Winterizing - Antifreeze

[H20Rat]

The manifold drains are most likely plastic thumbscrews, either blue or black. Should be physically higher up than the block drains.

 

[stonyloam]

How did I trash my impeller and exhaust shutters? I did flush and fog as well.

You ran your impeller "dry" which will ruin it in about 30 seconds, especially with uncooled exhaust blowing past it. Without water to cool and lubricate the impeller the ends that contact the inside of the housing they will "burn" ruin the seal, so that the impeller will not pump enough water to cool the engine. The uncooled exhaust will quickly cause the rubber on the shutters to blister and burn, result is that the metal and rubber will separate and they will fail. It would be wise to check both and plan on replacing the impeller.

 

[gt2003]

Ok, I've got the "single point drain system' and heard horror stories. So I'm trying to get this straight before I make the leap to winterize (gonna be low 80's this weekend so have to ski one more time). I will drain the water in the block as it says. Once the motor is drained of the water then I can close the drain system and introduce the propylene glycol through the blue plug at the front top of the motor until it's full. Will that get the block and the manifolds? I figured I'd leave the antifreeze in the block for maybe 10 minutes or so, allowing it to mix well with any residual water remaining in there. Then I'll drain the antifreeze and leave it "dry" for the winter. Provided I drain the system of water before adding the antifreeze, will my engine be protected?


Random thought, should I start introducing the antifreeze with the drain system open then close it once bright pink antifreeze starts coming out?

 

[stonyloam]

Once you drain the water from the engine and manifolds you may do anything you like with the antifreeze. If properly drained there will not be enough water left in the block to cause any damage.

 

[jayhanig]

There are a few points to ALWAYS REMEMBER.

1. evidence of anti-freeze coming out of the exhaust ports is NOT evidence of an OPEN T-stat!

2. The T-stat, with the engine running on "muffs" is NOT usually fully OPEN. So you CANNOT ENSURE the AF mixture is safe from freezing!

3. Notice the last step is pull the plugs and DRAIN!

REGARDLESS of what you do, if you ALWAYS pull ALL plugs and hoses, etc to drain all the "low" spots that pool water, YOU"RE "GOOD"

Air doesn't freeze.


(OTOH If you have CLOSED COOLING, you can use the "MUFF/AF" method.......but it's just as easy to simply drain the heat exchanger.....)

Since I always use Salt Terminator as part of my flush routine after running in the sound, I am accustomed to warming the engine with fresh water via the muffs up to its normal 175 degrees temp before opening the valve on the Salt Terminator. In this case, why wouldn't that method effectively get the antifreeze where it needs to go throughout my system, using antifreeze instead of the Salt Terminator?

My 3.0 liter GM Mercruiser has a convenience rod attached to two quick release hoses. Assuming I flush with 5 gallons of pink antifreeze once I get up to 175 degrees start fogging the carburetor when the 5 gallons is about half in... causing it to choke out just before the antifreeze runs dry, then drain those two hoses (whew... what a sentence): am I good to go? I can pull the top off the thermostat housing if need be. The gaskets are cheap enough to replace.

 

[Starcraft5834]

Once you drain the water from the engine and manifolds you may do anything you like with the antifreeze. If properly drained there will not be enough water left in the block to cause any damage.

Well said...getting all water out is not likely...what ever might be left will hurt nothing....

 

[Scott Danforth]

Since I always use Salt Terminator as part of my flush routine after running in the sound, I am accustomed to warming the engine with fresh water via the muffs up to its normal 175 degrees temp before opening the valve on the Salt Terminator. In this case, why wouldn't that method effectively get the antifreeze where it needs to go throughout my system, using antifreeze instead of the Salt Terminator?

My 3.0 liter GM Mercruiser has a convenience rod attached to two quick release hoses. Assuming I flush with 5 gallons of pink antifreeze once I get up to 175 degrees start fogging the carburetor when the 5 gallons is about half in... causing it to choke out just before the antifreeze runs dry, then drain those two hoses (whew... what a sentence): am I good to go? I can pull the top off the thermostat housing if need be. The gaskets are cheap enough to replace.

the reason it wont work, is that the antifreeze you want to introduce is below your 175 degrees. and as soon as it hits the thermostat, the thermostat slams shut bypassing the block and the antifreeze goes straight out the exhaust. just like your salt terminator is doing.

 

[thumpar]

Since I always use Salt Terminator as part of my flush routine after running in the sound, I am accustomed to warming the engine with fresh water via the muffs up to its normal 175 degrees temp before opening the valve on the Salt Terminator. In this case, why wouldn't that method effectively get the antifreeze where it needs to go throughout my system, using antifreeze instead of the Salt Terminator?

My 3.0 liter GM Mercruiser has a convenience rod attached to two quick release hoses. Assuming I flush with 5 gallons of pink antifreeze once I get up to 175 degrees start fogging the carburetor when the 5 gallons is about half in... causing it to choke out just before the antifreeze runs dry, then drain those two hoses (whew... what a sentence): am I good to go? I can pull the top off the thermostat housing if need be. The gaskets are cheap enough to replace.

You need to understand that most of the water (or antifreeze, salt terminator, etc.) going in through the muffs goes out the exhaust bypassing the engine. The engine fills from the bottom up. The thermostat even when open is a pretty small passage.

 

[tpenfield]

the reason it wont work, is that the antifreeze you want to introduce is below your 175 degrees. and as soon as it hits the thermostat, the thermostat slams shut bypassing the block and the antifreeze goes straight out the exhaust. just like your salt terminator is doing.

The same could be said for the regular lake or sea water as that gets introduced to the engine in its original cold state. But it does not work that way, for if it did the thermostat would never open, rather, it gets heated by the engine first then goes to the thermostat.

 

[mr300z87]

I would like to add that the drain plugs should be put back in after draining. I made the mistake of leaving them out 2 seasons ago and when I went to re install them the threads had corroded some and it was a fight to reinstall them. I actually had to run a tap in both the block and manifold drains before I could get the plugs in. A15 min job turned in a 2 hour battle. I then read in the one of the Mercruiser engine manuals to re install the plugs before winter storage to prevent this. I boat in salt water so I am sure this does not help. Btw I just drain the block, manifolds and all hoses and call it done. No messing with antifreeze. Air don't freeze!!!!!!!

 

[jayhanig]

the reason it wont work, is that the antifreeze you want to introduce is below your 175 degrees. and as soon as it hits the thermostat, the thermostat slams shut bypassing the block and the antifreeze goes straight out the exhaust. just like your salt terminator is doing.

That makes no sense to me. How does the thermostat open when the water from the sound hits it? It would have to be scalding hot for that to be true. I believe the swimmers and skiers would complain were that true.

 

[Lou C]

Many years experience winterizing in a salt water region...here's my advice:
1) the reason why you should not use the suck the AF up the drive method, is that the raw water will go right out the exhaust manifolds, till the engine completely warms up. Then when the 'stat opens, the hot water in the engine, will also exit through the stat housing. BUT, the stat is cycling so that its not open all the way, all that long. So there is no garantee that it will stay open long enough for all the raw water to exit the block, and for it to be replaced by AF. So you really don't know what mix of AF you have, unless you take a sample out of the block drains.
2) My way which is also the same as stated in both OMC and Merc factory manuals, is to add AF manually AFTER FULLY draining the engine, manifolds and raw water intake hose. I poke all the drains and point that hose down in the blige, to make sure I got as much water as possible out. Remove the lower end of the big hose that goes from the stat housing to the front circulating pump, that holds a lot of water too.
3) I replace the drain plugs after coating the threads with OMC gasket sealer, this keeps the threads from corroding. My plugs come right out even after the engine has sat with salt water in it all season. Do not leave them out, the threads are raw cast iron and they will rust.
4) adding AF: I reconnect the bottom end of the big hose from the circ pump and disconnect the top end at the 'stat housing. Put a funnel in it and start filling the hose till AF runs out the stat housing neck. Engine is now filled
Do the same with each manifold, till you hear AF run out on the ground (why you must use no tox marine stuff). Fill the raw water intake hose till AF runs out the drive water intakes.

I use -100 because it has much more PG in it and the others, start to get slushy/hard at at 10*(-50) and 0 (-60). Never had a problem and my engine inside does not have a lot of flaking rust. You can just drain, but raw cast iron rusts and then the rust starts to clog the smaller passages between the block and heads. You can tell because then you get chronic overheating even when the rest of the cooling system is fine. GM designed these engines not to be run on raw water but on EG antifreeze with corrosion inhibitors. So do what you want, but this way will lead to the longest engine life. Or else OMC and Merc would not bother to put it in their manuals.

 

[JimS123]

the reason it wont work, is that the antifreeze you want to introduce is below your 175 degrees. and as soon as it hits the thermostat, the thermostat slams shut bypassing the block and the antifreeze goes straight out the exhaust. just like your salt terminator is doing.

If you're on the muffs using city water, and if you store the jugs of AF on a shelf in the garage, when the AF hits the TS it will be much warmer than the water you sent thru just before it.

 

[tpenfield]

Water goes through the engine block first . . . otherwise all of your input sources (sea, lake, hose, AF jug, etc) would keep the TS closed on a warm/hot engine, since they are well below typical TS activation ranges.

Key problem, as I see it, with an exclusive AF approach is the mixing/dilution process and the by-pass to the exhaust elbows.

So, if you start off with a warmed engine with 2 gallons of water in the block and a gallon of water in each exhaust manifold - 4 gallons total. Then the OP ran about 4 gallons into the engine . . . He might only have a '50/50' mixture of water and AF throughout the engine and certainly not evenly mixed.