power connections on merc 50 pull start?

pyro225

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im swapping a merc 50 pull start onto a boat that did have a merc with electric start. ive looked all over the outboard and cant find any obvious points to connect the battery charging wireS? any ideas?
 

Texasmark

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A lot of times the starting solenoid high current input terminal is used as a terminal post for connecting the + lead from the battery and sending current through the solenoid for starting, connecting auxillary wiring including 12v distribution, and receiving battery charging voltage from the rectifier/regulator, of just rectifier if it has no regulator.

Mark
 
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GA_Boater

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What serial number is the motor? It may or may not have a charging circuit.
 

pyro225

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i will check and let you know... of to hasn't got one how hard is it to add?
 

Texasmark

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i will check and let you know... of to hasn't got one how hard is it to add?

Got to have a generator of some sort. Some OB engines of varying makes had belt drives. Later model Mercs for one had alternator coils around the flywheel which contained magnets. Two wires coming from the "stator" connected to a full wave bridge rectifier module that sometimes contained a voltage regulator also. The modules are a no brainer, about 1 1/2" roughly square and half as thick. The "generator" portion could get more complicated unless you found used parts from a similar engine which contained one.

Mark
 

GA_Boater

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It's important to get the serial number, pyro. If the motor is pull start only, it doesn't need a stator or charging circuit to charge a starting battery. Also if it has a magneto ignition system, it doesn't need a battery. The serial number will ID a starting place to find parts diagrams to figure out if you can or how to add what's needed.
 
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Texasmark

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If the motor is pull start only, it doesn't need a stator or charging circuit to charge a starting battery.

Interesting. Care to elaborate on that? I can remember back in the 60's (only reference I have) my FIL had a 40 Rude electric start with no gen and you had to manually charge the battery after several outings.
 

GA_Boater

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Pull start only has no electric starter and no need for a battery or charging circuit. Merc made them three ways - Pull start only, electric start only and with both a permanent pull starter and a starter motor. Mine is electric start motor with an emergency pull start rope, but you have to remove all covers to use the rope. If I wanted to, I could use the rope and toss the battery and starter motor because the magneto doesn't need external juice.

Again a serial number helps.
 

K-2

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Many off road only motorcycles are the same way, no charging system. For instance a moto cross bike, no battery, no lights, no need for a charging system.
 

pyro225

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hi guys sorry still no number yet as its not at home will have it saturday - i know someone id'd it before as an 1981 mercy blue band, it has the thunderbolt ignition and cdi unit and coil packs if any help
 

Texasmark

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Pull start only has no electric starter and no need for a battery or charging circuit.

I thought we were addressing a battery charging mechanism of some sort to be used by Pyro225 on his engine. Since he said he is installing a pull start engine then one would think that there is no charging mechanism on the engine. However, as I recall there are engines, including engines fitting the "fishing motor" category, that do have a 9 amp. non-regulated supply which is used for charging a battery on non-electric starting engines for the purpose of operating running lights and other low current devices. Since he apparently can't find any wiring to support the latter then one can only assume that this particular engine has no generator/alternator and is not setup for battery charging. So he would need a generator/alternator installation to which he could connect his wiring in question.

Mark
 

GA_Boater

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We are Texasmark, but we need a starting place. I guessed and looked at some diagrams and there are two different stators used in the ones I looked at - An electric start stator (the 9 amp you mentioned) or a pull start stator. The other thing is the cable is plugged into the side of the lower cowl. E-starters have a connector for boat-side battery and pull starts have a blanking plug in place of the connector so all the stator does is power the internal ignition stuff - Probably very low power. It may have provisions to power lights, but at this point it's all guesses.

Since pyro gave a rough estimation of the year, it eliminates the magneto comments I made earlier because the mag was used in earlier motors.
 

Texasmark

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Okaye, moving right along since we got ice and then snow last night and I am stuck in the "cabin". Total belligerence here, but here goes anyway: If we got beyond the magneto in year models and into the CDIs then yes we have a stator and yes we have a rectifier to power them. Therefore all Mr. Pyro has to do is find the rectifier module and follow the red wire to it's termination.....probably the starting solenoid high current input terminal, where he can get the voltage he is looking for. Going to guess the wires from the stator are 2 ea. yellow. Course the CDIs will need triggers also so there will be another pair of wires for that from a different set of coils under the flywheel.

Mr. Pyro, the stator will be under the flywheel so look for wires coming out from under it. Follow to the rectifier module and follow the red to your connecting terminal.

Mark
 
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pyro225

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Hi all all I can find are wires going to the Cdi unit - and no solenoid as its pull start? Model no is 9248364 made in Belgium

Cheers
 

GA_Boater

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Pyro - Is the number a model number or serial number? Any chance of some pics of the motor?
 

pyro225

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Sure:

DSC02759.jpg

81545BD5-5367-4CE0-A4B1-F9ED5A843DDD.jpg
[
BD063232-6132-48E5-A66A-68373E5147FF.jpg


Also quick side note - the engine stop button is not connected to anything where should it be connected? the only way i can stop it is by over choking it...

Thanks
 

emckelvy

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Better check the wiring coming out of the stator for (2) yellow wires. They may not be there! I looked up the motor by Ser # and there is a unique stator for manual-start models. How 'bout that!

A pic of the Starboard side of the motor, without top hat or cowling wrap-a-round would help. A rectifier, if present, would be attached to the Stbd side of the front cowling support bracket. On electric-start models, the starter solenoid is mounted directly above the rectifier.

BTW, the kill wire on ADI models is typically a black wire with either a yellow or white stripe. It'll be connected to the Forward side of the switchbox (at least that's where it was on the last 50 I looked at - just a few weeks ago!).

The switchbox has markings for all the wire colors so you should at least be able to trace it back using that, if the wire is missing/disconnected. That terminal is connected to ground via kill switch, to kill spark. Switch is open to run.

HTH...........ed
 

pyro225

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Cheers Ed,

I checked the stator wires definitely no yellow ones... does that indicate there is no way to trickle charge from it? is choking it to stop it bad? will try and connect button later
 

Texasmark

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Hi all all I can find are wires going to the Cdi unit - and no solenoid as its pull start? Model no is 9248364 made in Belgium

Cheers
Okaye.......is there a red wire going to the CDIs? If so they should join with each other and go somewhere.....where?
 

GA_Boater

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I can't come up with anything based on the serial number, pyro. This is the closest I can get for a wiring diagram. http://www.maxrules.com/oldmercs/Wiring/1966ona/500_76_78rope.jpg

If your motor is wired the same way, without adding a different stator, rectifier and wiring, you can't charge a battery. The pull start stator only supplies enough power for the switch box.

For comparison, here is the electric start diagram for the same models, it's a lot different. http://www.maxrules.com/oldmercs/Wiring/1966ona/500_76_78eL.jpg
 
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