wont shift reverse after water pump install

peter paul

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Jul 31, 2008
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hi i have a 82 470 mercruiser i had overheating problem and went and replaced the water pump. before i started it was running fine adjusted timing but it was overheating back it to the lot and removed tghe outdrive replced water pump first i shifted to forward to removed it. after every thing i went to turn on found the shifter notstraight in neutral and wont go to reverse engine crank but wont start. did i do something wrong in the outdrive or is it in the engine like timming it seems when i crank it want to start but it gives up. ok I had overheating problem all this time cleaned out heatexchanger new thermostac checked all hoses back flush the last thing was the pump found it destroy not wont start or shift, pleaase where do i go from hear..
 

stang32

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

it is an alpa 1 gen 1 right? when you split the case to replace the pump, you did not line up the shaft withthe shifter correctly. the drive shouuld be in forward & then the top of the shaft extension will be straight on. most likely this is the issue.
 

peter paul

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Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

it is an alpa 1 gen 1 right? when you split the case to replace the pump, you did not line up the shaft withthe shifter correctly. the drive shouuld be in forward & then the top of the shaft extension will be straight on. most likely this is the issue.

yes i was thinking of that same problem but i needed advise thank you. now if i shift my shifter to forward remove the drive how do i know my drive is in forward gear i dont want to make the second mistake and i will check the washer that every one talk about leaving it out it wont shift. do you have pic that would show me my drive is in the wright position. and would that make my engine not to start it crank but wont start.
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

I am going to have to copy this someplace, but here goes:
Only two possibilities:
If the control moves freely back and forth WOT forward to wot Reverse, you probably lost the washer that goes under the intermediate shift shaft and it has dropped down and not engaging the coupler on the bottom of the upper shift shaft.

If the control is jammed and you are stuck in gear the gearhousing was in reverse and not forward when you put it together and the i ss is off a spline. Fix: drop the lower rotate the lower ss (small splined shaft in front) all the way clockwise (forward gear) and rotate the prop CCW until it locks and hold tension with a bungee to keep it locked in forward. Make sure the control is in forward and the bottom of the upper shift shaft is pointed straight ahead. Bolt it back together making sure the i ss washer is in place and the top of the i ss is pointed straight ahead. You should be good to go.
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jul 31, 2008
Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

I am going to have to copy this someplace, but here goes:
Only two possibilities:
If the control moves freely back and forth WOT forward to wot Reverse, you probably lost the washer that goes under the intermediate shift shaft and it has dropped down and not engaging the coupler on the bottom of the upper shift shaft.

If the control is jammed and you are stuck in gear the gearhousing was in reverse and not forward when you put it together and the i ss is off a spline. Fix: drop the lower rotate the lower ss (small splined shaft in front) all the way clockwise (forward gear) and rotate the prop CCW until it locks and hold tension with a bungee to keep it locked in forward. Make sure the control is in forward and the bottom of the upper shift shaft is pointed straight ahead. Bolt it back together making sure the i ss washer is in place and the top of the i ss is pointed straight ahead. You should be good to go.
sound very clear to me i will do that and look for that washer. now my other problem is if the outdrive is not align to the shifter will that make it not to start.
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

The outdrive will not affect the starting.

Just another quick couple of questions: did you have the entire outdrive off? Does the shifter move freely back and forth? What gear is it stuck in? To determine which gear it is in rotate the prop CCW if it locks you are in Forward, if it locks Clockwise it is in reverse. If the shifter moves freely back and forth, the shift slide at the end of the cable may be disconnected from the upper shift shaft arm. Different fix. Let me know what you find.
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

The outdrive will not affect the starting.

Just another quick couple of questions: did you have the entire outdrive off? Does the shifter move freely back and forth? What gear is it stuck in? To determine which gear it is in rotate the prop CCW if it locks you are in Forward, if it locks Clockwise it is in reverse. If the shifter moves freely back and forth, the shift slide at the end of the cable may be disconnected from the upper shift shaft arm. Different fix. Let me know what you find.
first i removed the complete outdrive well it dont go in reverse disconnected the shifter it goes back and forward cant be the cable the only thing i remember was when i assemble it not install i turn the the prop and it was locking one way and then it was kind of not locking the way it lock before did not pay to much attention. so you saying shifter forward the prop should lock counter clockwise. looking at the shifter shaft i remember it only turn right and nuetral but not left. thats what i remember im a rooky at boats
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

OK it sounds like your shift slide. With the control handle in forward is it in forward gear (lock CCW) or reverse (lock CW)? If it is in forward it is likely the shift slide.
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

OK it sounds like your shift slide. With the control handle in forward is it in forward gear (lock CCW) or reverse (lock CW)? If it is in forward it is likely the shift slide.
ok a little cofuse here how do a fix the problem all i know is to remove the outdrive leeving the shifter in forward and what next i dont want to mess up again i appreciated your help
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

OK there is a shift slide at the end of the shift cable. looks like this http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&h...dsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:21,s:0,i:140&tx=107&ty=44 There is a little wheel on the underside of the upper shift shaft lever that fits between the two arms of the slide. If you are stuck in gear and the control handle moves freely back and forth, that little wheel has probably slipped out from between the arms, so when you try to shift it will move the lever one way but not the other. What you would need to do is slide the outdrive back and reposition the wheel between the slide arms.
 

peter paul

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

OK there is a shift slide at the end of the shift cable. looks like this http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&h...dsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:21,s:0,i:140&tx=107&ty=44 There is a little wheel on the underside of the upper shift shaft lever that fits between the two arms of the slide. If you are stuck in gear and the control handle moves freely back and forth, that little wheel has probably slipped out from between the arms, so when you try to shift it will move the lever one way but not the other. What you would need to do is slide the outdrive back and reposition the wheel between the slide arms.
k im going to do that wright now any other item i should be concern by the way happy father day
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

OK there is a shift slide at the end of the shift cable. looks like this http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&h...dsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:21,s:0,i:140&tx=107&ty=44 There is a little wheel on the underside of the upper shift shaft lever that fits between the two arms of the slide. If you are stuck in gear and the control handle moves freely back and forth, that little wheel has probably slipped out from between the arms, so when you try to shift it will move the lever one way but not the other. What you would need to do is slide the outdrive back and reposition the wheel between the slide arms.
 

peter paul

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

k im going to do that wright now any other item i should be concern by the way happy father day

if the roller is in possition would i have to take the outdrive to manualy shift the out drive and see if my washer is there
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

I just wrote this up, should explain what can go wrong. Good luck.

There are generally only three things that will go wrong with the shifting of an Alpha I after a impeller installation: The shift slide is disconnected, the intermediate shift shaft is “off a spline”, or the washer between the intermediate and lower shift shafts is missing. If you only dropped the gearhousing, it is one of the latter two.

The first thing to do is figure out what is wrong. Did you take the entire outdrive off or just drop the lower? Does the control move freely back and forth WOT forward to WOT reverse, or does it jam when you pull it back toward reverse? Is it stuck in gear? Which gear is it stuck in (if the prop locks when you rotate it counterclockwise it is in forward, locks clockwise it is in reverse)? The answers to those questions will tell what is wrong.

If you removed the entire outdrive and it is stuck in gear and the shifter moves freely back and forth maybe a little binding near wot then either you are missing the intermediate shift shaft washer (see below) or your shift slide at the end of the shift cable has come disconnected from the upper shift shaft lever. Take a look underneath the fore part of the outdrive (trim it up a little to see) to make sure the intermediate ss and the upper ss are firmly locked together. If they are the problem is probably the shift slide. This is what it looks like: http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&h...dsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:21,s:0,i:140&tx=107&ty=44 There are two little arms on the shift slide that capture a small wheel on the underside of the upper shift shaft lever. When you shift to forward the slide moves back rotating the lever clockwise. If the wheel is not between the arms, the aft arm will push the lever, but when you shift to reverse and the slide moves forward and since the wheel is not between the arms there is nothing to pull it back (rotate CCW) and you stay in forward. Fix: Place control in forward, hold the gearhousing by CCW pressure with a bungee on the prop, Slide the outdrive back and reposition the wheel between the shift slide arms, bolt back together.

If you did not remove the entire outdrive and the shifter moves freely back and forth and it does not shift, or stays in one gear it is likely that you lost (or it is bent) the 1” stainless steel washer that goes under the intermediate shift shaft and allowed the top of the I shift shaft to drop down out of the coupler on the bottom of the upper shift shaft. To check take a look. The top of the intermediate ss should be solidly locked into the bottom of the upper ss.

If you did not remove the entire outdrive and the control handle jams when you pull it back and it is stuck in reverse, then the gearhousing was in reverse when you put it back together rather than forward and the intermediate shift shaft went onto the lower shift shaft “off a spline”.

Fix: drop the lower, rotate the lower ss (small splined shaft in front) all the way clockwise (forward gear), make sure the washer is in place, rotate the prop CCW until it locks and hold tension with a bungee to keep it locked in forward. Make sure the control is in forward and the bottom of the upper shift shaft is pointed straight and the top of the i ss is pointed straight ahead. If you need to turn the verticle driveshaft a little to get the splines to line up, turn the prop CCW only. Make sure the little quad ring is in place in the oil passage. Bolt it back together.
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

if the roller is in possition would i have to take the outdrive to manualy shift the out drive and see if my washer is there

You should be able to see if the washer is there just by looking under the forward part of the outdrive to see if the intermediate and upper shift shafts are correctly linked like in Ziggy's photo http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&h...w=152&start=0&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0,i:78 If it is correctly linked it is probably the slide.
 

stonyloam

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Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

You still need to determine which gear you actually are in by turning the prop. Just because you can't pull the control handle back does not mean that you are not ALREADY IN REVERSE. You need to turn the prop to see. If you can pull the handle all the way into reverse and it stays in forward it is either the slide or washer.
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jul 31, 2008
Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

You still need to determine which gear you actually are in by turning the prop. Just because you can't pull the control handle back does not mean that you are not ALREADY IN REVERSE. You need to turn the prop to see. If you can pull the handle all the way into reverse and it stays in forward it is either the slide or washer.
Well I removed the out drive and washer is there. Shifter is in the forward position. But the prop spins both ways. But if hold the shaft where the washer goes and spin the prop it locks is that the way is assemble
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

Well I removed the out drive and washer is there. Shifter is in the forward position. But the prop spins both ways. But if hold the shaft where the washer goes and spin the prop it locks is that the way is assemble

well i just install the out drive holding the prop ccw locking it andtop piece lining water pump and gears and shifter straight tighten. and jump on boat to see if it goes into shift first it didnt i tryed adjusting the cable so many times and finally i got it forward shift locks ccw neutral prop turn both ways reverse locks up clockwise is that correct. if this is correct thank for your help guiding me
 

peter paul

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jul 31, 2008
Messages
114
Re: wont shift reverse after water pump install

It is correct.
im thinking is correct i lined up the shaft and the shifter was forward and i just turn the barrel in the shifter cable till i get forward and reverse and neutral it doesnot bind now i guest i will truely know it when i get a hose and try to start it. ( THAT ANOTHER THING IT DONT START GOT TO GO TO BASIC FUEL, IGNITIONCOPRESSION) WHAT I DONT UNDERSTAND IS IT WAS STARTING ON AND OFF SO MANY TIME NOW I PUSH IN THE LOT REPLACE WATER PUMP AND WENT TO START NO START. IM CONFUSE WITH THAT.
 
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