coil resistor

sti1471

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I have a 1984 Mercruiser 3.0L with the Delco dist. The coil I had on there was a spare i had and the engine seemed to run fine. However i was walking through a "flee market" style warehouse the other day and saw a new coil in a napa box. The coil on the boat is old and dirty and I thought why not buy it. On the coil it says "no external resistor required". The question is what does that mean? Does that mean that I no longer need the resistor wire the manual refers to? Does this coil have a built in resistor wire? if I leave the resistor wire on the boat and run this coil, is it bad to run the coil with a resistor wire when it it says no external resistor required?

To be honest I am not even sure what the resistor wire is or where it is located. All I see on my setup is that I have 1 purple (connected to choke) and 1 black wire (screwed to choke bottom) on the carb. and they run behind the shift bracket. Then on my coil I have 1 black wire coming from the Dist connected to a gray wire coming from the wire harness that is connected to one side of the coil. Then I have 1 purple/yellow wire, and 1 maroon(red) wire connected to the other side of the coil. Are any of these wires the resistance wire?
 

philbullet

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I just did this,By pass purple/yellow wire and run another from a constant 12v. suply while ignition key in on run position.
 

alldodge

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I have a 1984 Mercruiser 3.0L with the Delco dist. The coil I had on there was a spare i had and the engine seemed to run fine. However i was walking through a "flee market" style warehouse the other day and saw a new coil in a napa box. The coil on the boat is old and dirty and I thought why not buy it. On the coil it says "no external resistor required". The question is what does that mean? Does that mean that I no longer need the resistor wire the manual refers to? Does this coil have a built in resistor wire? if I leave the resistor wire on the boat and run this coil, is it bad to run the coil with a resistor wire when it it says no external resistor required?

To be honest I am not even sure what the resistor wire is or where it is located. All I see on my setup is that I have 1 purple (connected to choke) and 1 black wire (screwed to choke bottom) on the carb. and they run behind the shift bracket. Then on my coil I have 1 black wire coming from the Dist connected to a gray wire coming from the wire harness that is connected to one side of the coil. Then I have 1 purple/yellow wire, and 1 maroon(red) wire connected to the other side of the coil. Are any of these wires the resistance wire?

If you have points then you "need" an external resistor to keep from burning up the coil and the points. The points distributer uses 12V to start and about 7 volts to run on. Coils that do not need or use an external resister (ballast resister) are electronic and will start and run using 12V. The current is not high because of the circuitry in the system.

In short, if you have points you need a bassist resister (an actual resister or one contained within a wire)
If you have an electronic distributer you do not need or want a ballast resister
 

sti1471

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So running this coil (no external resistor required) connected up using the external resistor wire is fine? is there a problem running this coil WITH the resister wire hooked up to it?
 

alldodge

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So running this coil (no external resistor required) connected up using the external resistor wire is fine?

No, current is reduced and so is voltage

is there a problem running this coil WITH the resister wire hooked up to it?

Do not do it

Everything on a designed system is there for a reason. Do not use a 12V coil on a points system nor use a ballast required coil on a non-12 system. While you may be able to run and it may even work for a while, you can cause other issues. If you want to use the coil, change to a non-points Delco EST distributer. If you do not plan to change, then sell it on ebay or craigs list
 

achris

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The 'new' coil you bought has an internal resistance to bring the actual voltage and current down when full 12v is applied. If you use that coil with an external resistor, the coil will not produce a sufficient spark. If you want to use that coil, you need to remove the external resistance, be it a wire or an actual resistor. As you bought it at a 'fleece market', you're stuck with it, but if you really want a spare coil, get a normal coil designed to be used with an external resistor.
 

sti1471

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OK so what I am gathering from achris is that this coil has an internal resistor. So I CAN use this coil on my boat, but I need to remove the factory resistor wire?

The other coil was working fine, but this one was clean and new and cost $4.00. So if there are any thoughts that using this coil on the boat in any configuration (with or without the external resistor wire) with points can make the boat run worse or damage anything then I can switch back to the other coil.

which wire is the External resistor wire on my boat? I hear about the wire, but I have never been sure exactly which wire it is.
 

Fishermark

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Do not use it with your points. If you replace the points with something like the Pertronix system you can use it, but not with the points.
 

sti1471

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OK I can put the other coil back on. So again, where is the resistor wire? what color is it and what is the process of testing the wire to see if it is still good or even still on my boat.
 

natemoore

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According to a Pertronix tech rep I corresponded with about this issue, if it's a 3 ohm coil, you don't need a external resistor, whether its points or Pertronix. If it's a 1.5 ohm coil, you need a 1.5 ohm external resistor, or you'll burn out your points/Pertronix. He said 4 amps is the most that points or Pertronix could handle. 12V/3 ohms=4 amps.
 

stonyloam

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OK, as I understand it, you need 3 ohms total resistance in the coil circuit. You can do it one of two ways. A 1.5 ohm resistance wire with a 1.5 ohm coil, or a 3 ohm coil. The advantage of the resistance wire coil is that during starting the resistance wire is bypassed and battery voltage is applied directly to the coil for a hotter spark. Since battery voltage drops because of the current draw by the starter you are better off with your original coil.
 

achris

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OK, as I understand it, you need 3 ohms total resistance in the coil circuit. You can do it one of two ways. A 1.5 ohm resistance wire with a 1.5 ohm coil, or a 3 ohm coil. The advantage of the resistance wire coil is that during starting the resistance wire is bypassed and battery voltage is applied directly to the coil for a hotter spark. Since battery voltage drops because of the current draw by the starter you are better off with your original coil.

And that is the only reason not to use the coil not requiring an external resistor. They work just find on points ignitions, as long as the cranking voltage delivered by the battery doesn't drop too far below 12v... If the voltage drops below about 10v during crank, you may have starting problems, but only because of the lower coil output.

Chris......
 

sti1471

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I have my old coil and my new coil and I ran some bench tests on them today.

I take my multimeter and place the red probe on the + post, and the - probe on the - post.
multimeter set to 200.

Old Coil = 1.5
New coil= 3.1

I then set my multimeter to 200k
I then put the red probe on the + post, and the - probe in the center tower post

Old Coil= 8.5
New Coil= 9.5

I have not done any tests with the multimeter while it is on the boat yet.

However based on these tests results, Natemoore are you saying this coil can be run on my delco distributor with the points and not using the resistor wire?
 

Bondo

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I have not done any tests with the multimeter while it is on the boat yet.

However based on these tests results, Natemoore are you saying this coil can be run on my delco distributor with the points and not using the resistor wire?

Ayuh,.... Power the coil with 12v, 'n if ya get more than 7/ 9v on the (-) terminal, it'll fry the points,....
 

achris

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Sorry Bondo, with a 3.1Ω coil he will not burn the points, and it will still show as full 12v on the + terminal of the coil. The systems are designed to run at about 4A (pulse peak, not including induced current on coil field collapse). So if the coil is 3Ω then that is enough to keep the current down. If he uses the 1.5Ω coil, then he would need the external resistor to bring the TOTAL RESISTANCE in the circuit up to the magic 3Ω. I agree that if the coil is 1.5Ω and there is no external resistor the points will burn (now has 8A in the circuit)....

Chris.......
 

natemoore

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I have my old coil and my new coil and I ran some bench tests on them today.

I take my multimeter and place the red probe on the + post, and the - probe on the - post.
multimeter set to 200.

Old Coil = 1.5
New coil= 3.1

I then set my multimeter to 200k
I then put the red probe on the + post, and the - probe in the center tower post

Old Coil= 8.5
New Coil= 9.5

I have not done any tests with the multimeter while it is on the boat yet.

However based on these tests results, Natemoore are you saying this coil can be run on my delco distributor with the points and not using the resistor wire?


Here's what he wrote:

Pertronix Tech Rep Explanation

It's not acting like a short to ground. What you are seeing is the resister
wire at work in the ignition circuit. The points and Ignitor work in the
same exact way. They take the negative side of the coil on and off ground.
This is easy to explain but is going to be long winded. So here we go:

A resister only works (drops voltage) when it has current drawn
through the resister. So in less you have a something drawing current
through the resister (i.e. the Ignitor or points) you will read 12-volt at
the end of the resister (coil positive in this case). Current gets drawn
through the resister when ever the negative side of the coil goes to ground.
The negative side of the coil goes to ground every time the coil is being
charged up to make spark. Depending on the resistance in the resister and
the resistance of the primary of the coil, well determine how much voltage
you see on coil positive. So, depending on whether the Ignitor or points are
in the open (off ground) or closed (going to ground) it will determine what
type of voltage you see on coil positive.
In your case the Ignitor just happens to be lined up in the closed
position. So, when you connect the Ignitor red wire the circuit is completed
and goes to work. The same would happen if you hooked and unhooked the black
wire. Same should happen if you hooked the Ignitor red wire to battery
positive completely off the coil. In fact you can make the same thing
happens without the Ignitor. Disconnect all the Ignitor wires from the coil
and place a jumper wire from coil negative to ground. Turn your key on and
you will see the same voltage drop. That is because the current is being
pulled through the coil and dropping the voltage across the resister. This
is all normal and shouldn't be worried about.

When ever a resister is in the ignition circuit it must be bypassed with the
Ignitor red wire. Like our figure 3 wiring diagram. So, the Ignitor red wire
goes to the 12-volt side of the resister or in the case of a resister wire
to the location that this wire starts. In a mercurser that would be at the
choke. (See attached wiring diagram)

Now on the coil resistance. It just so happens on 4 cylinder application
the Ignitor and points have the same spec. So, that will make this easy. The
Ignitor and points can only handle 4 amps passing through them or they will
burn out. You can get the 4 amps in a two different ways. One is by using a
combination of resister and resistance in the coil; the other is by just
having the correct amount of resistance built into the coil. One way isn't
really better then the other in my opinion. Some opinions very on this fact.
To only get 4 amps across your ignition system that would require
3.0 ohms. You can figure that out by taking your battery voltage and
dividing your resistance to determine amps. (12V/3.0ohms=4amps). In your
case mercuser used a 1.5 ohm resister wire and a 1.5 ohm coil adding up to
the 3.0 ohms. So, removing the resister and running 12-volt to the 1.5 ohm
coil will cause the ignition (Ignitor or points) to handle 8 amps. Double of
what it can and it will burn out. Race applications are different because of
RPM range and amount of time spent in the charge cycle. Trust me you would
never use it in a 4 cylinder boat application.


I hope this answers your question. In short you should be placing the
Ignitor red wire on the incoming side of the resister wire at the choke. And
you can't remove the resister in less you change the coil to a 3.0 ohm coil
or you will burn out your ignition.
 

sti1471

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So when I have this new coil installed on the boat and the boat is started, is there a way with the multimeter to test and make sure the ohms / voltage is where it should be for my engine? Or since it read 3.1 on the bench test should I just trust that it is working correctly once install (with resistor wire bypassed)
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
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May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
So when I have this new coil installed on the boat and the boat is started, is there a way with the multimeter to test and make sure the ohms / voltage is where it should be for my engine? Or since it read 3.1 on the bench test should I just trust that it is working correctly once install (with resistor wire bypassed)

If it reads 3.1Ω on the bench, just run with that. Because the system uses coils and condensers, without a very thorough understand of electronic theory and a very good oscilloscope there isn't an easy way of checking the current passing through the points. Just remember I=V/R, so with 12 volts and 3Ω, you have that magic number, 4A....
 

old islander

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I may not be the brightest bulb in the fixture....but if the whole problem was your old coil was working fine and your problem with it was it's dirty and ugly....why don't you just take it out, clean it off, give it a coat of fresh paint and save yourself all this hassle.
 
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