2 engines same price, what to buy?

[cablerum]

So I am in the process of purchasing a new fishing boat. I can have the boat with a Mercury 40hp EFI 4 stroke or a 50hp 2 stroke for the same price. So I know the 50hp 2 stroke will be faster out of the hole & a few mph faster top end, but the 40hp 4 stoke will be easier starting with the EFI & better on fuel. Both engines weigh about the same, I think the 4 stroke was 12lbs heavier. I don't care about which one is quieter, as far as I'm concerned both at WOT are loud.

When it comes it maintenance, the 4 stroke will need oil changes but the 2 stroke has a carb to deal with, so one out weighs the other in my opinion. Most maintenace is standard regardless of 2 or 4 stroke. I would also think the oil changes are actually cheaper then all the 2 stroke oil I would burn?????

So, I'm just looking for some input. What would you pick & why? Do you have experience with either engine good or bad? Any points to make besides what I said above? Agree or disagree with me as right now I'm leaning towards the 40 4 stroke based on EFI & technology. However I've always had 2 strokes & my Yamaha 8hp 2 stroke is the best little engine I could ask for.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Gomer50]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

This is a tough one,I for one choose the 2 stroke easier to work on.But I dont know to much concerning efi boat motors.Diagnosing my truck with the efi is sometimes a real pain.I also live in an area where its getting tougher to run an older 2 stroke on some of the lakes (California/Arizona).So a 4 stroke efi would probably be a better choice.All motors will fail if not properly maintained.This would be a personal preference call.

 

[Texasmark]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

4 strokes cam about to solve the EPA efficiency/pollution mess. Back in the '60's a company marketed a 4 stroke with the name Homelite in the 55 and 85 hp classes. Nice quiet engines, but the brand never caught on...had a friend with a 55 and drove it once. Real nice on a 15' boat.

Don't get hung up on carbs on 2 cycle engines. Run Sea Foam in your fuel and forget it. I'd take the 2 cycle in a heartbeat plus I get 20% more hp for the same weight and price....whadda deal, and I don't have to fool around with oil changes and valve tappet adjustments, drive belt replacements and all that crap.

My opinion. You asked for it. Others will give you theirs.

Mark

 

[mrallen007]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

Good question... My two cents...

In a lot of ways you're looking at 6 one way and a half dozen the other. The two strokes have been on the water for a long time with a good track record. Though the carbs seem scary to deal with (at least they are to me), it is still probably the easier motor to work on. The EFI motors are nice and I would probably lean toward that if not for the reduced horsepower.

All other things being equal (manufacturer, year model, quality, yada yada yada), I'd take the 2 stroke mainly because of the extra horsepower. I have a 50 HP Merc 2 stroke and I wouldn't trade it for an EFI 40.

 

[MTboatguy]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

Although I see a day, when the Two stroker's will go away, I would still take the 2 stroke over the 4 stroke at this time, more HP and easier to work on, no need for oil changes as well all of the the other stuff that comes along with trying to be green.

Good luck in your choice.

 

[cablerum]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

Thanks everyone for your thoughts so far. I'll add something else to my question. All of my previous 2 stroke outboards have been pre-mix, but the new engine in question is oil injected. Some motors/manufacturers do this with success, others have failed (Johnson/Evinrude VRO). How have the oil injection pumps established their reputation for the 50hp Mercury? Is there a sensor or safety in place that would shut the engine down should the pump fail? I guess another thing I'm looking for is long term reliability.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

How have the oil injection pumps established their reputation for the 50hp Mercury? Is there a sensor or safety in place that would shut the engine down should the pump fail?

The bottom mounted oil pumps rarely fail thats the reason the pump rotation is not monitored an no safety shut down. I myself would lean toward the 2 stroke due to: less maintenance, easier to work on,dealer will likely have parts in stock for 2 stoke vs 4 stroke if warranty issues arise. But the 4 stroke can be better adapted to the E15 fuel that is coming as the carb engines will have a hard time with it...

 

[mrallen007]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

In my experience with Mercury, their oil injected two strokes are very reliable. That's exactly what I'm running now, a 1991 Merc 50 HP oil injected 2 stroke. There is usually a low oil alarm built in, but no shut down that I'm aware of. The only common issue they seem to have is that sensor often goes bad and sounds the alarm constantly. Most people I know fix it the way I did. I unplugged it. All that means is I eyeball the oil level and keep extra onboard just in case rather than relying on the engine to tell me.

 

[cablerum]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

But the 4 stroke can be better adapted to the E15 fuel that is coming as the carb engines will have a hard time with it...

The 2 stroke seems to be the winning vote among most, & I agree that for performance & maintenance it is clearly the choice. However this point above made by Faztbullet is interesting & something I have not thought of. I mean, new fuel injected computer controlled car engines can now have up to E85 in some cases. We all know E15 is coming at some point. With the EFI 4 stroke it may just adapt or worst case have to have new software programming. As for the carb versions maybe it could turn into a problem. Has anyone tried or heard of 2 stroke carb outboards running higher then E10? If so, what was the result? Thanks again!

 

[mrallen007]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

I cannot speak specifically for the effects on the carbs but I can say that E10 has certainly made an impression on my motor. I recently had to rebuild my fuel pump because of deposits I found that were gunking it up. The consensus of most I've talked to is that the ethanol in the fuel was eating my fuel lines from the inside out and depositing the crumbs further down the fuel system. It gunked up my fuel pump and started to get into the fuel filter. It stands to reason that could ultimately get into the carbs. So, from the perspective of fuel delivery up to the point of the carbs, I know there are issues. Unfortunately my motor has not been in use since the boat is now being restored and I don't have enough experience running it to know the direct impact of the ethanol on the carbs themselves.

However, all that said, the consensus also seems to be that replacing the affected parts and moving forward with a quality fuel treatment for ethanol should eliminate future problems. That?s the understanding I?m going under. If anyone knows that to be incorrect, please chime in.

 

[cablerum]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

I'm also wondering if the newer technology (4 stroke EFI) can handle the ethanol better since they are being designed in the day of our existing fuel, whereas the 2 stroke was designed back when we have higher quality non-ethanol gas. Maybe the fuel pumps, lines & other components of the more modern engine can better withstand the effects of ethanol?? And maybe not...

You would think all manufactures this day & age understanding our current gas quality would make their products able to stand up to ethanol.

 

[mrallen007]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

You would think all manufactures this day & age understanding our current gas quality would make their products able to stand up to ethanol.

You'd think so, but many engine manufacturers have not been able to keep up to the damaging properties of Ethanol. I understand Briggs and Stratton have filed suit against the government in an attemp to halt any higher concentrations of Ethanol. I've not confirmed that, but I hear it from some credible sources. Many seem to be trying to hold back that wave to give themselves more time to catch up and make changes to their technologies.

 

[cablerum]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

Maybe I'll just buy a couple good paddles & an extra battery for the trolling motor. It's never easy deciding!

 

[mrallen007]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

Considering my experience so far, I'd buy the 50, use the 40 as a kicker motor, get a new battery for the trolling motor, get another battery to back up that battery, get a few good oars, some flippers, a snorkel, and a cell phone to call for help when all that fails... Been a Murphy's Law kind of season...

 

[CharlieB]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

If you REALLY want to screw up anything, put a computer in it!

EFI high pressure fuel pumps die, the vapor canister that the pump is in clogs up, injector screens clog up. Electrical problems happen.

You can clean a carb and rebuild a fuel pump.

NO contest.

If and when E15 comes about you can change the main jet(s), open the idle mixture needle a little, or change it to a smaller taper needle.

 

[cablerum]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

If you REALLY want to screw up anything, put a computer in it!

EFI high pressure fuel pumps die, the vapor canister that the pump is in clogs up, injector screens clog up. Electrical problems happen.

You can clean a carb and rebuild a fuel pump.

NO contest.

If and when E15 comes about you can change the main jet(s), open the idle mixture needle a little, or change it to a smaller taper needle.

You make a good point & strong arguement. The more advanced something is, extra toys, bells & whistles, it's all great when it is working properly, but it also adds more things to fail. Could turn into more headache then it's worth. Maybe I should just follow the "keep it simple" rule. If only this 2 stoke 50hp was a DI motor like the larger Mercury 2 strokes I would not of thought twice about this decision.

 

[57crestliner]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

2005 Merc 40 2-stroke. Light, and on my boat, fast enough.32 mph gps 4 season boat, btw

 

[Jeep Man]

Re: 2 engines same price, what to buy?

I lean the other way. I'll take the 4 stroke any day of the week. My previous motor was a 2 stroke and I have to say I don't miss the exhaust smell. When I fish I troll a lot. Choking on the fumes all day was not fun. The 4 stroke is a miser on gas and starts with the first click of the key. The 2 stroke was faster but I'll take clean and quiet thank you. If you will be doing your own repairs the 2 stroke is simpler but if your having a shop do it, then what's the difference. In my case, it's just a learning curve until I'm up to speed on the technology.