, however, i've been "sick and tired "of working on one project and was glad to find another even if it was similar issues. Push on good sir until you dont feel like pushing anymore. Gaskets are cheap, if shes runnin now, your in pretty good shape compared to some, me included as of this weekend, test your risers n while your in there changin gaskets, clear out those water passages!! If she got good n hot, chances are your gasket'll go before anything else! Your oil level might be high because of gas if it doesn't look like choc. milk! Smell it! Could be a stuck choke! Not even related! Good luck
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: 1988 OMC Cobra 7.5L Engine DEAD?

Hmmm I would think the cone drive king woulda been tougher???

This is NOT a "Cone" drive (no cone clutch drives in 1988) There was no cone-clutch drive behind the 460 until 1990 and they dropped the 460 after that.

His drive is a Dog-clutch model.
 
Top