DTS mystery alarm

[Haycack]

Hello Everyone!
My boat is a 09 Sanger V215 with a Black Scorpion 350 DTS SN: 1A091459
The problem started out last year when I was cruising at 30-40mph for a few minutes. A continuous alarm/horn sounded and the throttle was totally cut. I put it in neutral, horn stopped, all the gauges were good so I took back off like nothing happened. the problem has slowly gotten worse. last week we took the boat out and could hardly get over 15 mph without it sounding the horn and cutting the throttle. still all the gauges are fine and nothing displayed on the monitor. it just doesnt make sense to me that if its bad enough to fully cut the throttle, it would go away once in neutral and not show anything on the monitor. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Bryan

 

[Bt Doctur]

Transmission oil low,contaminated?

 

[Haycack]

Transmission oil low,contaminated?

Tranny fluid is full and spotless.
But that gets me thinking... I had to replace the sea water pressure sensor last month due to it being plugged up, its located in the trans cooler. maybe the cooler is plugged and the trans is overheating. not sure if theres a temp sensor on the trans though?

 

[Bt Doctur]

There are 2 types of transmissions listed , what 1 is yours

 

[Haycack]

ZF 45 C

 

[Bt Doctur]

has 2 pressure transducers and a temp switch

 

[Haycack]

Ok, I guess I will flush out the cooler and the trans and see if it makes a difference! Thank you!

 

[Fun Times]

All the gauges are fine and nothing displayed on the monitor. it just doesn't make sense to me that if its bad enough to fully cut the throttle, it would go away once in neutral and not show anything on the monitor.

Depending on actual problem, Certain symptoms are designed to operate the way you describe which is once guardian mode is activated it will reduce available power percentage anywhere from 90% down to near idle RPM (5ish %). Once you bring the throttle back to near neutral gear position (idle RPM) the system will sometimes allow you to slowly advance throttle RPM but won't allow you to go past a certain RPM/throttle position that the system believes to be unsafe for the engine yet-in-turn allow you to still be able to operate the boat slowly out of harms way if needed vs turning of the engine completely.....Though I've heard of some engines shutting off/dying and experienced it once myself...It's really not designed to do so of course outside of should a problem becomes so severe as to where the engine mechanical components are being compromised then something will eventually have to seize up.

Being you have mercruiser digital throttle body design, the throttle body is electronically controlled. Should a problem be detected, it's supposed to smoothly lower engine power by electronically closing the throttle body even if you have the throttle handle in a higher open position...The non DTS system reduces power by changing injector and ignition operation which could be more noticeable sort-of acting like a rev-limiter once you try to pass the guardian limit.

What sorta monitor do you have that might help tell what fault code you may be experiencing...Smart-Craft Or?

Bear in mind that if you happen to have analog style gauges at the helm, then there are two separate types of sensors for each of the basic gauges we typically monitor such as the engine temp & oil pressure....One set of sensors are for the gauges while the other set of sensors are a digital read sensor for the ECM to monitor. So if one sensor becomes out of electrical resistance range for whatever reason true or false, the other sensor may not pick up on the issue.

If you're going to be working on your own engine of this caliber, though pricey you may want to consider looking into getting one of the MerCruiser Marine Scan Tool features/programs available... Just be sure you find the right diagnostic link connector "adaptor" for your newer engine model. You could call and buy directly from the following company if interested. http://www.rinda.com/marine/marine.htm#merctool

Hope it's simple, good luck.

 

[Haycack]

Fun Times,
Thanks for the reply. All my gauges and monitor are smartcraft. I will look into one of those scan tools. Thanks

 

[Haycack]

I pulled the trans cooler and it's spotless inside, so I'm guessing that's not the problem. I did find out though that you aren't supposed to screw the dip stick in to check the trans fluid. Turns out it is just below the low Mark. I'm going to add some fluid to it and take it out on the water to see. Is there anything else I should possibly check before I take it out?
Thanks,
Bryan

 

[Haycack]

Ok, so some good news and some bad. I took the boat out, still getting the alarm. The good news, it finally gave a code. It says, stbd sys fault 47. Tried a quick Google search, no luck. Hoping you guys can help me out.
Thanks,
Bryan

 

[Fun Times]

Engine Fault 47 says EST (Electronic Spark Timing) # 3 Open Circuit. Symtoms,: Igntion fault. Signal from ECM to ignition driver module open.Detcectable only at zero RPM...
Possible root cause: Wiring problum..Coil problem.
EST 1 - 8 Electronic Spark Trigger signal to the ignition coil driver circuit.

Being DTS: If this fault code should happen to be for mercruiser's Command Module typically found up under the helm area then unfortunately you are going to need a skilled mercruiser tech that knows the dealer only mercruiser CDS scan tool system to find a command fault code # 47 meaning and possibly repair the system should it exist as the latest model book I happen to have only shows as high as fault code 34 for the DTS command Module. They may have added more codes since this book model year was made but not 100% sure anymore....Still most likely it will be an engine fault code but thought you still need to be aware of the possible differences.

 

[Haycack]

Thanks for the reply!
I'll also add that it seems to be more sensitive to load. Yesterday while we were out with just two of us in the boat, we didn't have any issues for about an hour. I put about 2000lbs of ballast in and just about right away got the alarm. Not sure if its just a coincidence or not?

 

[Fun Times]

Might not totally be a coincidence due to if you have an issue with your ignition system, sometimes it doesn't become completely noticeable until there is a heavier load on the engine such as for some boats running right around 2000 RPM not quite on plane causing a heavy load which in turn sometimes helps show any engine misfire type situations the best.

Or you're experiencing heavier vibrations causing a loose wire to lose contact somewhere on the engine wiring harness which might help explain an open fault code circuit....Just guessing is all here.

Prior to the alarm starting on that one trip last year, did you have any type of work done on the engine that may have needed someone to shuffle engine item accessories/wiring around? Water pump impeller perhaps?
All battery cables are clean and tight on both ends?

 

[Haycack]

I went through the entire motor harness, checked all grounds and connection. Couldn't find anything loose. Checked all the plug wires, found some really nasty "gunk" in the coil wire boot, I'm assuming it was at one point dielectric grease, cleaned that up and applied new grease. Pulled the distributor cap and found quite a bit of build up on all the contacts, cleaned that the best I could with a little sand paper. Took the boat out yesterday and had the same issue. I hate just changing parts but I think I might try a new coil, cap and rotor?

 

[ataft]

Any progress on this issue? I have a Sanger V237 and I've been scratching my head over this stbd sys fault 47 since last year as well...

I do a lot of surfing and mine would happen when listed to the port side. The greater the list, the quicker it would happen. Surfing starboard wouldn't cause the issue.

 

[Haycack]

That's interesting. Mine typically does it at speeds over 20mph, very seldom did it happen while surfing. Now that it's gotten worse though, it does it at lower speeds also.

So a little bit of an update, things have gotten worse... I replaced the cap, rotor, coil and ICM a few days ago then took the boat out. I got a sys fault 44 after about a minute of cruising at about 3k rpm, the code immediately cleared. About 20 seconds after that I got the sys fault 47. Then about 2 minutes later got a sys fault 44 followed by a sys fault 78, they both immediately cleared. About 1 minute later I got a sys fault 78 again, this time it stayed active. The motor has a miss now that started the same time as the second sysfault 78.

 

[ataft]

My sys fault 47 was getting pretty bad a couple weeks ago as well... Been working with my mechanic to solve the issue, but as you're finding out, this can be an expensive job. I swapped out my impeller, had the air filter cleaned, oil changed, and things have definitely improved... But I still got the alarm twice this weekend. Both times happened after I was driving slow for long periods of time, and then hit the gas, putting load on the boat, to go off to another place on the lake.

I really don't know what to check next... Aside from this alarm, the boat is running great.

 

[Fun Times]

Are you sure it's fault code 78 ?? 78 is not listed in the old service manuals I have so it might be something new. 77 is a Cam Shaft issue while the number jumps to 80 for a Main Power Relay issue.

44, 47 48 is all ignition coil related.

 

[Haycack]

Yea, it's 78. It says injector malfunction, non critical, service engine soon. The 44 cleared too quick for me to fully read it. All i could read was "sys fault 44 overtemp". Not sure what's overtemp though...