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How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

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  • How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

    I have a roached OMC Leg, Dog Clutch style 1988 vintage, there are no markings or tag left on the leg .

    I want to order the conversion kit to get rid of it.

    The problem is I don't know if this leg is a Cobra or a King Cobra?

    I have pics that someone can use to HOPEFULLY!! identify this ole unit.

    I can't load onto this site , I keep getting a 'File Size to Big " message.

    I could email to anyone that thinks they could help.

    Thanks
    Paul


  • #2
    Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

    Howdy,


    The biggest difference in that year was the King Cobra held 108oz of drive oil.

    They pretty much look physically the same. If you have 2 side by side, the King will appear slightly larger. And they weigh more.

    It was only bolted on the back of a 460.



    Tell us a little more. What boat do you want to convert and what engine is under the hood? What are you converting?


    Regards,


    Rick
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I use xxx oil and have never had a problem........
    This post was created with OpenSuSE x64 Linux!

    Comment



    • #3
      Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

      I have pics that someone can use to HOPEFULLY!! identify this ole unit.
      Your pics probably won't be adequate to determine what it is since they all pretty much look the same from a "distance".

      One sure way to do it though..... stand it up, use the top dipstick to ensure it's full (add some light oil.....30wt etc to get it on the "stick")...........then drain the oil and measure how much came out. if it holds 108oz of oil (a little over 3 Quarts of oil.... 3.375 to be exact) you have a "King" Kobra!! DANGER, DANGER, Will Robinson!!!!!


      If it holds 64oz or less (2 quarts or less) it's NOT a "King" Cobra.......assuming it's a 1987-1989 "Dog" .........they called a LOT of them "King" (sic) in the 90's......

      Caveat Empty.........if it's already empty....then pump it in the middle "fill" hole to get the right amount in there.....If you pump it in the bottom you'll trap a bubble and it might not take the full 3+ qts.


      This method...."Works good and lasts a long time"


      Photos not required!


      Cheers,


      Rick
      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      I use xxx oil and have never had a problem........
      This post was created with OpenSuSE x64 Linux!

      Comment



      • #4
        Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

        easist way I know is look at the shift cable. the cone clutch king had the shift cable on the port side about the middle of the upper case.
        the dog clutch had the cable rather low on the upper case on the stbd side.
        cone clutch models can be expensive to repair. the dog clutch models not so bad.
        both were badged as king cobras over the years.
        no tech questions by PM, they wont get answered.
        you have to be trusted by the people that you lie to .

        Comment



        • #5
          Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

          1st off , THANK YOU ALL ! for the quick and helpful responses.

          I am going to try the Oil ID method tonite.
          I need to know what I have so I can get a plan together to hopefully changeout the entire leg to something more reliable and liked by the masses for future sale.
          The boat is a 1988 Bayliner 2655 Cierra with a 460 Motor, I am hoping that I have just a Cobra Leg because there is conversion kits available for them.

          I have a complete Volvo Penta DP-S Drive that I bought last year and it is in great shape.

          There is OMC to Volvo Penta Conversion Kits available from places like "MarinePartsExpress" and "Boats Unlimited"
          The biggest item is the Transom Shield part #385377 for fitting onto my Transom Shield assembly cost is about $750.00

          If I have a King Cobra the cost and work goes up substantially, apparantly I need a complete transom assembly part 3868844 and this unit starts at around $2800.00

          There is a company that is now offering a Conversion Kit for OMC Cobra 1986 to 1993 to convert to Mercuiser Alpha 1 and the price is cheap around $350.00 plus the new leg of course (Alpha 1 type)
          Trouble is they say the 460 has to much torque for the Alpha 1 leg, to bad this route may have worked well.
          Has anyone out there tried this new conversion kit?
          Looks simple, one big headache is removed with the water pump in the leg of the Alpha 1 which is the same as the Cobra.
          Kit is made by "Sterndrive Enginerring" web site is www.sterndrive.cc

          Anyhow I am keping my fingers crossed I got the regular Cobra leg....

          Thanks everyone
          Paul

          Comment



          • #6
            Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

            Pretty good chance it is a King with that 460 engine..
            OMC done some crazy stuff so who knows...
            sigpic

            1981 ChrisCraft 210 Scorpion K,175 Johnson SeaHorse

            Comment



            • #7
              Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

              Well,

              It appears that you are talking about the "SEI/Cobra conversion".

              If that's true, you will not be able to "convert" it. I would be willing to bet that they'll not only suggest against it but they will not warranty their drive behind a 460......

              Also, transom assembly as you indicated may be different enough that it's possible that nothing will fit if you try it.

              If that drive was indeed behind a 1988 460, chances are it is the "Dog-clutch" drive that holds 108oz.


              You may have to consider the expensive Volvo route or do what I did and find a Merc 454/Bravo setup from a donor boat.....

              Doing the Volvo will require you to find either exhaust manifolds or a coupler that are no longer easily available. having said that, I believe there's a company in Canada that will machine your flywheel to accept a newer Volvo coupler and I think there's a company that can make adapters that will allow you put install BBC exhaust manifolds and risers.

              But after spending money on the transom shield for the Volvo drive, and the other "Franken-Boat" stuff you may have more money in it than it's worth by the time you're done. With no re-sale value at all.....


              Good luck!


              Rick
              ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
              I use xxx oil and have never had a problem........
              This post was created with OpenSuSE x64 Linux!

              Comment



              • #8
                Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

                Very good point and well put HT32BSX115
                sigpic

                1981 ChrisCraft 210 Scorpion K,175 Johnson SeaHorse

                Comment



                • #9
                  Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

                  Well she holds 108oz so I guess I have the King Cobra.

                  Sounds like my only real option is to try to find another GOOD ONE.

                  If anyone has any suggestions on where I may find a good used /rebuilt OMC King Cobra Dog Style Clutch for my 1988 Bayliner with the 460 power ,please let me know.

                  Comment



                  • #10
                    Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

                    Ebay, Craigslist, and yard sales are about your only choice. Even if you find a good drive (highly doubtful) so many things on the 460 engine are NLA. Like the coupler and gear sets for the outdrive. Unless you own a machine shop and can one-off machine anything you want you have nothing.
                    Don't waste anymore money on it. The 460 hasn't been used by anyone for about a million years and drive parts are worse.
                    Punt before you get in any deeper.
                    Don S.

                    sigpic

                    Please, no PM's (Private Messages) regarding boat/engine problems.
                    That is what the forums are for.
                    Only forum/moderator issues will be answered in PM's.

                    Comment



                    • #11
                      Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

                      In reality, you have NO real good alternatives...

                      As I said above, there's ways to make the coupler and manifolds work but you have an additional problem. You need a drive.

                      To get that drive rebuilt, you would need to spend a minimum of $2000 and probably much more to get it done and there are parts (namely the vertical drive shaft) that no one makes at any price......

                      THEN you have the problem of the manifolds, risers, and coupler.

                      ANY one of those components are complete show stoppers.

                      And if you blow a coupler, you have to remove the engine to replace it. (did I say that coupler is not available?)


                      Last summer I sold my previously removed King Cobra drive for $1450. I shipped it to a guy (who paid the shipping) on the east coast and I included the used exhaust manifolds, risers, trim cyls, OEM OMC service manual, and some other assoc parts.

                      The guy was willing to pay that much for the (sight unseen, shipped from the west coast) drive all by itself. He told me that he had been looking for a used drive for quite some time.

                      They are very scarce.


                      Your best bet will be to cut your losses now since you need the drive and WILL need the other stuff later if not sooner. It's just not worth it to replace the drive, and later replace the normal wear items (manifolds, risers etc.) even if you could get them.

                      OMC only made the Dog-clutch King Cobra from 87-89. And they offered the 460 from 87-90 or so.....replacing it with the 454 when the Cone Clutch Cobra was released.

                      The after market did not pick up the critical parts when OMC went out of business.

                      There was nothing really wrong with the 460.....but there are simply not enough of them out there to make it feasible to make those normal wear parts.....


                      You could scrounge a drive, used manifolds, etc to make it work, but used 87-89 King-Dogs are getting expensive and scarce



                      Sorry about that.....


                      Rick
                      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                      I use xxx oil and have never had a problem........
                      This post was created with OpenSuSE x64 Linux!

                      Comment



                      • #12
                        Re: How do you identify Cobra from King Cobra 1988?

                        I guess I didn't clarify, I have a good Volvo Penta DP-S Drive with props that I aquired last year off a burnt boat (no leg damage) it had a big block and the boat was about the same size as my 26ft Bayliner.

                        I found a write up of a person who did the conversion using the exisitng 460 King Cobra power , he swapped out the old King Cobra Leg for a Volvo Penta DP-S . There was defiinitely some issues like mounting the water pump , new shift cable but judging from the write up it sure looked doable.

                        Looking back at some old post it sounds like it might have been Don? one of the moderators of this forum that actually did the conversion for a customer of his.

                        Don, if you happen to read this and you are the one , I would like to ask you how you changed the shift cable routing ? The picture in the write up shows the shift cable now coming thru the lower bellows ready to mate to the Penta Leg. The old (original) shift cable does not run like this rather it has its own dedicated hole thru the existing transom shield.

                        The boat that ws converted was a Bayliner 2858 but the year of the drive isn't given , maybe its different than mine.

                        Comment

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